Jake's Babylon 5 Watch

[JRoss]

So I'm currently working on watching all of Babylon 5. Bit of background, as a kid I saw the first episode, back when it was a TV movie, and while nobody else in my family was much impressed, I wanted to see more. We gave it a go for a few weeks, but I can't remember exactly what it was that made us stop. I seem to recall that my mom just didn't like SF in general and didn't want to lose us guys for another hour every week, and I was put off by the CG effects, which I felt were crude.

Over the last few years I kept hearing about how amazing B5 turned out to be, and hot it seems that JMS really got treated poorly by Paramount. Decided to give it a try. I want to create a post with my thoughts for each episode. I've just recently finished episode 13, Signs and Portents, and I was blown away. I keep thinking about how very "now" the show feels, minus the dated effects. I'll be back later with my thoughts on the premiere summarized.

 

[Idran]

Out of curiosity, when you say "all", does that mean you're also going to be hitting the various movies? Because some of them do fit before or during the run of the series, if you care about chronological order at all.

 

[MacLeod]

The TVM's can easily be watched after the series as they were more or less stand alone, but you would have to move at least one episode to last for chronological terms.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Over the last few years I kept hearing about how amazing B5 turned out to be, and hot it seems that JMS really got treated poorly by Paramount.

I think you mean Warner Brothers.

Early season 1 can be a struggle in places to get through. It does get better, especially when JMS takes over most of the writing. There are various recommended viewing orders if you google for them. Personally, I would advocate watching "In the Beginning" only after you have watched seasons 1-4. Views differ on this, of course.

 

[Romulan_spy]

Season 1 can put people off but it gets really good later on. Season 3 and 4 are the best IMO. There are so many amazing moments in the show, especially the scenes between G'Kar and Londo.

 

[Tom]

I have been doing a re-watch myself after not seeing these episodes since the 90's. I'm in Mid-season 5 currently. Being older now, I have better appreciation of the writing and character development in the show. In my view, season 4 is the best followed closely by 3, then 2, then 1, Season 5 is not the best because it was last minute add in. They thought they would not have a season 5, so they compressed the final 2 seasons arc into one season (4), then last minute, season 5 was greenlit by the studio, JMS had too come up with a couple new season arcs for 5.

My advice is stick with season 1 (as it sets an important foundation) then from season 2 onwards (till season 5 anyways) it gets better and better!

 

[Romulan_spy]

Season 5 is not the best because it was last minute add in. They thought they would not have a season 5, so they compressed the final 2 seasons arc into one season (4), then last minute, season 5 was greenlit by the studio, JMS had too come up with a couple new season arcs for 5.

The telepath arc was the low point in season 5 for me.

 

[Forbin]

I'll say one good thing about the telepath arc - Patricia Tallman got a lot of screen time. I love Pat.

 

[Richard Baker]

As Tom says above, I would recommend staying with the original season order. Babylon 5 is one large story arc with side currents and eddies. Season 1 does have some wince moments but it is a foundation upon all else is built.
The movies drop into different parts along the show's arc, I had no problem watching them after the series since I knew where they dove-tailed into the timeline.
After Babylon 5 and it's movies you then have 'Crusade' which was to have been a follow up series but abandoned mostly due to corporate tampering and 'Legend of the Rangers' which was a followup movie and a trail balloon for a new series which did not develop. The 'Lost Tails' miniseries is OK but has overly written dialog and while it takes place during Babylon 5's story arc it is painfully obvious they did not have sets or actors available to do what they wanted to do.

 

[RandyS]

Regarding the movies, I'd recommend watching "The Gathering" first since it is the pilot episode.

Usually, I'd recommend "In the Beginning" first but I'm not militant about that. I always watch it first, but I've seen the series all the way through six or seven times now so nothing is really spoiled for me anymore.

If it wasn't for Star Trek, Babylon 5 would be my favorite sci-fi franchise. Still, being number two isn't all that bad.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

After Babylon 5 and it's movies you then have 'Crusade' which was to have been a follow up series but abandoned mostly due to corporate tampering and 'Legend of the Rangers' which was a followup movie and a trail balloon for a new series which did not develop. The 'Lost Tails' miniseries is OK but has overly written dialog and while it takes place during Babylon 5's story arc it is painfully obvious they did not have sets or actors available to do what they wanted to do.

Crusade could have been great but what remains is pretty patchy in quality and shows the effect of network interference -- however, it's better than Andromeda or Enterprise from around the same time IMO. Had it run a full five seasons, it would have finished 12 years ago. It's certainly not must-watch TV and that also goes for A Call to Arms (effectively a prequel to Crusade), Legend of the Rangers and Lost Tales as well. A Call to Arms isn't bad -- it just doesn't really lead anywhere because Crusade had no resolution. Legend of the Rangers is just bad and Lost Tales is completely superfluous.

 

[Tom]

Usually, I'd recommend "In the Beginning" first but I'm not militant about that. I always watch it first, but I've seen the series all the way through six or seven times now so nothing is really spoiled for me anymore.

I would not recommend watching 'In the Beginning' first as it is much better and richer to enjoy and discover the revelations during the series first. Watching ITB kind of spoils that experience . I would watch all the TV movies after the series, then watch season one of crusade (even though it has no conclusion) last.

 

[JRoss]

Okay, a bit delayed in getting the post. Here are a few things. I meant Paramount, in that from what I've seen and heard I do believe that the studio (not necessarily the producers or writers) took some of JMS' ideas.

I did watch The Gathering first. I watched it the day it aired and I watched it again before I started the series proper.

Also, I want to talk about initial character thoughts.

Jeffrey Sinclair: For whatever reason I remember Michael O'Hare's character as seeming "weasely" and I'm not sure why. I remembered his voice being higher pitched. Odd. Anyway, I like his voice now. He comes across as somewhat, um, too dad-like and knowing, but I don't dislike him. While I didn't see any of the show after Mind War, I did see commercials all the time, so I know that Sinclair goes away and that we get Sheridan.

G'Kar: I like him. He's bombastic and aggressive yet quick to paint himself and his people as victims, perfect hawkish politician. Just a wee bit Snidely Whiplash during The Gathering, but I love his occasional fun moments, such as when he sends a rescue craft to follow Jeff's girlfriend after warning her about visiting a dangerous sector.

Londo: Peter Jurasik is as fun to watch as Andreas Katsulas. I hope the resolution between him and G'Kar is as satisfying as their interactions.

Garibaldi: Early on I could take him or leave him. I think that he doesn't serve much of a function at first because in literally the first three stories it's always Jeff sneaking up on the bad guy and getting into a firefight, when that seems more like the job of a security chief.

Delenn: Ooh, is she good, is she evil? I'm guessing good because of some things that I saw in ads for the show's later seasons.

Ivanova: I like the character well enough, but I'm a bit put off by Claudia Christian's acting. I don't know what it is exactly. Is she playing the reserved character too reservedly?

Vir: He's funny. I like that.

Lennier: When he gets screen time he's interesting. Seems willing to break ranks and might be a good ally for Sinclair. Seems that there's more to him than he lets on.

Na'Toth: She's angry and not funny. I don't like that.

Talia: Good so far. I liked the episode where Kosh and that cyborg mess with her.

Kosh: Interesting and mysterious. I want to see more, but I'm sure we'll get to him later.

Dr.Franklin: Competent, confident and imperfect. Just what I like in a doctor. Too bad they had to replace the guy from The Gathering with him, as it means that Franklin explicitly hasn't seen what's inside Kosh's suit.

 

[DonIago]

I'm doing a B5 rewatch with a friend for her first time. Just watched "Z'ha'dum" on Monday. Worth it.

Because I'm that kind of person, we're switching to an unrelated miniseries before starting season four.

Also, the announcement at http://b5books.com/ may be of interest.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

^Urgh, the Marcus Cole entry includes the quite well-known, very creepy final act, never filmed, that I've always found unworthy of his character -- perhaps he suffered brain damage in cryo that altered his personality. I know JMS has stated that it's canon but it's very distasteful to me. It puts me off wanting to acquire this book.

 

[DonIago]

Just because of one entry?

I really wish I could read the actual story about that. I mean, there are ways I can see it being creepy (and maybe it's supposed to be a bit creepy), but other ways I could see it being...not so bad.

 

[JRoss]

Thoughts on The Gathering:

Going back to this like 23 years after I saw it is jarring. I thought that I'd forgotten most of it, but I remembered more than I expected. Overall I like that we're given the setup of what appears to be a five-sided game of chess. I like the background mystery of what happened to Sinclair during the last battle of the war.

The universe presented is intriguing. There are human pirates (pirates don't always work for me in a SF setting unless they're explained well), and we've got psionic people, unfathomable alien biologies and more. The nicest-seeming alien ambassador (Delenn) has a dark secret, and that's cool.

At the end of it there doesn't seem to be a sense of an overriding purpose besides "cooperate". It's vaguely defined to me why we'll be wanting to come back, as the only real hooks are what's going on with Delenn what do Vorlons look like? The Minbari and Norn seem so preoccupied with one another that I'm not as compelled by them initially. Still, it was plotted well enough, once you factor in the requisite world-building, that I'm game for more.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Just because of one entry?

I really wish I could read the actual story about that. I mean, there are ways I can see it being creepy (and maybe it's supposed to be a bit creepy), but other ways I could see it being...not so bad.

Here you go: https://www.scribd.com/document/79027439/Babylon-5-Space-Time-the-Incurable-Romantic

Spoiler: Marcus Cole

Creating a clone of a woman who rejected him and priming it with her memories so he can contrive an accident to strand them both on an Eden-like planet, presumably where he'll have time to persuade her to have sex with him. If they have children, who are they going to mate with? It's more than a bit creepy; it's extremely creepy IMO. I don't see any redeeming qualities in the story or why it needed to be told. Of course, JMS also trashed Lennier's reputation somewhat. There was redemption for the character and it's more believable that he could have acted in that way.

However, I do admit it's a silly reason for not buying these books (or the online access) if you're a uber fan. Perhaps if the exchange rate were more favourable, I might be tempted. Damn you, Brexit!

 

[DonIago]

Oh, awesome. Thanks for the link!

Now I can actually have an informed opinion on the subject.

 

[Forbin]

Ivanova: I like the character well enough, but I'm a bit put off by Claudia Christian's acting. I don't know what it is exactly. Is she playing the reserved character too reservedly?

Yeah, Claudia played it way too stiff in the beginning. But everyone soon saw what a delightful, fun person she was IRL, and they let her be more herself after a while. She ends up with a lot of the humorous bits during the show.