So, are SFS and TVH invalidated by Robin Curtis playing Saavik?
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- Thread starter Tuskin38
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This seems to be inaccurate based on what we see, even just in modern Trek, disregarding the visuals of TOS.
We know that there were two (threeish) different configurations of a Constitution-Class prior to the TMP refit. The SNW-style and the TOS-style.
We don't know from only DSC-forward canon that the Enterprise ever appeared in the TOS configuration, but we do know that they existed. It's possible that Enterprise went straight from the SNW version to the TMP version, while the New Jersey-type was an offshoot of the Constitution-Class.
Already addressed. No.
The difference being there was no way to have Saavik continue to be the same actor. It was impossible given the situation.
It is *NOT* impossible to have the Enterprise look like the Enterprise. That was 100% a choice. (or hell, even closer to)
We going back to circular arguments though and derailing pretty massively. I'm happy to agree to disagree.
That's not how it works. When the show says there was a refit, then there was a refit. Using different designs for the same ship doesn't mean the ship was refit in-universe.
The TOS version might want to get it's chameleon circuit fixed. It has a habit of shifting between it's pilot version and the series one.
The could have just dropped the character. But I don't see the difference between recasting a role and "recasting" a model.
She looks like she did in SNW, then she looks like she did in TOS and TAS, then TMP happens. Next?
I seem to get yelled at when I suggest that too though.
The only acceptable answer seems to be "it's a TV show, nerd", which is extraordinarily odd given the nature of the forum... If there was any place that I thought we could talk about the details of Star Trek it would be on TrekBBS but... i'm not so sure.
Which occurred to a degree with The Motion Picture, even with the acknowledging of a refit. The timeframe did not fit.
Which is why treating them as in line with each other, the characters being most important, and events second, and the appearance of things a third. If treating it as a reboot, or an in universe dramatization, makes the continuity easier to swallow, so be it. I personally never treated TOS as part of The Motion Picture, or the Next Generation continuity because the feel is so different. The sets don't make it fit together.
Mileage will vary.
Did someone tell you you cant?
Not only do the shows and movies themselves tell us all this but fans like myself worked all this out in my head long ago. How this is still an "issue" is baffling, but hey, some fans need to argue in order to feel validated and heard. You guys do you.
The TMP thing works for me perfectly fine because it's acknowledged. I can suspend my disbelief... to a point. If you're going to make some kind of drastic change, give me a reason. Even if it's a shitty reason, give me a reason.
If it's something minor like Worf's forehead changing slightly over the course of TNG... I can accept it's just better makeup techniques. It didn't change radically.
Something like the jump from TOS to TMP... yeah that's a significant jump. I want an explanation. On the offshoot here of the timeline, I don't see why it's an issue. We don't have a specific year TMP takes place in. TOS Season 3 was 2269, and the refit took 18 months. If the 1701's 5 year mission ending in 2270, and we assume it went into refit immediately after, TMP could be as early as 2271.
I have a much harder time when they go backwards and show something we should already know what it looks like, and then make a drastic change to it... i'd like to know why.
In this case, I cannot.
I actually find that fascinating.
Please don't take this as any sort of knock or attack. It's genuinely interesting to me. So you seem to be able to suspend your disbelief regarding the TOS Enterprise and SNW Enterprise just... being the same thing, used interchangeably, but you can't suspend your disbelief that the older ship was upgraded to a new one in alittle under two years?
I do enjoy different perspectives and this one both perplexes and fascinates me.
I guess we were due for this argument to come up YET AGAIN. I genuinely do not understand why it is so difficult to comprehend that Strange New Worlds uses a different, more modern visual aesthetic. That's it. That's all you have to acknowledge. We've been shown time and time again now that the Strange New Worlds Enterprise is meant to be The Original Series Enterprise. It's not a difficult concept in the slightest. Star Trek is not a period piece!
In Saavik's case, the actress's agent demanded a ridiculous amount of money for her to appear. They could pay that money, but at the expense of the film's profitability. Similarly, using a design from the sixties would also be at the expense of the show's profitability. That's ultimately what it means.
Some folks have to head canon every time a button is moved. I call it "Roy Thomas Syndrome"
I just treat it all as a multiverse. Saves the hassle of these discussions.
Because the change and timeline doesn't line up for me. Two years is not sufficient time to me with how so many different things change, from the ship, to the uniforms, to Kirk's attitude, to Spock, to Decker and on and on. It's too many changes to both the ship and crew for me.
Mileage will vary.
I think this is fair, especially based on the two-and-a-half years between TOS and TMP. It would've been more believable if ten years had passed between the two.
That's fair, i'll say especially with the character pieces. Somewhat interesting is that's part of my criticism of SNW to TOS... it doesn't feel like there is enough time for the SNW characters to become the TOS characters, disregarding any issues with aesthetics. I feel like too many characters have too far to go in 4-5 years.
Also take into account thought that the actual date of TMP has always been ambiguous. It could be as early as 2272, but it could also be as late as 2278. I've always presumed TMP to take place probably closer to 2275-76-ish. It's still not a HUGE amount of time, but for me that's enough. I kind of wish they just went in "real time".
I can appreciate these answers though.
I think the 2.5 years mentioned probably means it takes place no later than 2273.
It's 2273. The five-year mission seen in TOS ends in 2270, as per Icheb's line when reciting Starfleet history to Janeway in "Q2(VOY)."
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