Is Voyager Heavily Underrated?

[Hey Missy]

Season 1 and 2 were actually pretty strong to me, so what happened with Season 3? It was dreadful, and even had them under the threat of cancellation.

 

[Megadoomer]

It's sad how people are compelled to criticize virtually everything these days. Sure, there are strong & weak Voyager episodes along with strong and weak characters. Without the weak, how would you know what is strong by comparison?

I'm sure complaining about every little detail will help your cause. Try appreciating something in it's entirety instead. Or just stop watching it and watch what you like.

 

[HugeLobes]

I'm sure complaining about every little detail will help your cause. Try appreciating something in it's entirety instead. Or just stop watching it and watch what you like.

Seems like most people complain about Voyager in broad strokes rather than 'complaining about every little detail'. I kinda think it looks better close-up than it does as a whole.

Perhaps I don't spend enough time in this subforum, but if every conversation devolves into Voyager bashing, I could see why Voyager fans might think it is underrated.

As you said:

Underrated or not, I get the feeling that Voyager fans are more affected by an inferiority complex.

Again, I don't see many people coming out and saying everything in Voyager is bad. Feelings seem to revolve more around it not quite living up to its potential. VOY isn't the most underrated, it's just the most critically analyzed. I can see how this must be annoying for VOY fans, but again, I don't see many people just calling it trash and leaving it there.

 

[Discofan]

Voyager is my personal al favorite of all the ST series/franchises.

Janeway all day. It was fun to see Q torment Picard. Janeway, however, has the best exchanges with Q, my favorite character.
"Has anyone ever told you, you're angry when you're beautiful?" Single eyebrow rise.

I really like the Q character but I believe it's mostly due to the actor, that guy seems like he could sell pretty much anything.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Again, I don't see many people coming out and saying everything in Voyager is bad. Feelings seem to revolve more about not quite living up to its potential.

The question, though, is not whether or not it is good , but whether or not it is underrated. I guess anyone who thinks Voyager is bad would not say it is underrated. That said, the series can be either good or mediocre or disappointing yet still be underrated. It is a question about the series reputation, not simply its quality. When posters only come to talk about positives and negatives, and not the reputation, I think it does raise an issue of whethet or not people are dumping on Voyager.

 

[Discofan]

Also, Nemesis is one of the best ST episodes of all time. And who cares if anyone disagrees.
"Your fleet colors will get us all nullified."

Yeah, that's the improbable gibberish I was speaking about and it reminds me ironically of a line in Voyager: "Are your universal translators malfunctioning?"

 

[JirinPanthosa]

If Neelix had more episodes like Jetrel his character would have been more balanced. In seasons 2 and 3 his role seemed to be to yell at Kes any time she expressed friendship for another man. Then later he was mostly there to egg on Tuvok. He was a comic relief character who was only actually funny 10% of the time.

Time travel is another very overused theme in Voyager. And the hologram rights stuff was overdone and a rehash of Data.

 

[Discofan]

If Neelix had more episodes like Jetrel his character would have been more balanced. In seasons 2 and 3 his role seemed to be to yell at Kes any time she expressed friendship for another man. Then later he was mostly there to egg on Tuvok. He was a comic relief character who was only actually funny 10% of the time.

Time travel is another very overused theme in Voyager. And the hologram rights stuff was overdone and a rehash of Data.

Kes got her revenge though, she jilted Neelix like a pair of old socks... Ironically only a couple of months after she threw Tuvix in the woodchipper for allegedly getting her Neelix back.

That's some fickle bitch!

 

[jaime]

If Neelix had more episodes like Jetrel his character would have been more balanced. In seasons 2 and 3 his role seemed to be to yell at Kes any time she expressed friendship for another man. Then later he was mostly there to egg on Tuvok. He was a comic relief character who was only actually funny 10% of the time.

Time travel is another very overused theme in Voyager. And the hologram rights stuff was overdone and a rehash of Data.

Thing is, he did have more like Jetrel. The one where Tuvok is basically mind wiped and regresses really shows Neelix regard for Tuvok. Or the one where he finds no afterlife according to his beliefs. It all kind of adds up, and before you know it, the irritating fur ball just isn’t there anymore, and perhaps he never was. It’s something I got more of on the rewatch. By the time Tuvok does his dance, there’s been serious character growth of the type people seem to say didn’t happen...it did, it just didn’t keep reminding you it did, so people tend to forget it.

 

[Discofan]

Thing is, he did have more like Jetrel. The one where Tuvok is basically mind wiped and regresses really shows Neelix regard for Tuvok. Or the one where he finds no afterlife according to his beliefs. It all kind of adds up, and before you know it, the irritating fur ball just isn’t there anymore, and perhaps he never was. It’s something I got more of on the rewatch. By the time Tuvok does his dance, there’s been serious character growth of the type people seem to say didn’t happen...it did, it just didn’t keep reminding you it did, so people tend to forget it.

Tuvok dancing the day Neelix left the ship is likely the least surprising event of the whole series. It wouldn't surprise me if Tuvok deliberately planted the seed in Neelix mind to get rid of him for good.

 

[Lance]

there’s been serious character growth of the type people seem to say didn’t happen...it did, it just didn’t keep reminding you it did, so people tend to forget it.

This is so true. Of Voyager and of TNG also. It's become almost annoying how often people accuse the shows of reset button syndrome, when truthfully they're just episodic, it shouldn't be mistaken for a lack of ongoing storylines or character growth. What there is is just more subtle. It rewards viewers for watching and paying close attention and connecting dots across a long time.

 

[Jayson1]

I drifted off like you, but my rewatch made me reevaluate it. It is much much better than its rep...and objectively, when I really think about it, may be better in many ways than TNG in certain areas. It has some real hard SF concepts, and some really strong characters and character interactions that are allowed to develop in ways the TNG crew wasn’t.

"Voyager" did have better characters overall than TNG. It even has a all-time great in the EMH. What it lacked was Patrick Stewart's greatness or a character that is truly unique in Data. Plus TNG had 3 years of Pillar and two years of Jeri Taylor. "Voyager" had two years of Pillar, two with Taylor,two with Braga and one with Biller. TNG I think had it better in this regard when it comes to writers.

Jason

 

[Megadoomer]

Yeah, that's the improbable gibberish I was speaking about and it reminds me ironically of a line in Voyager: "Are your universal translators malfunctioning?"

It's unfortunate diverse modes of speech are not appreciated. Perhaps try reading more. Maybe explore some of the classics. Or don't. The script alone for Nemesis was no doubt a challenge. There are many deeper, layered elements to this episode. Just one more example how Star Trek as a whole, and Voyage specifically, is so great.

 

[Megadoomer]

This is so true. Of Voyager and of TNG also. It's become almost annoying how often people accuse the shows of reset button syndrome, when truthfully they're just episodic, it shouldn't be mistaken for a lack of ongoing storylines or character growth. What there is is just more subtle. It rewards viewers for watching and paying close attention and connecting dots across a long time.

Well said.

 

[Discofan]

... Perhaps try reading more. Maybe explore some of the classics. Or don't. ...

Perhaps making insulting assumptions about a person's reading habits is not an acceptable way of arguing your case...

 

[Megadoomer]

Perhaps making insulting assumptions about a person's reading habits is not an acceptable way of arguing your case...

True. I regret making that comment. It was unwarranted and immature. I apologize for being disrespectful.

 

[Refuge]

The question, though, is not whether or not it is good , but whether or not it is underrated. I guess anyone who thinks Voyager is bad would not say it is underrated. That said, the series can be either good or mediocre or disappointing yet still be underrated. It is a question about the series reputation, not simply its quality. When posters only come to talk about positives and negatives, and not the reputation, I think it does raise an issue of whethet or not people are dumping on Voyager.

It's funny but I didn't think it was underrated because it went for seven seasons and has a reputation for being popular on Netflix.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

It's funny but I didn't think it was underrated because it went for seven seasons and has a reputation for being popular on Netflix.

Yes, that's important to note. I've always had the impression that the reputation of Voyager among the general audience is pretty high, and that most people would consider it among the best of Action-adventure tv in the 1990s. Only among hard core fans does it starts to lose out: TOS was the first, TNG was the megahit, DS9 did things differently, ENT rolled the dice--where does that leave Voyager? The one that did the same?

 

[cosmic mouse]

Yes, that's important to note. I've always had the impression that the reputation of Voyager among the general audience is pretty high, and that most people would consider it among the best of Action-adventure tv in the 1990s. Only among hard core fans does it starts to lose out: TOS was the first, TNG was the megahit, DS9 did things differently, ENT rolled the dice--where does that leave Voyager? The one that did the same?

This my general feeling as well, and I'd be a representative of the general audience that you refer to. When it gets compared to other Trek franchises by fans of Trek is when VOY seems to more commonly be denigrated. IDK, maybe it's considered a "guilty pleasure " among Trekkies? Or maybe I don't know what I'm talking about.
I just find it pleasurable.... with no associated guilt.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

IDK, maybe it's considered a "guilty pleasure " among Trekkies? Or maybe I don't know what I'm talking about.
I just find it pleasurable.... with no associated guilt.

I don't even think that is entirely fair. No, it wasn't nuBSG, but it also wasn't Gilligan's Island. Perhaps too many could be described as guilty pleasures, but some could have clever plots while others could have great emotional depth. I think there was a certain error in embracing TNG too closely rather than laboring to distinguish itself as a series.