Looks like DS9 will not get Blu Ray

[SoM]

Your PS3 is probably upscaling them so you get faux HD reproduction.

Which isn't as good as HD, but probably looks better than DVD.

Welcome to be corrected, but AFAIK, the PS3 doesn't upscale DVD.

If you're watching on any non-CRT display, it's been upscaled. Doesn't matter whether it's done by the player or TV, since there isn't a huge difference between consumer equipment as a general rule. A professional, non-real time thing on uncompressed video would look better in the end, but TV vs. PS3 from DVD? Not unless one was notably below-standard.

[And, frankly, the biggest upgrade for TNG-R was not the increased notional resolution, but the fact that it was transferred/colour-timed/etc on modern equipment rather than Never The Same Colour twice stuff. A DVD of TNG-R S1 would still look MUCH better than an existing TNG S1 DVD.]

 

[Kor]

Personally I can tell no different in quality between a blue ray and a DVD.

Buy glasses! Quickly!

Yeah, if you have a 1080p HD TV, the difference is quite noticeable, IMO. I generally can't stand the way DVDs look on an HD TV; the edge haloing, pixelation, lack of color depth... Argh. So I try to buy all my movies and TV shows on blu ray if they are available in that format.

One time I got a BD/DVD combo and accidentally put in the DVD instead of the blu ray. For a couple minutes until I realized my mistake, I thought it was an extremely poorly mastered blu ray, and I was ready to throw it away.

Kor

 

[Squiggy]

At least in terms of America, it bears repeating: TOS is shown on one TV network nationally, and TNG is shown on one cable network nationally. Except for when SyFy gets a wild hair and runs a few of the movies one day, that is IT for Star Trek on TV here, and that's been the case since before the TNG Blu-rays came out.

TOS is not currently airing in the United States on the national level.

 

[BillJ]

At least in terms of America, it bears repeating: TOS is shown on one TV network nationally, and TNG is shown on one cable network nationally. Except for when SyFy gets a wild hair and runs a few of the movies one day, that is IT for Star Trek on TV here, and that's been the case since before the TNG Blu-rays came out.

TOS is not currently airing in the United States on the national level.

MeTV.

Saturdays at 9PM EST and Weekdays at 4PM EST.

http://metvnetwork.com/shows/star-trek

 

[Squiggy]

Oh, on a digital sub-channel.

Yeah. My point stands. You might as well put it out on ham-radio.

 

[BillJ]

Oh, on a digital sub-channel.

Yeah. My point stands. You might as well put it out on ham-radio.

I agree that not many people watch digital sub-channels. But, someone is paying to air TOS nationally.

 

[jaime]

Your PS3 is probably upscaling them so you get faux HD reproduction.

Which isn't as good as HD, but probably looks better than DVD.

Welcome to be corrected, but AFAIK, the PS3 doesn't upscale DVD.

If you're watching on any non-CRT display, it's been upscaled. Doesn't matter whether it's done by the player or TV, since there isn't a huge difference between consumer equipment as a general rule. A professional, non-real time thing on uncompressed video would look better in the end, but TV vs. PS3 from DVD? Not unless one was notably below-standard.

[And, frankly, the biggest upgrade for TNG-R was not the increased notional resolution, but the fact that it was transferred/colour-timed/etc on modern equipment rather than Never The Same Colour twice stuff. A DVD of TNG-R S1 would still look MUCH better than an existing TNG S1 DVD.]

Just to add, the ps3 does indeed do upscaling, and you can set it to three settings when playing a DVD. Off, normal (4:3) and full (stretched 16:9). My Sony tv also has its own stuff happening, but if you set it to motionflow, it's a very small jump between DVD and the HD remastered as I saw them on HD satellite tv.
That same setting also makes enterprise look more like previous trek. Which I find helped. Lol.

It also does a decent job making VHS look almost as good as DVD, though not necessarily using motionflow. Good for the TV cut of the motion picture, or if you are lucky enough to have an off air recording of family friendly edits to show younglings. (Klingon bailiffs you killed my son) I also like watching 90s adverts in there. It's like watching trek in its cultural context.

 

[BeatleJWOL]

At least in terms of America, it bears repeating: TOS is shown on one TV network nationally, and TNG is shown on one cable network nationally. Except for when SyFy gets a wild hair and runs a few of the movies one day, that is IT for Star Trek on TV here, and that's been the case since before the TNG Blu-rays came out.

TOS is not currently airing in the United States on the national level.

That makes it even worse then. Surely BBC America airing TNG at whenever-the-fuck-they-want o'clock (typically seems to be Tuesdays(?) and the occasional Sci-Fi Saturday) is not enough current airplay for HD rebroadcast to be a major concern. Should put any similar arguments about DS9 and VOY (which by the way currently air NOWHERE stateside) to bed.

 

[Lance]

1. They tried TNG. It didn't work.
2. That's great it airs all the time in Belgium. It doesn't here. That's all Hollywood cares about.
3. Making a show that hasn't aired in 10 years on even a shitty cable network available in HD isn't going to increase demand. Reality does not work that way. TNG's demand has been constant. Seinfield's demand has been constant. Law and Order's demand has been constant. The only people who care about DS9-HD are the dozen or so people wishing upon the farthest star that it's just around the corner.
4. Physical media is on the way out. The only way this would ever happen is that Netflix eats the costs. They're no stupid.
5. The only people from the project saying anything are all saying it's not happening.
6. CBS says "there are no plans."

What more do you people require? Roddenberry himself rising from the grave to tell you no?

In the long run, whether they are selling discs or streaming, shows will need to be in HD to get a large audience. It'll be like black and white.

CBS ran the numbers and found out that whatever meager audience bump they'd get from remastering a 20 year old show that had meager ratings to begin with wasn't worth the expense.

The show is done. CBS doesn't care about the audience.

I think Squiggy speaks the truth, harsh though it sounds.

The reality is that, for whatever critical reappraisal DS9 has gone through since it left the air, the show simply doesn't have the profile of TOS or TNG. And Voyager even less so. CBS doesn't make million dollar decisions based on whether a devoted loyal following will buy it or not; they do so based on whether they can sell the product in a mass market (and tbh, DS9 had been pretty thin on the ground for reruns even before the HD era). TNG's lack of massive sell-through evidently would have sent shockwaves through CBS as well.

There's no doubt that CBS ran the numbers on this, and came to the logical conclusion that it just isn't fiscally feasable.

 

[Amaris]

Personally I can tell no different in quality between a blue ray and a DVD.

Buy glasses! Quickly!

Yeah, if you have a 1080p HD TV, the difference is quite noticeable, IMO. I generally can't stand the way DVDs look on an HD TV; the edge haloing, pixelation, lack of color depth... Argh. So I try to buy all my movies and TV shows on blu ray if they are available in that format.

One time I got a BD/DVD combo and accidentally put in the DVD instead of the blu ray. For a couple minutes until I realized my mistake, I thought it was an extremely poorly mastered blu ray, and I was ready to throw it away.

Kor

Hell, I have a 720p HDTV, and the difference between Blu-ray and DVD is clear as night and day.

 

[SPCTRE]

I can tell no different in quality between a blue ray and a DVD.

 

[Reeborg]

Welcome to be corrected, but AFAIK, the PS3 doesn't upscale DVD.

If you're watching on any non-CRT display, it's been upscaled. Doesn't matter whether it's done by the player or TV, since there isn't a huge difference between consumer equipment as a general rule. A professional, non-real time thing on uncompressed video would look better in the end, but TV vs. PS3 from DVD? Not unless one was notably below-standard.

[And, frankly, the biggest upgrade for TNG-R was not the increased notional resolution, but the fact that it was transferred/colour-timed/etc on modern equipment rather than Never The Same Colour twice stuff. A DVD of TNG-R S1 would still look MUCH better than an existing TNG S1 DVD.]

Just to add, the ps3 does indeed do upscaling, and you can set it to three settings when playing a DVD. Off, normal (4:3) and full (stretched 16:9). My Sony tv also has its own stuff happening, but if you set it to motionflow, it's a very small jump between DVD and the HD remastered as I saw them on HD satellite tv.
That same setting also makes enterprise look more like previous trek. Which I find helped. Lol.

It also does a decent job making VHS look almost as good as DVD, though not necessarily using motionflow. Good for the TV cut of the motion picture, or if you are lucky enough to have an off air recording of family friendly edits to show younglings. (Klingon bailiffs you killed my son) I also like watching 90s adverts in there. It's like watching trek in its cultural context.

Ok, it makes VHS almost as good as DVD, and DVD almost as good as BD. That would mean it makes VHS almost as good as BD, too. I will have to keep my VHS tapes. They will probably work longer than the DVDs anyway.

 

[Squiggy]

VHS decays as well. The binders between the layers of the tape degrade and the Voyageresque sounding "magnetic remanence decay" makes recordings loose about 20% of the signal after 10-25 years. For those keeping score, if you haven't watched a tape from before 1990, you might have already missed your chance.

Blurays are good for now...but 4K is on the horizon, and it will be an honest replacement for HD, of which Blurays are the recorded medium for. The advantage of doing away with tapes/discs/blus/etc is that when resolution increases you don't have to go out and re-buy everything to take advantage of the enhanced clarity.

 

[Shaka Zulu]

Buy glasses! Quickly!

Yeah, if you have a 1080p HD TV, the difference is quite noticeable, IMO. I generally can't stand the way DVDs look on an HD TV; the edge haloing, pixelation, lack of color depth... Argh. So I try to buy all my movies and TV shows on blu ray if they are available in that format.

One time I got a BD/DVD combo and accidentally put in the DVD instead of the blu ray. For a couple minutes until I realized my mistake, I thought it was an extremely poorly mastered blu ray, and I was ready to throw it away.

Kor

Hell, I have a 720p HDTV, and the difference between Blu-ray and DVD is clear as night and day.

But only if you have a 720p HDTV-if all you have is a standard LCD set, it might not look that much different.

 

[dub]

DS9 and VGR...are less popular in streaming.

We have no way of knowing that for certain since streaming services don't currently release any details about viewing habits...

It's likely though isn't it, lets face it.

I wouldn't be so quick to say that. There are plenty of things you can say are "likely" at this point, but ANY facts about viewing habits on streaming apps are totally unknown right now. It's a completely different animal. Do viewers tend to look for the more obscure shows on streaming, or shows that are more readily available? Do viewers watch more HD programming than SD? Do streaming viewers prefer serial television series and shows that are more binge-worthy, or episodics? And what are the differences in viewing habits between series that are more serial and those that are more episodic? With streaming, you also have the benefit of not worrying about commercials, time slot changes, and you have the convenience of watching when you want and as often as you want. So we can get a much better picture of which episodes/seasons are most popular - which seasons are skipped, where viewers stop watching, etc. Not sure how many details we'll get, but all of those would be interesting to learn. And whether or not there are any surprises among the Trek series when it comes to streaming is completely up in the air.

The advantage of doing away with tapes/discs/blus/etc is that when resolution increases you don't have to go out and re-buy everything to take advantage of the enhanced clarity.

I acknowledge my ignorance about all of this up front...and I'm sure this is different for each country and region, but will bandwidth for broadcast have the ability to handle 4K in the near future? And aside from any hard copy of the media, will you truly be able to see a difference between 4K and HD when you watch via cable or streaming? I know in the US (at least with my provider) the signal is compressed for HD, so you see more artifacts from compression and signal issues than you would with a clean feed. I'm assuming the same would be true for 4K, and I'm wondering if the compression that will need to be done will undo the enhanced clarity from the clean feed (vs HD)?

 

[NeroShrimp]

Oh, well. If DS9 does not get off the ground with a Blu-ray release, so be it. I'm not going to like it any less or any more than I already do. I love Deep Space Nine and it is honestly my favorite series to watch. I can look past the grainy footage. But hey, at least we can see the station on Blu-ray through an episode of TNG.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gR7oewdXp7w

 

[Squiggy]

We have no way of knowing that for certain since streaming services don't currently release any details about viewing habits...

It's likely though isn't it, lets face it.

I wouldn't be so quick to say that. There are plenty of things you can say are "likely" at this point, but ANY facts about viewing habits on streaming apps are totally unknown right now. It's a completely different animal. Do viewers tend to look for the more obscure shows on streaming, or shows that are more readily available? Do viewers watch more HD programming than SD? Do streaming viewers prefer serial television series and shows that are more binge-worthy, or episodics? And what are the differences in viewing habits between series that are more serial and those that are more episodic? With streaming, you also have the benefit of not worrying about commercials, time slot changes, and you have the convenience of watching when you want and as often as you want. So we can get a much better picture of which episodes/seasons are most popular - which seasons are skipped, where viewers stop watching, etc. Not sure how many details we'll get, but all of those would be interesting to learn. And whether or not there are any surprises among the Trek series when it comes to streaming is completely up in the air.

The advantage of doing away with tapes/discs/blus/etc is that when resolution increases you don't have to go out and re-buy everything to take advantage of the enhanced clarity.

I acknowledge my ignorance about all of this up front...and I'm sure this is different for each country and region, but will bandwidth for broadcast have the ability to handle 4K in the near future? And aside from any hard copy of the media, will you truly be able to see a difference between 4K and HD when you watch via cable or streaming? I know in the US (at least with my provider) the signal is compressed for HD, so you see more artifacts from compression and signal issues than you would with a clean feed. I'm assuming the same would be true for 4K, and I'm wondering if the compression that will need to be done will undo the enhanced clarity from the clean feed (vs HD)?

To me, the difference between 4K and HD is the same difference as HD and SD, but ymmv.

4k needs about two or three times the bitrate. Current networks can handle the extra load, but that might have to re-kajigger things a bit.

 

[Shaka Zulu]

But getting back to the original question for a second, what CBS will also need to do with Blu-Ray sales is make sure that DS9 and Voyager Blu-Ray's get on brick-and-mortar store shelves, as I found here in Ontario for TNG, the sampler, Seasons 1, 2 and 3 and the TNG movies up to Unification could be found on physical store shelves, but then the later seasons were online only. And I haven't seen any TNG Blu-ray's on brick-and-mortar store shelves in probably a year. If CBS is expecting new viewers by Blu-Ray, they are doing a pretty poor job right now with confining the sales to online only. I haven't seen any of the older DVD sets in brick-and-mortar stores for years now. The other day I did see the new Captain Kirk DVD, but that was it. If CBS is expecting people to buy the Blu-Ray's here in Eastern Ontario on impulse, it's not going to happen.

Here in Southern Ontario (Toronto) for now I can get the DVD's at a certain brick and mortar chain's main superstore (heck, make that two brick and mortar stores) in downtown Toronto; maybe you need to make a visit to the South for a shopping trip to buy said DVD sets, or just buy said sets online.

 

[Amaris]

Yeah, if you have a 1080p HD TV, the difference is quite noticeable, IMO. I generally can't stand the way DVDs look on an HD TV; the edge haloing, pixelation, lack of color depth... Argh. So I try to buy all my movies and TV shows on blu ray if they are available in that format.

One time I got a BD/DVD combo and accidentally put in the DVD instead of the blu ray. For a couple minutes until I realized my mistake, I thought it was an extremely poorly mastered blu ray, and I was ready to throw it away.

Kor

Hell, I have a 720p HDTV, and the difference between Blu-ray and DVD is clear as night and day.

But only if you have a 720p HDTV-if all you have is a standard LCD set, it might not look that much different.

Buh? Standard LCD set? All LCD TVs display in high definition, unless you're talking about LCD EDTVs (Enhanced Definition TV), which came out in the mid-2000s, and didn't really sell well because LCD HDTVs went mainstream a few years later.

To clarify, what I said was that even with a 720p HDTV, which is the lowest HDTV resolution, you can still see the differences between blu-ray and DVD as being night and day. So I'm not quite sure what you're saying.

 

[USS KG5]

I wouldn't be so quick to say that. There are plenty of things you can say are "likely" at this point, but ANY facts about viewing habits on streaming apps are totally unknown right now.

I never disagreed with that, but it is "likely" enough to me to take it as read until the surprising possibilities become facts.

but will bandwidth for broadcast have the ability to handle 4K in the near future?

I can only speak for the UK, but I expect a handful of 4K channels would be straightforward for Virgin Media, a bit tougher for Sky, and at present basically impossible for freeview because it would need so much bandwidth.

For Netflix and Amazon its not too difficult either.

And aside from any hard copy of the media, will you truly be able to see a difference between 4K and HD when you watch via cable or streaming?

Even on a huge TV you would need to sit fairly close to see the difference. 4k is very much an incremental improvement.