Not sure Nixon and JFK would be in play in a post WWII world where The Nazis win
Would make sense though I think for storytelling since people know who both of them are. I figure the first season could take place in 1962 were the space program is getting some real funding for the first time and NASA's progress is a big factor in the Presidential election happening in the background. The season ends with the Nazi's winning the battle to get to the moon first, but falling apart due to civil war due to the death of old Hitler.
I just stop reading right there.
There wouldn't be any more elections in the USA if the Axis won WWII, it would be a continuation of:
You'd have to flesh out what America's role is in this scenario. Is it a separate nation or a conquered nation? Did it sit out WWII or was it on the losing side? If it's conquered is there a puppet government running things? Was it untouched by the Axis forces? One reason America has the resources for the space program is it was largely unscathed by the war.
that probley would have happen on the amazon streaming tv show the man in the high castle
yup
From what I understand Nazi Germany would have not had the resources or willpower to conquer the United States even with a victory. My guesses things would have sort of played out with Nazi Germany being in a similar role as the Soviet Union did in our history.
A enemy that we are sort of in a cold war with as both sides try and interfere with smaller countries to spread our global influence and gain more control over the other. Not to mention get the oil.
I do wonder how things would have played out with Japan and China in this world. I also wonder what happens to the Nazi's when Hitler dies. in my scenario I had them breaking into a civil war but not sure if that would happen in real life.
A enemy that we are sort of in a cold war with as both sides try and interfere with smaller countries to spread our global influence and gain more control over the other. Not to mention get the oil.
I do wonder how things would have played out with Japan and China in this world. I also wonder what happens to the Nazi's when Hitler dies. in my scenario I had them breaking into a civil war but not sure if that would happen in real life.
Still need to know what form this defeated but not conquered America takes.
Great episode. Appreciated some of the first few seasons' wonder with the Titan landing. Hopefully this turns into a positive thing for Happy Valley.
I was bummed we started the episode with a jump of 6 months though. We go from one episode Dev saying Lock the Doors to the next episode trying to fill in the gaps of what happened in the last few months. Dev really is the villain of this season isn't he. That scene in the dome was so celebratory and then got total whiplash with the tone change. I was almost confused what was going on.
I was bummed we started the episode with a jump of 6 months though. We go from one episode Dev saying Lock the Doors to the next episode trying to fill in the gaps of what happened in the last few months. Dev really is the villain of this season isn't he. That scene in the dome was so celebratory and then got total whiplash with the tone change. I was almost confused what was going on.
Just watched Episodes 6 and 7 back-to-back. It's really painful watching this in real time, as opposed to the previous seasons where I binged it (twice) and went from one episode to the next. I wish I could put on the last three episodes of the season right now!
Glad to see Mars is managing to hang in there, Lee isn't boxed in anymore, and the Miles/Celia alliance is holding the civilian population together.
Gerardo wasn't as over-the-top as I was worried he was going to be. Thank God for that.
Shout out to North Korea (never thought I'd type words like that in general) for supporting Mars. At least for as long as they did.
Alex's birthday was a highlight. What happened immediately afterwards was a shocker that had me on the edge of my seat.
Dev has to face that he can't write the narrative on Mars, no matter how much he wants to.
Bragg is turning out to be just a standard, generic Reagan/Bush Era Republican. I thought there might be more to him, but he is what he is, and that's all he really needs to be for the purposes of this story.
Polavinov, on the other hand, I think they could go anywhere with him, as a Governor who's fallen out of power. But something tells me he won't survive the season.
To finish this off: the landing on Titan was epic. Kelly pointing out Ed's regret about not landing on the Moon with Apollo 10 was dead-on. I'm glad Mr. "By the Book" didn't get his way. He's the Captain Esteban of For All Mankind (minus the getting killed part).
Glad to see Mars is managing to hang in there, Lee isn't boxed in anymore, and the Miles/Celia alliance is holding the civilian population together.
Gerardo wasn't as over-the-top as I was worried he was going to be. Thank God for that.
Shout out to North Korea (never thought I'd type words like that in general) for supporting Mars. At least for as long as they did.
Alex's birthday was a highlight. What happened immediately afterwards was a shocker that had me on the edge of my seat.
Dev has to face that he can't write the narrative on Mars, no matter how much he wants to.
Bragg is turning out to be just a standard, generic Reagan/Bush Era Republican. I thought there might be more to him, but he is what he is, and that's all he really needs to be for the purposes of this story.
Polavinov, on the other hand, I think they could go anywhere with him, as a Governor who's fallen out of power. But something tells me he won't survive the season.
To finish this off: the landing on Titan was epic. Kelly pointing out Ed's regret about not landing on the Moon with Apollo 10 was dead-on. I'm glad Mr. "By the Book" didn't get his way. He's the Captain Esteban of For All Mankind (minus the getting killed part).
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Phenomenal episode. A powerful combination of triumph and tragedy, space exploration and civil upheaval.
For all of the conflicts this season and even in this episode, I loved how the episode opened with the Sojourner 1 crew holding solace and grace for the doomed Kosmos crew as their rushed mission burned up in Titan entry. In that moment, all societal and cultural rivalries melted away and their humanity stood strong together in that stark reminder that, despite all of their scientific achievements, space travel is still very dangerous. That moment mirrored the episode's conclusion as Sojourner 1's own risky entry united the broken factions of Hidden Valley, even if only temporarily.
This is when the show is at its absolute best. As much as I love a good Martian uprising, I will always prefer human exploration, especially space exploration. The season continues to strike exactly the right balance between the two but I'm eager to see the continuation of the Titan mission in the shadow of Martian discourse. Plus, nice callback to the embarrassing and fumbled First Steps on Mars with the Sojourner 1 crew deciding to step simultaneously on Titan as a team.
Even if that team is fractured. Because what Kelly did wasn't only dangerous for the unplanned approach and landing, she broke the chain of command. Undoubtedly Walt knows that he didn't actually screw up the flight plans and realizes what Kelly did. This will create a fracture in the crew which will destroy mission cohesion (just as Danny did for very different reasons). Yes, Kelly justifiably pulled an Ed but she still acted selfishly and there will be a cost.
Speaking of stubbornness and foolishness. Dev fucking Ayesa. I get why he ran to the Mars Peacekeepers and why he wanted to push back hard to reclaim control of his pet projects, but my fucking gods, man, look at a mirror. I knew he was going to do something horrible and I don't give a flying fuck that he thought the domes would be empty. Putting aside his goal to starve the Sons and Daughters of Mars, Yael's blood will forever be on his hands. At least Palmer had the decency to look genuinely ashen by their attack.
On a lighter note, I adored Lily's birthday present to Alex, even if it wasn't the gift he was expecting (silly boy).
In addition to flash mobs, this episode also brought references to Ferris Bueller and Kurt Vonnegut! Even though his earliest novels (including the eponymous debut) predates the show's divergent point, I can't help but wonder how Vonnegut's writing would've evolved with these vibrant space programs. What would he have found farcical about them and what would've fueled his cynicism?
For all of the conflicts this season and even in this episode, I loved how the episode opened with the Sojourner 1 crew holding solace and grace for the doomed Kosmos crew as their rushed mission burned up in Titan entry. In that moment, all societal and cultural rivalries melted away and their humanity stood strong together in that stark reminder that, despite all of their scientific achievements, space travel is still very dangerous. That moment mirrored the episode's conclusion as Sojourner 1's own risky entry united the broken factions of Hidden Valley, even if only temporarily.
This is when the show is at its absolute best. As much as I love a good Martian uprising, I will always prefer human exploration, especially space exploration. The season continues to strike exactly the right balance between the two but I'm eager to see the continuation of the Titan mission in the shadow of Martian discourse. Plus, nice callback to the embarrassing and fumbled First Steps on Mars with the Sojourner 1 crew deciding to step simultaneously on Titan as a team.
Even if that team is fractured. Because what Kelly did wasn't only dangerous for the unplanned approach and landing, she broke the chain of command. Undoubtedly Walt knows that he didn't actually screw up the flight plans and realizes what Kelly did. This will create a fracture in the crew which will destroy mission cohesion (just as Danny did for very different reasons). Yes, Kelly justifiably pulled an Ed but she still acted selfishly and there will be a cost.
Speaking of stubbornness and foolishness. Dev fucking Ayesa. I get why he ran to the Mars Peacekeepers and why he wanted to push back hard to reclaim control of his pet projects, but my fucking gods, man, look at a mirror. I knew he was going to do something horrible and I don't give a flying fuck that he thought the domes would be empty. Putting aside his goal to starve the Sons and Daughters of Mars, Yael's blood will forever be on his hands. At least Palmer had the decency to look genuinely ashen by their attack.
On a lighter note, I adored Lily's birthday present to Alex, even if it wasn't the gift he was expecting (silly boy).
In addition to flash mobs, this episode also brought references to Ferris Bueller and Kurt Vonnegut! Even though his earliest novels (including the eponymous debut) predates the show's divergent point, I can't help but wonder how Vonnegut's writing would've evolved with these vibrant space programs. What would he have found farcical about them and what would've fueled his cynicism?
At first, I didn't like the time jump because it felt jarring but it ultimately served multiple purposes. Not just jumping to Kosmos and Sorjourner1's arrival at Titan, but also to show the long-term repercussions of a dragged out stalemate between the M6 and the Sons and Daughters of Mars without burning episodes to get to this moment. Plus, this allows the Marines to arrive at Mars in time for the next stage of the conflict.
Perhaps with a longer season, we could've seen that build-up (not unlike Bablyon 5's fourth season) but I think it works better this way.
Right? Truly the alternate timeline!
I'm not surprised. With Margo and Dani (and Ellen) out of the narrative and Aleida on Mars, there's no reason for any kind of nuance from the president. All they need is a strongman to fight against Martian independence. One dimensional, yes, but he serves his purpose and that's all I need.
I am curious to see where his story arc will go now that his beloved leader forced his wife to denounce him (but least he as reassurances that he hasn't actually lost her). Perhaps he'll show his usefulness and loyalty to the Sons and Daughters of Mars when the time is right, much like Boyd did.
Small correction about the Kuragin mission, they didn't burn up on Titan but skipped off its atmosphere and they will crash on Saturn ( or be killed by the radiation as Kelly says), which to me is even more brutal because the Kosmos crew will see this coming knowing they have no way to prevent that. That was one hell of a way to start the episode.
I have not much to add to your post though as you routinely express about the same feelings i have to the episodes and it's getting annoying
I didn't have a Mars colony split on my bingo card though, i thought this episode would see the handling/resolving of the two camps on Mars but it seems there was a kind of stalemate as neither side was willing a full on battle yet. One thing did come to pass was that ISN nations supplied them for a while but have now pulled out because it led to a possible confrontation with M6 nations on Earth and they were not willing to go to war over Mars. Fair enough but even without the dome breach i don't see how Miles, the de facto Mars leader, can win strategically.
Marines are surely on their way by now even if the show didn't mention them as the focus was elsewhere but given all this episode revealed now the Martians are with their backs against the wall with no support from anyone and an incoming military force plus Dev's hostile group.
The Titan mission served to unite the Martians for a while, to give them a sense of accomplishment and identity but the fact remains they have food left for 2 weeks, possibly being extended by hard rationing to maybe 4-6 weeks ( and that means slightly above starvation) which creates an impossible situation for Mars.
Unless they find where the sheriff and Dev are, and get back the food and supplies they stole.Small correction about the Kuragin mission, they didn't burn up on Titan but skipped off its atmosphere and they will crash on Saturn ( or be killed by the radiation as Kelly says), which to me is even more brutal because the Kosmos crew will see this coming knowing they have no way to prevent that. That was one hell of a way to start the episode.
I have not much to add to your post though as you routinely express about the same feelings i have to the episodes and it's getting annoying
I didn't have a Mars colony split on my bingo card though, i thought this episode would see the handling/resolving of the two camps on Mars but it seems there was a kind of stalemate as neither side was willing a full on battle yet. One thing did come to pass was that ISN nations supplied them for a while but have now pulled out because it led to a possible confrontation with M6 nations on Earth and they were not willing to go to war over Mars. Fair enough but even without the dome breach i don't see how Miles, the de facto Mars leader, can win strategically.
Marines are surely on their way by now even if the show didn't mention them as the focus was elsewhere but given all this episode revealed now the Martians are with their backs against the wall with no support from anyone and an incoming military force plus Dev's hostile group.
The Titan mission served to unite the Martians for a while, to give them a sense of accomplishment and identity but the fact remains they have food left for 2 weeks, possibly being extended by hard rationing to maybe 4-6 weeks ( and that means slightly above starvation) which creates an impossible situation for Mars.
So if Episode 6 was Late July 2012, then we should now be in January 2013, then Bragg is less than a month away from leaving office. Given the Election would have been held smack bang in the middle of the Siege, either the M6 reaction to it has become bipartisan or the POTUS Elect is a Republican.
Bragg is probably counting on the Moon Marines arriving before he officially leaves office in order to cement his reputation. It only takes Unity a month to get to Mars from Earth so even allowing a slight delay for some training, the Marines should have arrived already.
And they're telegraphing Miles becoming the first President of the Martian Congressional Republic.
Also, Cardi B, Gangnam Style and Flash Mobs still exist in this Alternate 2013?
Bragg is probably counting on the Moon Marines arriving before he officially leaves office in order to cement his reputation. It only takes Unity a month to get to Mars from Earth so even allowing a slight delay for some training, the Marines should have arrived already.
And they're telegraphing Miles becoming the first President of the Martian Congressional Republic.
Also, Cardi B, Gangnam Style and Flash Mobs still exist in this Alternate 2013?
Oops, you're quite right. Thank you for that correction. Too many thoughts rattling in my head that I forgot that crucial detail.
Great minds and all that.I have not much to add to your post though as you routinely express about the same feelings i have to the episodes and it's getting annoying
You're probably right even if I stubbornly believed that they would be able to hold off long term to win public support. Dev's attack and the successful Titan landing might have helped their cause however.
Plus there's the blackmail that Palmer is holding over Miles which will inevitably come out one way or the other.
That or Dev's group returns the food supplies out of guilt for their attack. It's unlikely but it's possible.
They mentioned Flash Mobs in the opening montage (suggesting that they skipped over the World Wide Web and went straight to social networking, which is unfortunate). I caught Lee doing the Gangnam Style dance, too, I wonder what that says about relations between North and South Korea. On the other hand, I guess he hasn't been a North Korean national for a decade, so maybe it wouldn't be politically fraught to be caught on a phone camera doing the horsey dance.
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