SF DEBRIS: Well, thank you. I was short of things that make me wake up screaming. This should do for at least a week.
Why the hate for Alex Kurtzman?
- Thread starter HotRod
- Start date
Incidentally, that's the same YouTube channel I look up when I just want to watch one or two of the songs as opposed the entire episode.You know what this thread needs? A song to bring us all together as fans!
The technobabble got out of hand. Kinda even went against one of Gene's early instructions for TOS. 'Show, don't tell. Don't get bogged down on telling how something works. Matt Dillon on Gunsmoke doesn't explain how the revolver works. He just picks it up and uses it.'
Sure, TOS had some, but starting with TNG the babble became a trope.
It's even dumb when police procedurals go out of their way to explain to the audience how something works.
No the action is much more in WNMHGB. We get the initial scene on the bridge where they cross the barrier. Lot of explosions on the bridge, Gary and Dr Dehnar get zapped. The tense scenes as Garys power is growing and he is slowly gaining a god complex and going mad. Than of course we get the great Kirk Vs God Mitchell scene on the planet. The cage had a little excitement and some nice dialogue but WNMHGHB was on another level.
Pike's Kidnapping, including laser fire at the "elevator'
Pike testing the cell and yelling at the Talosians
Fight with the Kaylar
Big fricking laser blasts the mountainside
Pike burns in Hell
Pike assaults the Keeper/Gorilla
Pike threatens the Keeper with laser.
The fight with the kaylar was not nearly on the level of the kirk vs god mitchell. Pike tests the cell? Come on man.
Other things in WNMHGB. Gary zapping kirk and Spock, Gray testing the force field in his cell(a lot cooler than the cage test), gary strsngking Kelso with his mind etc. Just a overall better pilot.
Man all this talk I really need to rewatch both of these episodes. Trek at its finest.
Action is action. Not saying the Mitchell fight isn't more epic, it is.The fight with the kaylar was not nearly on the level of the kirk vs god mitchell. Pike tests the cell? Come on man.
Other things in WNMHGB. Gary zapping kirk and Spock, Gray testing the force field in his cell(a lot cooler than the cage test), gary strsngking Kelso with his mind etc. Just a overall better pilot.
Man all this talk I really need to rewatch both of these episodes. Trek at its finest.
The action of "THE CAGE" and "WHERE NO MAN HAS GONE BEFORE"... I think they are both pretty comparable.
I do feel that Kirk's story is slightly more personal, given it's his best friend. In that way, I think it is a stronger pilot than "THE CAGE".
"THE CAGE" is still great, though.
I do feel that Kirk's story is slightly more personal, given it's his best friend. In that way, I think it is a stronger pilot than "THE CAGE".
"THE CAGE" is still great, though.
And now I suddenly have a hankering to do a rewatch of The Cage.
I think it makes a splendid B-picture half of a double bill with Forbidden Planet.
Thats why I love the story so much. Kirk doesn't want to kill Gary and even after Gary kills Kelso he doesn't want to do it but knows he has to. They were friends since the academy. Its a very powerful story. Amazing that both pilots were made in the 60s. The writing holds up well today and I honestly prefer those stories to the Kelvin movies. They really packed a lot into the writing back in those days for an hour show that included commercials. So 50 minutes or so of pure entertainment. None of the filler junk we get today. So much filler in STD and STP.
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Can I ask why it's so powerful for a man to kill his friend?
Can I ask why it's so powerful for a man to kill his friend?
I meant the story itself is powerful drama.
Feels unnecessarily cruel to me.
I prefer "The Cage", but I agree with you about "Where No Man..." being the stronger pilot. It probably didn't help matters introducing your lead character as tired of his job and wanting to quit, that sort of story works better down the line after we've seen him through a couple of rough scrapes.
"Life can be damned cruel."
Admiral Leyton, "PARADISE LOST"
It definitely brought drama to the episode.
All opinions are valid, whether they’re minority or majority. So there’s no right or WRONG.
The funny thing about “The Cage” and Pike in “The Cage” is that DS9’s pilot, “The Emissary,” has similarities to it. And Pike in “The Cage” can be seen as a very early version of the ideas that would become Sisko.
- Both Sisko and Pike are disillusioned with Starfleet after experiencing emotional trauma from a loss of life.
- The stories of both pilots involves aliens that create mental illusions based on the lead character’s memories but on a fundamental level misunderstands the nature of humanity.
- In the end, the experience allows both Sisko and Pike to move beyond their issues and find new purpose in what their command gives them the ability to achieve.
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