Spoilers Canon, Continuity, and Pike's Accident

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Strange New Worlds' started by CorporalCaptain, May 19, 2023.

  1. Tallguy

    Tallguy Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    When you watched Star Trek: The Motion Picture or The Voyage Home was anyone really in suspense if EARTH would survive?
     
  2. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, it doesn't take a genius to figure out that even in the Kelvin Timeline movies Earth or the Federation would not be destroyed, because if they were how the hell would you continue the series after that? Likewise, the main TOS cast were obviously all safe because Main Character Plot Armor.

    Narrative conventions (which any Star Trek iteration rarely if ever deviates from) pretty much negates any real suspense these days. That's why it's important for shows and movies to be entertaining without relying on a sense of suspense.
     
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  3. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, I never watched Star Trek thinking Earth is actually going to be destroyed, or any of the main characters will not die.



    This idea that newer Trek lacks suspense because it's a prequel, or characters won't die. That strikes me as a standard that isn't actually applied except against nonpreferred Trek.
     
  4. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk A Spock and a smile Premium Member

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    I think if the writers/actors/etc are doing their job and the audience isn't too cynical there can be a sense of jeopardy and suspense when a character is in a dangerous situation.
     
  5. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Agreed, which is why I think it is a new standard used to smack down newer Trek iterations for not helping people feel like old Trek did.

    It's kind of like trying to identify "Why don't I like this?" and grasping on to whatever argument sounds good, rather than just owning the idea that a Trek production didn't work for the viewer.

    I think the Tholian Web is a prime example of good suspense because the actors are convinced of the loss of the captain.
     
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  6. NCC-73515

    NCC-73515 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    did anyone before 2009 ever think the whole planet vulcan is gonna be destroyed and spock's mom killed...?
     
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  7. blssdwlf

    blssdwlf Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Having the whole planet Vulcan destroyed and Spock's mom killed was not surprising or even suspenseful, IMHO. What caught me by surprise is that in almost all Star Trek time-travel episodes or movies the timeline change is undone at the end to restore the status quo. The 2009 Abrams movie didn't so yeah, it was a surprise. It would've been interesting to see with each new Abrams/Kelvin-verse movie another permanent change like one of the main characters permanently killed or the Enterprise destroyed and replaced by a ship of a different name. But that new found suspense went away with STID when Kirk got revived...
     
  8. JonnyQuest037

    JonnyQuest037 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I actually figured out that Vulcan was going to blow up before I saw the movie because I read a review that said that Spock faced "a Superman-like dilemma" in the film.

    People who try reference spoilers obliquely are never as clever as they think they are.
     
  9. Jedi Marso

    Jedi Marso Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It's easier to let go of the mental gymnastics and just accept the fact that this was a 1960's script written by WWII veterans and acted by their kids. In those days, women had their place and Trek was just being 'cutting edge' by having them there and talking about it at all.
     
  10. Rowdy Roddy McDowall

    Rowdy Roddy McDowall Commodore Rear Admiral

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    My major national newspaper had an unwelcome habit of flat-out revealing major spoilers of outstanding movies. Thanks to this, I knew Connery would die in THE UNTOUCHABLES even before the blasted film started.
     
  11. Set Harth

    Set Harth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I was spoiled for STID by someone who acted like they were hiding a spoiler by putting it in white-colored text against a gray background. :rolleyes:
     
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  12. Tallguy

    Tallguy Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I was spoiled for STID by it being transparently obvious that Cumberbatch was playing Khan even though Abrams repeatedly denied it.
     
  13. Set Harth

    Set Harth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I was holding out hope.
     
  14. Markonian

    Markonian Fleet Admiral Moderator

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    I was completely surprised when I watched it in cinema and he called himself Khan. Because the TrekMovie article on the movie said he wouldn’t be Khan.

    I enjoyed that feeling of surprise to much that I avoid trailers where possible if I intend to watch the series/movie.
     
  15. Tallguy

    Tallguy Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well, you have me there. :D
     
  16. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I was spoiled about it.

    And thoroughly enjoyed the film.
     
  17. Commander Troi

    Commander Troi Geek Grrl Premium Member

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    It was one of those, "oh God are they... seriously? Oh God, they are..." experiences. :sigh:
     
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  18. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Wasn't it confirmed the he wasn't originally written as Khan?

    I know in the shot footage everyone is actually saying John Ericssen, but they dubbed it over with John Harrison. John Ericssen was Khan's name in an early draft of Space Seed.

    According to John Eaves, Khan's prodiction-code name was April.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2023
  19. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk A Spock and a smile Premium Member

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    I think they went back and forth.
     
  20. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    They wrote two drafts, one with Khan and one without. So, they tried it, felt Khan fit, so changed it back.