DS9 on blu ray?

[benjaminh]

Since we already have four of the six pilots in HD, I'd like to at least have "Emissary" and "Caretaker" get HD facelifts.

Agreed.

One thing that strikes me is that both Emissary and Caretaker were big budget Star Trek movies, with money and care spent on them that matches or even exceeds something like, say, The Search for Spock.

These almost "lost" Trek movies deserve to be seen in HD.

There's a apparently quite a bit of deleted footage for both of these that ended up not on the cutting room floor, but in that salt mine in PA. Dreaming even more, it would be interesting to see some of that.

 

[Praetorian]

I think I'll be more surprised if we get DS9/Voyager on Blu-ray at all at this point.

I understand no imminent announcement doesn't necessarily preclude a release down the road - "sometime". However, we have to consider the Blu-ray format has progressed well into its life-cycle. If I were to take a guess, I'd conjecture Blu-ray is already 60 years old in human terms.

The window of opportunity for this particular format is not everlasting. Diminishing returns as time ticks by etc.

Blu-ray is secondary. Whether pressed on a disc, or available for streaming, what matters is the availability of the show in HD.

Also, only releasing a "best of" set is a bad idea, who's going to choose those "best" episodes? You risk alienating a lot of people and selling even less.

 

[benjaminh]

...
Blu-ray is secondary. Whether pressed on a disc, or available for streaming, what matters is the availability of the show in HD.

Also, only releasing a "best of" set is a bad idea, who's going to choose those "best" episodes? You risk alienating a lot of people and selling even less.

I don't think we have evidence that blu-ray is secondary. Because Trek fans are so avid, and are willing to pay cold hard cash for a top-quality product, I think the revues from blu-ray are quite significant at this point. In the long run, streaming might become more important, even much more important, but it's not clear that we are there yet.

Yes, we all want it in HD. That's not the question. It's how we get there. It seems that CBS is getting cold feet when looking at the massive cost of redoing all seven seasons of DS9.

Most fans want all of it in HD. But what if that's not possible?

As Grant says, some people who say all or nothing are not really expecting nothing. But what if, in fact, that's the most likely scenario at this point?

And I actually think most fans of DS9 would be pretty much in agreement when it came to the best 70 or so episodes.

Looking over the list by "Bolty" on blu-ray.com (who might be Grant here?) I agreed with everything on the list. I only thought of one more to add so far, but otherwise it seemed spot on.

Grant, if you are Bolty, would you be willing to post the list?

 

[LOKAI of CHERON]

I think I'll be more surprised if we get DS9/Voyager on Blu-ray at all at this point.

I understand no imminent announcement doesn't necessarily preclude a release down the road - "sometime". However, we have to consider the Blu-ray format has progressed well into its life-cycle. If I were to take a guess, I'd conjecture Blu-ray is already 60 years old in human terms.

The window of opportunity for this particular format is not everlasting. Diminishing returns as time ticks by etc.

Blu-ray is secondary. Whether pressed on a disc, or available for streaming, what matters is the availability of the show in HD.

Yes, I understand that.

I didn't say there's no possibility of an HD version becoming available via an alternate format. The title of this thread is "DS9 on blu ray?" - thus, my response was reference DS9 on Blu-ray. I thought the wording of my post was quite explicit.

Personally, I want to own DS9 on disc in HD - presented at optimal quality. Streaming/downloading isn't an option I'd choose as they are currently offered.

 

[Robert Comsol]

So I'd love a best of set.

Better something than nothing, you made your point clear, and essentially I sympathize because it could also have the character of an apetizer for others, create additional DVD or digital streaming revenue.

BUT

the biggest obstacle, as fas as I understand, are the logistics behind it. For TNG-R they moved literal truckloads with film cans and it was a nightmare just to get it sorted out. The cans need to be cataloged, filed and sometimes double-checked to see if an element missing (remember the originally missing "Sins of the Father" footage?) had been stored somewhere else.

So just to get the footage for the 78 best episodes or something like that would probably require a complete and costly inventory check. By the time they'd be done, it would probably make more economical sense just to release all seasons of DS9-R on Blu-ray.

Bob

 

[benjaminh]

....So just to get the footage for the 78 best episodes or something like that would probably require a complete and costly inventory check. By the time they'd be done, it would probably make more economical sense just to release all seasons of DS9-R on Blu-ray.

Bob

I think the biggest costs are not finding the film, although those are significant, but in the actual rebuilding of the episodes piece by piece, including re-compositing and recreating the FX.

If we can get all of it rebuilt: great. I'm all for it. That's just not quite looking like what the tea leaves are telling us at this point....

 

[Salinga]

I think VOY and DS9 are going to be converted to HD, but its going to be the cheaper/quicker treatment like XFiles got, with the special effect shots upscaled - maybe a compromise of green screen footage in HD but the green screen parts replaced by upscaled SD parts.

So DS9 and VOY get a compromise treatment: Partly HD, but not fully.

 

[Salinga]

I think CBS was trying to fool people because the episode is definitely on the Blu-Ray in 480i. There is no upconversion present.

I don't know what else to tell you, Tom. I copied the first chapter of the file to my hard drive and played it in VLC Player. The video is 1920x1080i... and all screencaps taken from it are also 1920x1080. It doesn't matter what the behavior is you're seeing on your PS3 and display, the video is most definitely upconverted. Do what I did yourself and you will see (you should have done that before you altered the memory-alpha article). The discs are all identical.

lol, we have a wiki war over 1080 or 480:
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/TOS_Season_2_Blu-ray?action=history

cur | prev) 15:28, May 31, 2014‎ Igor871 (Talk | contribs)‎ m . . (4,307 bytes) (-2)‎ . . (Undo revision 1626053 - Unless you have a source, stop reverting change. I have a source: http://trekmovie.com/2009/09/21/review-star-trek-tos-season-2-blu-ray/) (undo)
(cur | prev) 12:52, May 31, 2014‎ Tomswift2002 (Talk | contribs)‎ . . (4,309 bytes) (+2)‎ . . (Undo revision 1625949 by Igor871 (talk)) (undo)

 

[Maxwell Everett]

But the process of what they are doing is an assembly line and it looks like they're shutting down that assembly line.

CBS waited three years between TOS-R and TNG-R. Some of the same people worked on both projects. Let's not be too cynical about this. We're swinging from over-enthusiasm to a tweet to utter despair at any chance of seeing DS9 on blu-ray. These companies thrive on their libraries of content and their ability to re-sell them over and over. Give it time. Only reason based on what you know to be true.

Here's what we know to be true: currently there's no green light for DS9. That's it.

The status of the "assembly line" as Grant describes is obviously affected by DS9's lack of green light. Very shortly CBS Digital will wrap TNG. If they don't have a big project to take on afterwards then there are obviously consequences to that.

Meaning they are likely to lay off the extra people they hired to work on TNG, I get that, and honestly, that blows! I feel for those people. Look at what's happening with Sony ImageWorks -- they're closing shop in California and moving to Vancouver to take advantage of tax credits! A good portion of their 300 or so employees are going to be let go!

Hopefully the key players at CBS Digital will still remain there. In any case, it would be a very shortsighted move by the executives at CBS (considering the money they generate as a corporation) and will cost them more in the long run. I sincerely hope they don't do that, of course.

Thanks for keeping us apprised.

 

[benjaminh]

Is it possible an email campaign would help? Does anyone have the address for CBS home video's Star Trek Dept.?

 

[Maxwell Everett]

Is it possible an email campaign would help? Does anyone have the address for CBS home video's Star Trek Dept.?

Unfortunately, I don't think so. The only campaign that CBS would respond to is the one that's already in place: TNG on Blu-ray. They've told us again and again, "Buy, buy, buy!" That said, if you would like to contact someone at CBS Home Entertainment you can go here.

 

[otomo]

Is it possible an email campaign would help? Does anyone have the address for CBS home video's Star Trek Dept.?

Unfortunately, I don't think so. The only campaign that CBS would respond to is the one that's already in place: TNG on Blu-ray. They've told us again and again, "Buy, buy, buy!" That said, if you would like to contact someone at CBS Home Entertainment you can go here.

Is there any word on how those are doing? Cuz gosh I want this show done with the TNG treatment (it's so beautiful!) more than any other....

 

[Maxwell Everett]

Is it possible an email campaign would help? Does anyone have the address for CBS home video's Star Trek Dept.?

Unfortunately, I don't think so. The only campaign that CBS would respond to is the one that's already in place: TNG on Blu-ray. They've told us again and again, "Buy, buy, buy!" That said, if you would like to contact someone at CBS Home Entertainment you can go here.

Is there any word on how those are doing? Cuz gosh I want this show done with the TNG treatment (it's so beautiful!) more than any other....

Here's a partial list of how the opening weeks break down/were reported (I posted this on blu-ray.com about three months ago):

Season One: 95,435 units / $5,730,000
Season Two: no available data
Season Three: 15,921 units / $955,101*
Best of Both Worlds: 15,608 units / $233,964*
Season Four: 10,441 units / $626,356*
Redemption: 7,212 units / $108,108*
Season Five: no available data
Unification: no available data

*These are my derived figures. No sales chart was published for the week ending May 5th, 2013, but we know that S3 sold 6.62 units for every 100 of Silver Linings Playbook. That movie sold 240,500 units. 6.62% of 240,500 is 15,921. I did the same with G.I. Joe: Retaliation which sold 538,218 units during the week S4 came out. S4 sold 1.94 units for every 100 of G.I. Joe: Retaliation, so that's 10,441.

So if we add up just these available figures we get $7.7 million. Again that's without data for S2 & S5. If we assume those seasons did roughly what S4 did, that takes us to about $9 million. And again, these are only opening week figures in the U.S. and do not take into account worldwide figures or subsequent weeks of sales or the digital downloads sold on iTunes.

 

[Jefferies]

So if we add up just these available figures we get $7.7 million. Again that's without data for S2 & S5. If we assume those seasons did roughly what S4 did, that takes us to about $9 million. And again, these are only opening week figures in the U.S. and do not take into account worldwide figures or subsequent weeks of sales or the digital downloads sold on iTunes.

If these numbers have any reality then I don't see what the problem is. From what I have heard the whole project cost around $9 million in the first place. Here we have figures telling us they made that money back just from the opening week sales of each season.

So there was a huge drop off in sales following season 1. Maybe that came as a disappointment to CBS that this wouldn't be the miracle cash cow they had hoped for. But hey, its still making good money if this is anything to go by and this will make money for some time to come surely? Is this a matter of unrealistic expectations on the side of CBS?

 

[benjaminh]

Is it possible an email campaign would help? Does anyone have the address for CBS home video's Star Trek Dept.?

Unfortunately, I don't think so. The only campaign that CBS would respond to is the one that's already in place: TNG on Blu-ray. They've told us again and again, "Buy, buy, buy!" That said, if you would like to contact someone at CBS Home Entertainment you can go here.

Just for the heck of it I sent this off today to CBS home video exec Leslie Ryan:


"Subject: Star Trek: Deep Space Nine—wanted on blu-ray

Dear Leslie Ryan,

Everyone in my family enjoys watching Star Trek. The various Star Trek shows are, in fact, our favorite TV programs. We've purchased all of the blu-rays for the original Star Trek and for The Next Generation as soon as they were released. As you know, the picture and sound quality are incredible. It's like watching these shows again for the first time. And the bonus features and documentaries are also a lot of fun. Since we have kids in our family, we appreciate that Star Trek can be enjoyed by everyone.

We are also fans of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine (as well as Voyager), and have been looking forward to the announcement that these shows too are going to be rebuilt and remastered for blu-ray. We are obviously voting with our wallets by buying Star Trek: The Next Generation on blu-ray the day each season is released. Is there hope for Deep Space Nine to come to blu-ray too?

Best wishes and thanks,"

 

[otomo]

Those numbers are a bit concerning, but as you said they're only 1st week so who knows. Shocking that everyone rushed for season 1 and not 3-4 which I think would sell the best.

 

[jimbotron]

There was a boost in sales for season 1 due to the novelty, I guess. These shows cater to a niche market. 10,000 units sold in the first week for subsequent seasons doesn't sound like a lot, but considering it's a $60 box set for 1/7 of a TV show, it's pretty good.

I know for a fact there are people who plan on buying them, but won't until all 7 seasons are available and packaged together.

Look at TOS. Priced now at $60, and it will still do decent sales, many years after release.

 

[LOKAI of CHERON]

There was a boost in sales for season 1 due to the novelty, I guess. These shows cater to a niche market. 10,000 units sold in the first week for subsequent seasons doesn't sound like a lot, but considering it's a $60 box set for 1/7 of a TV show, it's pretty good.

I know for a fact there are people who plan on buying them, but won't until all 7 seasons are available and packaged together.

Look at TOS. Priced now at $60, and it will still do decent sales, many years after release.

Yes, I know a couple of fans waiting for a TNG bundle. Their self-restraint is laudable - I certainly wouldn't be able to resist!

 

[benjaminh]

There was a boost in sales for season 1 due to the novelty, I guess. These shows cater to a niche market. 10,000 units sold in the first week for subsequent seasons doesn't sound like a lot, but considering it's a $60 box set for 1/7 of a TV show, it's pretty good.

I know for a fact there are people who plan on buying them, but won't until all 7 seasons are available and packaged together.

Look at TOS. Priced now at $60, and it will still do decent sales, many years after release.

Yes, I know a couple of fans waiting for a TNG bundle. Their self-restraint is laudable - I certainly wouldn't be able to resist!

I'm not sure that's always restraint. It could also be:

a) not enough money
b) not a very intense fan

I think the majority of fans who have the intensity, as well as enough $, have been purchasing the sets.

It does slightly annoy me when people who are fans and have the money just don't bother to buy the sets, or wait for big sale (far below the $60 of release day). A few of these people are really glad Trek is going HD, but don't see the need for themselves to contribute, even a little bit.

 

[LOKAI of CHERON]

There was a boost in sales for season 1 due to the novelty, I guess. These shows cater to a niche market. 10,000 units sold in the first week for subsequent seasons doesn't sound like a lot, but considering it's a $60 box set for 1/7 of a TV show, it's pretty good.

I know for a fact there are people who plan on buying them, but won't until all 7 seasons are available and packaged together.

Look at TOS. Priced now at $60, and it will still do decent sales, many years after release.

Yes, I know a couple of fans waiting for a TNG bundle. Their self-restraint is laudable - I certainly wouldn't be able to resist!

I'm not sure that's always restraint. It could also be:

a) not enough money
b) not a very intense fan

I think the majority of fans who have the intensity, as well as enough $, have been purchasing the sets.

It does slightly annoy me when people who are fans and have the money just don't bother to buy the sets, or wait for big sale (far below the $60 of release day).

In the case of the people I know, it's probably "B" - they like TNG, but not fanatically!

I'm only annoyed at their financial far-sightedness - saving £'ssss while "day one" muggins here shells up the big money!