Finally a Star Trek Horror

[Arpy]

I expect nothing of the sort. What bullshit.

That's one word for it.

I hated this episode. But I don't expect Trek to be cutting edge or cool. I expect it to entertain and tell interesting stories about semi-interesting characters. That's its purpose.

Copycatting isn't interesting. It's damn near the polar opposite. This was in some ways the show's most important episode. The climax of the season's baddie storyline, and the show's shot at showing us what it could do, what it was about. And they offered a rehash of another franchise.

Again, as a fan of the show, as someone excited about it for months before it premiered, and then even more so after it dared in the climax of the premier to speak to us today about what we were/are currently going through, after that daring and brilliance, it was very disappointing.

And ignorant of what "Arena" and the Gorn were all about. About not judging others by their appearances, about us being the monsters. Sigh

A good little followup we got to TOS Gorn – btw for anyone interested – is the Trek comic Alien Spotlight: The Gorn. Again they bring back the monstrous Gorn and expectations of the hideous beasties are defied.

 

[fireproof78]

Again, as a fan of the show, as someone excited about it for months before it premiered, and then even more so after it dared in the climax of the premier to speak to us today about what we were/are currently going through, after that daring and brilliance, it was very disappointing.

I'm sorry to hear that. I just ignored it and moved on to a more interesting episode. Then gave up because Kirk.

I wish you all the luck with Season 2.

 

[Charles Phipps]

The fact that Trek feels any obligation or desire to do horror at all has always been my least favorite aspect of the franchise.

Glad someone likes it.

I didn't care for the episode but I think Star Trek has had horror from the very beginning.

 

[JoseNoodles]

My main criticism is that the alien ecology doesn't really make sense. Birth, reproduction, and birth again all in a matter of hours? I suppose if the babies just eat each other, they have a food source after birth but it's hard to see how they evolved to be an advanced spacefaring race with such odd child rearing practices. By the time they get back from the shops they'd be onto their fourth generation of inbred great grandchildren who have mostly eaten each other.

I'm beginning to think these SNW Gorn are a genetically modified breed that the "regular" Gorn use purely as cannon fodder. They work better as a bioweapon than as a traditional alien species. Regular Gorn could use them as a way to thin enemy ranks/create chaos while they come in for the final assault. If these SNW Gorn are so vicious and voracious that they consume each other, than so much the better, as it saves the regular Gorn from having to put them down after the battle.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I'm not really seeing the problem here. Even if the Gorn are that vicious as babies, obviously they must have some way to maintain social order, otherwise they would never survive long enough to build the Gorn Hegemony and operate an organized military space fleet.

So it would simply be that any Gorn that survive childhood must be strong and intelligent enough to safely coexist with each other as adults. Problem solved.

I mean it's like the Reavers from Firefly. They can't be mindless savages ALL the time, otherwise they wouldn't have a fleet either! Same story here.

 

[JoseNoodles]

I'm not really seeing the problem here. Even if the Gorn are that vicious as babies, obviously they must have some way to maintain social order, otherwise they would never survive long enough to build the Gorn Hegemony and operate an organized military space fleet.

So it would simply be that any Gorn that survive childhood must be strong and intelligent enough to safely coexist with each other as adults. Problem solved.

I mean it's like the Reavers from Firefly. They can't be mindless savages ALL the time, otherwise they wouldn't have a fleet either! Same story here.

The only thing is that most of the Gorn in the episode don't demonstrate any real sense of sentience or sapience. Even the last surviving one, which was the most matured, seemed like a mindless killer. They were good at hunting and killing, but that's not necessarily a sign of human level intelligence.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Well, the SNW Gorn are only babies.

Those few who survive to adulthood presumably DO have time to develop human level intelligence. Otherwise, by definition, they wouldn't have survived.

 

[JoseNoodles]

Well, the SNW Gorn are only babies.

Those few who survive to adulthood presumably DO have time to develop human level intelligence. Otherwise, by definition, they wouldn't have survived.

Babies who seem to mature rapidly in the span of few hours, yet never seem to develop the beginnings of higher-order thinking we typically see in children.

 

[fireproof78]

I didn't care for the episode but I think Star Trek has had horror from the very beginning.

Links to wikis don't usually work. But, yes, Star Trek has had elements of horror throughout its run. It is something that I find annoying as part of the franchise, if unavoidable. Some people enjoy it.

 

[Charles Phipps]

Links to wikis don't usually work. But, yes, Star Trek has had elements of horror throughout its run. It is something that I find annoying as part of the franchise, if unavoidable. Some people enjoy it.

It was the salt vampire.

 

[ChallengerHK]

As I recall, didn't Robert Bloch write three episodes? And again as I recall, all three of them were horror-esque/horror lite.

 

[fireproof78]

It was the salt vampire.

Eh, ok. Decently done. Exception to my rule.

 

[DEWLine]

As I recall, didn't Robert Bloch write three episodes? And again as I recall, all three of them were horror-esque/horror lite.

You remember correctly.

 

[Roundabout]

I suppose if the babies just eat each other, they have a food source after birth but it's hard to see how they evolved to be an advanced spacefaring race with such odd child rearing practices.

Good point.

If the Hudson character from the movie Aliens was around, he would have exclaimed: How could those things fly a spaceship, man? "They're animals!"

Yes, it is a bit hard to see how those vicious critters become a technologically advanced civilization, let alone fly spaceships. Whatever the case, I doubt we've seen the last of the Gorn. I can only speculate that more will be revealed about Gorn society in future episodes, which might provide some answers to this matter.

It was literally Alien.

"All Those Who Wander" was a wish come true for me, kinda.

I have seen TNG "Genesis" numerous times. Seeing the Worf monster hunt down Picard got me to wonder what a Star Trek / Alien crossover might look like. After all those years of wondering, I guess "All Those Who Wander" is as close to a Star Trek / Alien crossover that is possible.

However, I have to say that I should have been careful what I wished for. I wound up having mixed feelings about the episode. The episode had good pacing and it succeeded in delivering creepiness.

But significant elements of the story were eerily reminiscent of stuff that you could see in the Alien movies. Some of them were bordering on being ripoffs. Nevertheless, I was still able to get a thrill from watching ATWW.

As thrilling as ATWW is, I do hope that the writers, in the future, come up with horror stories that are more original than what we got in this episode.

-------

About the SNW season 2 trailer, the scene that really caught my attention, besides the one with the ridged head Klingon, was the one with the creepy crawly sneaking up behind that space suited crewman.

Can't wait to see what that is about.

 

[Uhura's Song]

Links to wikis don't usually work. But, yes, Star Trek has had elements of horror throughout its run. It is something that I find annoying as part of the franchise, if unavoidable. Some people enjoy it.

I enjoyed the episode. DISCO had a pretty horror-esque episode when the Tardigrade was loose on DISCOs sister ship in S1. That was a good one.

The zombie-Vulcans in Enterprise.

 

[Lord Hierarch]

Weren't these Gorn children?

*Looks at the gaggle of kids playing outside*

Then again....

*Looks at the goggle of parents chittering half away across the playground*

How old are Gorn before they become adults? When do they learn the alphabet, mathematics, science, combat, spaceship controls, etc...? We don't know. We don't know anything about the Gorn except when they're literally born killers, they are highly territorial even as adults, and are a shoot-first, ask questions never attitude to foreigners.

At least the Tholians don't give a fuck about you unless you are someplace or want something they want.

The Gorn will take what they want and kill you for the gag.


And Trek has done plenty of horror, but not the visceral horror. There's that creepy horror like Nagilum in the void of voids. The retrogressive creatures like the buggon that Worf turned into. Voyager's existental horror with its year of hell and Threshold. So on and so on.

But they didn't invoke any sense of horror in me half as much as these Gorn episodes.

 

[DonIago]

I thought the Borg were pretty visceral on those rare occasions when they'd actually show the assimilation process in detail.

The "Conspiracy" aliens, perhaps?

 

[El Maestro]

There's nothing new under the sun....I read a literary critic/scholar (can't remember who) a long time ago that said there's essentially like 6 story archetypes and we just keep telling them over and over again. Alien didn't invent the subgenre of horror it occupies and doesn't own the monopoly on it. I liked the episode not because of the horror elements but because it was interesting to see a different kind of antagonist in Trek. No mustache-twirling, just biology. I do appreciate this though:

And ignorant of what "Arena" and the Gorn were all about. About not judging others by their appearances, about us being the monsters.

SNW has earned some goodwill so I think it's ok to give them some room to experiment. Honestly, I found the episode with the sacrificed children much more disturbing....

 

[Morpheus 02]

I thought the Borg were pretty visceral on those rare occasions when they'd actually show the assimilation process in detail.

The "Conspiracy" aliens, perhaps?

For me... Definitely the Conspiracy aliens were more "original" Trek horror...


This just felt like an aliens/Predator ripoff (with the POV looking like predator).

The only :"shocking" thing woukd be the death of Hemmer, and the interaction with Uhura. While we knew she nor Spock would die... having new characters Definitely could make them susceptible to a surprise death

 

[Nerys Myk]

Star Trek has been "ripping things off" since 1964. Myths, Shakespeare, Westerns, other SF, its self...well, you name it.