You're not the first person to mention that. Didn't change before and it's been over a year since the numbering kerfuffle took place. Why would it change now?
Ncuti Gatwa is the 15th Doctor
- Thread starter StCoop
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You're not the first person to mention that. Didn't change before and it's been over a year since the numbering kerfuffle took place. Why would it change now?
Depends on the club. In some, they clearly only want younger folks. It wasn't difficult to notice at the time... but that depends on which ones one is going to. YMMV.
NuWho has often been so shallow that it's had to make everyone look "young and hip". Meanwhile, tv shows from the 1970s were saying "embrace and enjoy age". Especially the overt ones like "All in the Family". Amazing how far things have come since?
Which means, when 14 eventually dies, he will not regenerate, but basically disappear?
It’s an interesting question how that will look, cause his regeneration would still be linked to 15.
Basically 14 lives on borrowed time.
Maybe even not too dissimilar to how Clara hangs around now.
Does that mean 14 can choose when to go?
There's also the fact the thread starter isn't a premium member, so they can't edit the title beyond the edit time limit even if they wanted to. And no one has bothered to ask a moderator to change it.
I have long thought the costuming for ncuti is a bit all over the place (Which Capaldis sort of was too, albeit on a theme and not changing every episode as looks to be the case) and am just not sure ‘Kilt & Vest Rave Doctor’ is an action figure the world needed xD And that description feels a bit cut and paste from any of the NuWho Doctors. It is, as ever, going to come down to the writing — and hopefully they haven’t done themselves a disservice by shooting so far in advance that it is difficult to turn the ship if things aren’t working or gelling with audiences.
Mind you, with Disneys help maybe they can just CGI a standard costume on if it comes to it xD
That's never stopped them before.
You're free to disregard it, then, because it's purely RTD's own headcanon.
What makes you think this? I might have missed something but I didn't get that impression.
Alas, this isn't something I'm worried about. A joyful, exuberant Doctor can be fine. I do agree that the transition from burnt out 14 to 15 might not make the most sense and be a bit bumpy. But after 15's run starts, it could be fun.
After all, if 13 wasn't bothered by the Flux onscreen herself, why would 15?
Generally speaking, 10 didn't seem to have the old soul in a young body thing going on yet his run was a success. And that was one notable way that 14 differed from 10. Also, you can almost see the transition from 9 to 10 (old soul to more jubilant) mirroring 14 to 15.
Aside from Fifteen specifically crediting his good mood to Fourteen's retirement, there's Donna pointing out that Fifteen is older, which makes no sense if they were really split in two. I myself suspected the whole scene was left over from an earlier version of the episode without the bigeneration. I keep imagining the Toymaker lining up the artillery on the Fourteenth Doctor, there being a flash of light and a new figure appearing and shoving the Doctor out of the way to take the hit. The Toymaker shouts something about the Doctor cheating, and then the gun turns off, and we see the person who was shot is a visibly aged Fourteenth Doctor with a vortex manipulator on his wrist.
OLDER FOURTEENTH DOCTOR: [Catching his breath as he begins to glow] No cheating. You said... you'd play your next game... with the next Doctor. Well, here... I...
*Regeneration Effect*
FIFTEENTH DOCTOR: ...am!
And then some business later on with Fifteen giving the Manipulator to Kate and remarking that he's returning it from when he borrowed it later, well, not that one, the one she already has... never mind.
The thread title has regenerated.
Another clip from the Christmas special
The dialogue I quoted mainly ("I'm fine because you fixed yourself", which he has obviously not done yet), plus some things Russell said in behind the scenes material. It's clear to me that is the intention.
How else would you interpret it?
It is there in dialogue, but it’s muddied and rushed, and never expounded on enough to be clear. Two minutes of ‘I’m from the future of you. Of us.’ Or ‘It’s not time for you to go’ after they had a do over of ten’s original regen, fixing criticisms of it (this time it was fast, and had allonsy, instead of taking a month of touring and ‘I don’t want to go’) and addressing it in a real way with dialogue rather than what we got.
Even if ‘myths becoming real’ is something of a plan going forwards, this still needed a little more.
Even if ‘myths becoming real’ is something of a plan going forwards, this still needed a little more.
No more was needed.
"He's saying you need to stop" was the extra dialogue in that scene, and the intent was pretty clearly "Look Fourteen, settle down and get your head straight, so we're fine by the time you're me".
"He's saying you need to stop" was the extra dialogue in that scene, and the intent was pretty clearly "Look Fourteen, settle down and get your head straight, so we're fine by the time you're me".
More *was* needed, because he is already him as we have just been shown. If Ncuti had faded away at the end, because he was essentially a ‘watcher’ (which, frankly, he basically is — just like K’Anpo way back when) for example, then that stuff makes sense. As it is, we have two Doctors existing at the same time because of the biregeneration (which is a technically incorrect term… it’s more like regenerative mitosis) along with dialogue that strongly implies everything we have seen and are still seeing isn’t what’s happening, because we can infer that it actually happens later for fourteen. Except it just happened.
It needs a few more lines, and I strongly suspect based on leaks, dialogue, and even the presence of Mel (who could have helped explain the concept since it’s *exactly* how she came to travel with the Doctor — a time loop or paradox) that it originally *was* explained. Until RTD rushed the Tales into production (because he realised the anniversary specials had basically naff all anniversary linked content, and were just a mulligans of series 4 nuwho, a coda) and caught feels for Sylv and Co.
Multiple folk here got it just fine without any of that.
It "needs" nothing, unless the audience requires spoonfeeding.
It "needs" nothing, unless the audience requires spoonfeeding.
An earlier draft with 15 being pulled out of his timestream makes sense. But since that didn't happen, I just assumed since Time Lords are telepathic and "in many ways have the same mind" according to the 4th Doctor, 14's rehab somehow mentally stabilizes 15.
‘Accept’ ‘got’ and ‘found clear’ and ‘felt worked’ are all very different things. I got it. I just don’t think it was clear, or well done/explained.
edit:
Another example of unclear/contradictory or ‘drafting on the screen’ unrelated to the regen, is the fact that the toy makers *other* victims all came back, or at least Bairds assistant was shown as fine at the end — yet the unit soldiers did not, as shown in Kate’s dialogue. And the various stookies? Who knows. Some victims may have been babies by implication.
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