I don't know. People in Westeros have such a generally low view of the Ironborn (fairly justified, for the most part) that I don't think they'd have thought too much about it.
Spoilers Game of Thrones - Season 7
- Thread starter dahj
- Start date
It wasn't just that. There was multiple instances of it being referred to as socially abhorrent, unnatural and disgusting. All the worse because it resulted in offspring. Also recall the reaction to Craster's daughter-wives.
The Targaryens got away with it because they were the Targaryens. Good luck arguing taboo with a hungry dragon. For most people in Westeros, a sibling union or cross-generational incest is probably generally considered just as repulsive is it is in most of the real world.
Cousins and second or third cousins is probably more permissible and common in peasants and nobles alike. The former mostly in rural areas and due to small villages being fairly isolated and thus not much new blood comes though from one generation to the next and the latter of course because of the practical realities of houses that marry into each other for political alliance multiple times of the course of centuries.
But brother and sister, parent and child or Uncle/Aunt and Niece/Nephew? There are very few cultures that tolerate that for very long.
I saw a video on YouTube describing the deleted scenes of Season 7, and one of them dealt with Gilly reading from a book called 'Legends of the Long Night' while she and Sam were still in Oldtown. Gilly said that Craster got drunk one night when a baby boy was born and said "Time to meet your brothers", and she said that the older sister-wives in camp would call the White Walker's "Craster's sons." Gilly then wondered if the White Walker Sam killed several seasons ago was in fact one of her brothers.
That doesn't really give a definitive answer on the age-acceleration thing, since if it was only the oldest sister-wives who knew the truth this implies that Craster has been doing this for decades and the WW "Generals" may in fact be the same age and had undergone the same rate of growth as their normal adult human counterparts. Although, the very idea of a White Walker nursery with young White Walkers running around playing on the ice monkey bars and slides, resurrecting dead pets, and practicing their ice javelin technique seems strange, and I'd rather just imagine the babies did age rapidly into evil ice monster adulthood using some form of ancient magic.
Also, the shit in the chamber pot, puke while cleaning the chamber pot, and then pour shit-looking stew into a pot scene with Sam at the Citadel was supposed to go on for several more minutes than it eventually did, so we can be thankful they cut that one down significantly.
Cersei probably just trusted Euron of the Magic Fleet's ability to improvise on the spot and come up with a convincing looking reason to supposedly bail on their alliance. She had to have some idea of the broadstrokes of what Jon and Daenerys were bringing to her, and so she just told him to wait until they made their presentation and find a believabe excuse to tuck tail and run.
If things had not turned out like she expected, I'd figure that that bit of theater with Euron attacking Theon at the beginning of the summit, while completely in keeping with Euron's dickishness, was staged so that she could give Euron the harsh rebuke to sit down and shut up or leave, all just to establish that their alliance was tenuous at best. If the trick with the wight didn't work as planned, Euron would further drive a wedge between them (possibly by threatening Theon or Tyrion) that would make Cersei threaten him and he'd say "Fuck this, I'm not fighting for you." Thus giving him another convincing reason to abandon the alliance.
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Strange perhaps, but suddenly I find myself imagining an animated kids show about the silly antics of White Walker babies. Cue the Muppet Babies theme song.
Not considered incestuous
Not considered incestuous
Considered incestuous
Considered incestuous but ultimately accepted, or at least ignored
Potentially not considered incestuous depending on whether or not there's a new High Septon installed
Potentially not considered incestuous depending on the culture of the Wildlings
Likely not considered incestuous to anyone other than the High Sparrow and his followers, all of whom are now dead
Bran could have known that Sansa was going to come to him. Yes, damn Doctor Manhattan.
I will be disappointed if the following comes true, but I (and others) have already predicted events thus far...
Jon gets the Night King off the dragon and is fighting in hand to hand combat. He is apparently dead (Jon) until he slays the NK thus saving the day probably at the expense of his own life.
Walker Babies, we make our nightmares come trueStrange perhaps, but suddenly I find myself imagining an animated kids show about the silly antics of White Walker babies. Cue the Muppet Babies theme song.
Walker Babies, we'll do the same for you
When the weather's kinda bleak because you bring the storm there
Just close your eyes and raise your arms and new undead friends will appear
Wight Lord of Bones: I like adventure
Wight Karsi: I like romance
Wight Giant: The fuck you looking at!?
Crastor XIII: Bear necromance!
Crastor XVI: Why can't I have a dragon?
Night King: I fly through the skies
Crastor IX: All my skin is saggin'
Wight Three-Eyed Raven: And I have three blue eyes
Wight Summer the Dire Wolf: Where's my three wolf t-shirt money?
Wight Hodor: Hodor Hodor Hodor Hodor!
Wight Nanny: Is everything all right in here?
All: Yes, Nanny.
Walker Babies, we make prophecy come true
Walker Babies, Winter is coming for you
Walker Walker Walker Walker
Babies Babies Babies Babies
Make screams come true.
As an aside, I was thinking that it might be amusing if instead of hanging on to the Seven Kingdoms, Cersei just got Euron to ferry her over to Essos and with the combination of the Golden Company and the Ironborne Fleet, carve out a new empire of her own from the territories and city-states previously conquered by Daenerys, just as a big old F.U. to Dany. I don't think it's anything that's actually going to happen on the show, I just thought it would be kind of funny if they pulled a trading places and ended up in a stalemate.
I'd watch the hell out of that!
Well, that would go along with Martin's theme of going against fantasy tropes. But yeah, I don't see that happening either. Cersei barely acknowledges that there is a world beyond Westeros, and when she does, it's foreign sluts this and foreign usurpers that.
Regarding Jon's parents, I expect Bran to reveal the information to him in private (though he had no qualms telling Sam about it) and Jon not to tell anyone else. But Dany and Stark kids will somehow find out.
The subject of Jon's resurrection will come up again. He dismissed it when Dany asked about it but now she has seen the scars on his chest.
I hope Davos, Bronn & the Hound to survive as long as possible as they bring some much needed humor to the show. I probably should include Tormund, who hopefully survived the zombie dragon attack.
The subject of Jon's resurrection will come up again. He dismissed it when Dany asked about it but now she has seen the scars on his chest.
I hope Davos, Bronn & the Hound to survive as long as possible as they bring some much needed humor to the show. I probably should include Tormund, who hopefully survived the zombie dragon attack.
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My take away from that scene between Sam and Bran was that Bran is still very fallible. He has the sight but he is not yet all knowing. This could be a huge vulnerability leading into the battle with the Night King next season.
I am curious if they can raise anyone south of the Wall. The Wall itself held magical properties keeping them at bay, but I'm not sure if the lands south of the Wall hold similar attributes, irrespective of any ancient influences that might remain from the Children of the Forest. If not, and they can still raise people, then Cersei made an immense strategic error, thinking she would sit out the northern war, waiting for the armies to grind each other down into nothing and finish them off. If the NK wins, all he needs to do is raise up the northern army's dead (and everyone else they kill along the way down south) to replace and increase their numbers, which will wipe out the comparatively small Lannister forces.
All this talk about "soft incest"... cousins, aunt/nephew, uncle/niece, etc...
You know, a very long way back in human civilization, these kinds of couplings took place. In many regions, there wasn't much of a population so there wasn't a lot of choice! I think Martin intended to do this for historical significance.
You know, a very long way back in human civilization, these kinds of couplings took place. In many regions, there wasn't much of a population so there wasn't a lot of choice! I think Martin intended to do this for historical significance.
Even though Jon doesn't technically know this for sure, I think the fact that Jon told Cersei that becoming a wight was the fate of everyone south of the Wall if they didn't all immediately band together signals the showrunner's intent that anyone south of the wall can be turned too.
If they had a magical prohibition on turning southern folk into wights, I don't think they would have mentioned that as their inevitable fate once the invasion comes.
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