How big was the Enterprise?

[F. King Daniel]

Or there are 2 shios. Cage/TOS around 290 m. Dsc/SNW around 440.

Two "actors" playing the same ship. That just happen to be different sizes.

Autists go mental.

 

[DSG2k]

But why stop there? All the early instalment weirdness of TOS can be retconned into similar alternate timelines: laughing Spock with mega brows, James R. Kirk (IIRC Peter David got there first), Space Seed in the 22nd Century, etc.

Embrace the multiverse!

No need.

Alternate universes ought to be a maneuver of last resort, not first resort. In this case, all of the data we have points to an alternate.

some of the new rows are too closely packed even for the "upscale", and some are just in places that we already knew there were decks, just not windows, therefore they are just having double stacked squarish windows in some spaces instead of tall slit windows like were added to the SNW E saucer rim :sip:

Assertions of double-rows on a single deck ought to be a maneuver of last resort, not first resort. Is there any reason why a Discoprise in the TOS style couldn't be even larger than the Discoprise? The Discoprise herself scaled to 515 meters against Discovery, after all.

 

[Daedalus]

I recently met the actor who played the original Constitution class, and I couldn't help but think "You're a lot taller in real life, aren't you?"

Lovely chap, very warm handshake.

 

[HotRod]

But in fairness, the idea that Nero's incursion created the Kelvin universe is just speculation on Spock's part in the first film. Much easier if it's a pre-existing alt-timeline that Nero's 'black hole' lead him and Prime Spock into.

Didn't both Wesley Crusher and Kovich/Daniels confirm that the Kelvin timeline was created by Nero and the Narada?

 

[Tomalak]

Didn't both Wesley Crusher and Kovich/Daniels confirm that the Kelvin timeline was created by Nero and the Narada?

Yes, that's right, it's been subsequently canonised.

 

[UssGlenn]

I recently met the actor who played the original Constitution class, and I couldn't help but think "You're a lot taller in real life, aren't you?"

Lovely chap, very warm handshake.

She's a greeter at the Air and Space Museum.

 

[DarthTimon]

Did I really read this whole thread? I need professional help.

You're Captain Zap Brannigan, do what you always do - yell for Kif!

 

[DarthTimon]

And size doesn't matter.

So my wife tells me!

 

[korblborp]

You're Captain Zap Brannigan, do what you always do - yell for Kif!

and drink some shampaggin

 

[DarthTimon]

and drink some shampaggin

'If we can hit that bullseye the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards: checkmate!'

 

[Takeru]

She's a greeter at the Air and Space Museum.

I thought she just hangs out there.

 

[knightgrace]

It gets too damned convoluted.

In TMP we were expected to believe this was the same ship as the TOS E barely three years after the end of TOS' 5yr. mission. It wasn't just the ship, but everything else in-universe that looked a lot more detailed and updated. It would have been easier to swallow if TMP had been set ten years later in sync with the actual real world time that had passed. But with the TMP refit we could rationalize that it wasn't just new parts and tech grafted onto the old ship but that it was a major refit/reconstruction. Note that the original idea for TMP was the E was to be an entirely new ship from the keel up, but it was decided (Roddenberry?) the ship would be a refit of the original.

I'll skip over all the continuity inconsistencies through the films and TNG-DS9-VOY-ENT. But particularly in ENT we see a universe that doesn't gel with TOS and particularly "The Cage." Yet the real whopper is the JJtrek films starting with ST09 where they're asserting it's still the Prime timeline and this is now what the TOS E actually looked like all along particularly in the Pike era. It's total bullshit. Why not just be honest and say it's a rebooted continuity totally separate from the original continuity? That said this seems to be the generally accepted take on the JJverse after all these years.

Now DiscoTrek comes along and they change everything again and insist this is what it's been all along. Fuck that. Just be honest and say you're rebooting it where you're cherry picking familiar names and references from what came before and doing your own thing--fine as it avoids pissing off a lot of original fans.

And now there's speculation/rumour they're considering "rebooting" TOS. What, again? From what I've seen DSC/SNW is a reboot of the TOS era so why not run with that? Hell, I still see ENT as a dishonest reboot of TOS.

For some of us you get to a point where it's too damn much, and not just regarding the ship. They're all over the map with this shit. So, as Lord Garth said, it's easier (and requiring a lot less mental gymnastics) to just accept TOS is its own thing and the rest is their own thing to do as they please. There are those of us who are going to ignore it anyway.

It's much worse than this.

The first four or five episodes of the the original series, have a completely different flavor. Their flavor is 'more' like Trek should have been. Why? LISTEN to the alternative monolog for Star Trek. This is Star Trek. The purpose decided upon, an exploration into the unknown. Yes, ships ha penetrated into this area, but they were, for the most part too slow to be effective and it would take too many to be practical to do so. But why now in the episode 'Where No Man Has Gone Before '? Because the immediate effect of breaking the time barrier was to investigate exactly what the new limitations actually were. So from 'The Cage ' to 'Where No Man Has Gone Before ', things "settled " down quite a bit.


At 6400c one could get away from it all. As opposed to 320c, which was once adequate, but no longer.

This implies that at first there were only twelve Constitution class Starships in existence.

This was adequate for most purposes, at first.

But they 'lost ' it.

 

[Firebird]

It's much worse than this.

The first four or five episodes of the the original series, have a completely different flavor. Their flavor is 'more' like Trek should have been. Why? LISTEN to the alternative monolog for Star Trek. This is Star Trek. The purpose decided upon, an exploration into the unknown. Yes, ships ha penetrated into this area, but they were, for the most part too slow to be effective and it would take too many to be practical to do so. But why now in the episode 'Where No Man Has Gone Before '? Because the immediate effect of breaking the time barrier was to investigate exactly what the new limitations actually were. So from 'The Cage ' to 'Where No Man Has Gone Before ', things "settled " down quite a bit.


At 6400c one could get away from it all. As opposed to 320c, which was once adequate, but no longer.

This implies that at first there were only twelve Constitution class Starships in existence.

This was adequate for most purposes, at first.

But they 'lost ' it.

What? TOS' formula was established firmly from the start, so what is functionally different about the show between The Corbomite Maneuver and later season 1 episodes like Balance of Terror or The Squire of Gothos?

 

[Forbin]

Now I must add "Bafflegab" to my vocabulary. Let's see if my scrabble partners accept it.

 

[Tomalak]

Now I must add "Bafflegab" to my vocabulary. Let's see if my scrabble partners accept it.

'Tis a common word, down our way!

 

[MarcKyle1964]

Are you saying the historical documents lied?

Thermians react with puzzlement.