Spoilers The Strange New Worlds Starship Thread™

[Markonian]

IMO, no it didn't.

Fair, but I don't get why TOS is singled out for its visuals but DS9, TNG, TWOK etc get a free pass. Or are we gonna recycle this discussion with TNG in 20 years?
Imho, the Constitution I class looks fine alongside everything else.

No. it means the set designers changed something.

One is the real-world explanation, the other the in-universe explanation.
They can both exist at the same time. Like when Starfleet suddenly has a new uniform in DSC4 - it was changed for lighting issue but we can deduce Starfleet decided to change its fashion. Because we've seen DS9 comment on swapping uniforms.

 

[fireproof78]

Fair, but I don't get why TOS is singled out for its visuals but DS9, TNG, TWOK etc get a free pass. Or are we gonna recycle this discussion with TNG in 20 years?

Because Roddenberry didn't care for it and changed it the moment he could.

And TNG looks very dated to me. It's probably my least favorite era of Trek.

 

[Markonian]

Because Roddenberry didn't care for it and changed it the moment he could.

Ah, so those decrying the look of the TOS Enterprise are just parroting what Roddenberry said back in the 20th century.

 

[DaveyNY]

There are more than enough Trek fan renderings out there that show that the TOS Enterprise can be brought up to modern CGI standards while keeping intact her basic structure with a modicum of adjustments to her exterior detailings.


Unfortunately, the producers of the new shows chose not to go that route and we have to make do with what the have given us.

 

[fireproof78]

Ah, so those decrying the look of the TOS Enterprise are just parroting what Roddenberry said back in the 20th century.

Well, no. I think it looks very dated and doesn't perfectly hold up. I also do not believe the future of humanity should continue based on a 60s vision. If Star Trek is about our humanity then update the look.

Unfortunately, the producers of the new shows chose not to go that route and we have to make do with what the have given us

Works for me.

 

[Markonian]

Unfortunately, the producers of the new shows chose not to go that route and we have to make do with what the have given us.

We can. As we did back in 1979, we find an explanation for it.

Well, no. I think it looks very dated and doesn't perfectly hold up. I also do not believe the future of humanity should continue based on a 60s vision. If Star Trek is about our humanity then update the look.

It's a saucer design with hull textures, nacelles, shuttlebay, phaser ports, etc. Why does that look dated but, e.g. Voyager or Pioneer don't?
If the show is about humanity, then it sure matters even less what look of ship they're flying around in. For instance, Discovery updated the representation of Humans in Trek - it doesn't require the ship to be dark grey or light gray etc.

 

[HotRod]

Ah, so those decrying the look of the TOS Enterprise are just parroting what Roddenberry said back in the 20th century.

I love The Original Series Enterprise, but it is dated as hell. There's no way around it.

The "Discoprise" on the other hand fits perfectly into the design lineage.

 

[Tuskin38]

while keeping intact her basic structure with a modicum of adjustments to her exterior detailings.

Which is what they did in DSC/SNW.

 

[Dukhat]

Why is the refit from TAS (2270) to TMP (2273) no issue but refits throughout the 2250s are? There’s nothing in the wondrous tech of the 23rd century that precludes enlarging and, um, smallering ships as needed.

Again, it has nothing to do with tech. It has to do with logic, and a logical progression. There’s a huge difference between taking a ship that is clearly less advanced and refitting it to be more advanced, and taking a ship that is clearly less advanced, refitting it to be more advanced, and then refitting it again back to its original, less advanced state. There is no logical reason for the SNW Enterprise to be essentially downgraded to a ship that was designed internally and externally with a ‘60’s sense of what futuristic tech would look like.

It was Paramount’s intent for TMP that the ship we saw in TOS has now been rebuilt. It is CBS/Paramount’s intent now that the ship we see in TOS and the ship we see in DSC/SNW is the same ship. Not a refit or a pre-fit; the exact same ship, and the visual differences are to be ignored. That’s the difference. You are welcome to disagree; I myself consider SNW a reboot. But our opinions aren’t CBS’s intent.

 

[C.E. Evans]

There are more than enough Trek fan renderings out there that show that the TOS Enterprise can be brought up to modern CGI standards while keeping intact her basic structure with a modicum of adjustments to her exterior detailings.

Unfortunately, the producers of the new shows chose not to go that route and we have to make do with what the have given us.

You're right that it's the route the producers chose not to take, but they really didn't throw the baby out with the bathwater either. Just like it was a creative choice to modernize the Enterprise for 21st-Century television, it was also a choice to keep quite a few nods to the original design as well (like the grills at the end of the nacelles--originally they were going to be bulbs and turned inwards towards one another like those on Cochrane's Phoenix). In the end, it's just that SNW is merely a modern take on the TOS era that takes advantage of being made in 2023. Could the producers used the original Enterprise design? Definitely, if they were so inclined. But it's not like the TOS Enterprise has been stricken from canon--she's still there, just in a different series that shares a general continuity, not a perfect visual one.

 

[Rahul]

The 60s one will always be the canonically "correct" one - because THAT'S the version that's ingrained into pop-culture.

The same way Kirk & Spock will always be canonically Shatner & Nimoy.

Of course there will always be reinterpretations, reboots, re-imaginings going on. During SNW's run, the Enterprise will and always has looked like the Discoprise. During the Kelvin run, old Nimoy thought young Scotty looked like Simon Pegg (and him like Quinto). In NEM Picard thought he looked like Tom Hardy when he was younger.

These versions are all "canon".

And yet - with time everything will always revert back to the originals. As even proven in PIC (S1: Discoprise, S3: 60s Version again).

 

[Tuskin38]

(S1: Discoprise, S3: 60s Version again).

That's because they had a completely different art team for Season 2/3 that was way too focused on nostalgia. Even then, the Connie in Season 3 had some big differences from TOS, missing details, more obvious hull plating, some weird angles on the saucer.

 

[Racefuel]

For better or worse, the SNW enterprise makes the TMP refit more believable than the TOS Enteprise to TMP Enterprise Refit.

I know its a contentious issue, but crying why a show in 2023 needs to look like a show from 1967/8/9 is..its a bit of worrying about the deck chairs on the Titanic

 

[Markonian]

I love The Original Series Enterprise, but it is dated as hell. There's no way around it.

The "Discoprise" on the other hand fits perfectly into the design lineage.

Yes, the Discoprise looks great and fits in. But how is the 60s Enterprise dated but the 70's Enterprise is not? Why that zeroing in on 1960s but not 1970s, 1980s, 2000s?
"The Cage" and the rest of TOS(-R) exists. It is right there whether we want to ignore it or not.

Again, it has nothing to do with tech. It has to do with logic, and a logical progression. There’s a huge difference between taking a ship that is clearly less advanced and refitting it to be more advanced, and taking a ship that is clearly less advanced, refitting it to be more advanced, and then refitting it again back to its original, less advanced state. There is no logical reason for the SNW Enterprise to be essentially downgraded to a ship that was designed internally and externally with a ‘60’s sense of what futuristic tech would look like.

It has everything to do with tech. 23rd century Starfleet will use the latest tech combined with their current aesthetic style. It resembles 1960s Earth from 2245-2254, then 2150s/2020s Earth from 2255-2261, and swivel back to 60s fashion in the 2260s. The tech is always the latest because Starfleet has to keep up with the Klingon Empire. It's like how retro cars look old-fashioned but have touch screens. This is logical.

 

[Dukhat]

Yes, the Discoprise looks great and fits in. But how is the 60s Enterprise dated but the 70's Enterprise is not? Why that zeroing in on 1960s but not 1970s, 1980s, 2000s?
"The Cage" and the rest of TOS(-R) exists. It is right there whether we want to ignore it or not.
View attachment 34941 View attachment 34942 View attachment 34943View attachment 34945


It has everything to do with tech. 23rd century Starfleet will use the latest tech combined with their current aesthetic style. It resembles 1960s Earth from 2245-2254, then 2150s/2020s Earth from 2255-2261, and swivel back to 60s fashion in the 2260s. The tech is always the latest because Starfleet has to keep up with the Klingon Empire. It's like how retro cars look old-fashioned but have touch screens. This is logical.

I find no logic in that at all. But we shall agree to disagree.

 

[Tuskin38]

It is right there whether we want to ignore it or not.

No one is ignoring it. We're just treating it as it is.

 

[Racefuel]

The TMP Enterprise Refit and the Enterprise-A perfectly fits the style flow that SNW is setting. I think if we were to see it redone now you'd find the bridge tech such as displays and such updated, but the ship itself flows better right now than it does for TOS

 

[Dukhat]

I don’t find the TMP Constitution design to be at all dated. Perhaps the bridge interior and the engine room could do with a little updating, but the overall exterior looks good enough that it could be a hero ship even in 2023.

 

[Racefuel]

I don’t find the TMP Constitution design to be at all dated. Perhaps the bridge interior and the engine room could do with a little updating, but the overall exterior looks good enough that it could be a hero ship even in 2023.

And it's not like current Trek is pretending that the old school style Constitutions weren't around, we saw the New Jersey in Picard S2E6, but its just the Enterprise wasn't one of them, as we saw in Picard Season 1

 

[Noname Given]

And it's not like current Trek is pretending that the old school style Constitutions weren't around, we saw the New Jersey in Picard S2E6, but its just the Enterprise wasn't one of them, as we saw in Picard Season 1

We saw the PU USS Defiant in ENT S4 In A Mirror Darkly, and it looked as it did in TOS S3 The Tholian Web, so if it looked like that; the 1701 ALSO must have looked like that too as they were BOTH in The Tholian Web.
-QED