Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x09 - "Võx"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
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When we saw the whole Borgified fleet in formation over earth I genuinely thought for a second they were gonna spell out
B O R G
B O R G
It's interesting reading through the comments on YouTube of the video clips from this episode, and the amount of people who say they were moved to tears by seeing the Enterprise-D again. Many saying some of their childhood memories include watching TNG and Star Trek: Generations with their mom or dad, and now mom and dad are passed and seeing the Enterprise-D brought all of those emotions back.
The reason the Ent-D got a new bridge for GEN is because the old one was designed for the 4:3 aspect ratio. They needed a widescreen bridge for a widescreen movie.
Sure he misses the E .
It was his Ship..
And they can obviously not use the E, thought whatever happened was not Worf's fault.
And when he said "It was not his fault" Riker not made any Jokes about it . Instead he immediately nodded his head !
A Mini-Series or a Captain Worf Movie about the final and classified mission of the Enterprise-E would be an option. Making Michael Dorn looking younger again with his make-up would be doable.
It was absolutely that. But it was also Rick Berman and a couple of his lieutenants following in those footsteps and it turning to being very reluctant to tell stories based on other people's ideas, rather than their own. Which I get to a degree. TNG and DS9 made the Klingons as we know them more or less, from the relatively blank slate that was the pre-TNG Klingons. That was people telling new stories by just hitching on an existing alien race. It be quite another thing do do another jaunt through the Guardian of forever 3 times a series.
I think one thing that has changed though is that while TNG-DS9-Voy era certainly had big time TOS fans in production, modern Trek has a lot of people who grew up with those 90s shows and are more familiar with the 90s "fleshed out" Trek, which makes concepts from TOS not so untouchable anymore as it's far removed from their "core Trek".
Also us millenials and zoomers are just more comfortable building on pre-existing work in general. Probably because a lot of us grew up playing out imaginary episodes with action figures on guest room beds or writing fan fiction online.
What if they did in Federation standard?
I could see the Parkleds doing this or making a reservation to invade
The Borg created the evil DNA that makes Jack a Borg king. I know Voyager dealt them a heavy blow but they can't really just make another Borg drone on their own who can do the same thing? There were even baby Borg in Q Who. Considering the Borg created the DNA in the first place they should be able to recreate it. Nor was Picard's body actually necessary to beam the DNA into the Starfleet victims--the Borg could probably just recreate the DNA on their own and have the changelings or whoever transport it into Starfleet.
But that's a duel edged sword because fans who have done these things (Which I did with TOS, and Mego figures and such) that create a level of expectations, whether reasonable or not. So I can understand the reluctance to dive in to that side by the writers because it's not their own. I would hope that would change as demonstrated by use of the Borg and Guardian of Forever.
Just wanted to say that I strongly disagree with that assessment. Hugh did not die for nothing just because the cause of XB liberation is not yet complete or might suffer a backlash. The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. did not die for nothing just because the cause of black liberation is not yet complete. San Francisco Supervisor Harvey Milk did not die for nothing just because the cause of queer liberation is not yet complete. The heroes of the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising did not die for nothing just because there has been antisemitic backlash. Etc.
Besides, we know canonically from Star Trek: Lower Decks that in the distant future, children with Borg implants will be studying peacefully side by side with other children of the galaxy in Federation schools. So we know that one day this strife will end, and either XBs or full-on Jurati-type Borg will be accepted as equals. Hugh did not die for nothing.
Yes, I know. They moved stuff, painted stuff bronze, stuck bits on and turned some lights off. But when they did all this, I think it was Zimmerman who posited the in-universe reason that they changed the module. He’s the original designer for the Bridge (and did ST V as well to make an interim design between TOS and TNG) I believe. Though it may have been Sternbach that said it, I am unsure — it seems more likely. Think it is in the Generations movie magazine.
It wasn’t created, it was an unexpected thing. It’s why they keep having speeches about evolution, and legacy, and children not being quite the same as their parents.
Wasn't it the TNG Technical Manual which first suggested that starship bridges are replaceable modules?
Yup. Sternbach I think. I could go downstairs and check if Zimmerman had any input, but I am lazy. (Even the model kit has it and the captains Yacht as modules lol)
But one or the other of them actually referenced it in the movie behind the scenes I think — though I think it was also said that ‘we wanted fans to think “oh that’s what it looked liked all those weeks”’ which doesn’t quite sit in my memory as well, not least as it’s also what was said about elements in TMP if I recall.
Though Roddenberry covered all bases in that regard, with his TMP novel revealing TOS was an in-universe TV show.
There is no getting around that with fans. Especially in the internet era. There's no fandom that is great anymore. Trek is actually in the best shape. But fans are pretty trash in general and producers shouldn't calibrate around them one bit. I mean Take Obi-Wan - which was great. Folks decided what Reva was after one episode, even though by the last episode, she turned out to be excellent. Zero time allotted in letting a character develop via, the, ya know, story. Even with this series, Picard... I mean I was saying last week "the reveal isn't the point. The reveal isn't the point". This is not Lost. This not a mystery box show. This is not Stranger Things. Everything in this season existed to get the TNG crew back together on the Bridge of the D in Episode 9. And that's fine, because there will be no Season 4. This series is about endings, not begginings and this is the last ride of TNG, not *a* ride.
That's just like my position over folks accusing Season 3 of being one big 10 episode fan-wank. Of course it is! It absolutely should be. This is not some primarily world building saga. This is a Saturday Morning Cartoon. This is a big bowl of Sugary Cereal. This is an massive Ice cream sunday with everything on top. And that is fine. it's not always fine. You don't want a show doing that season 1 or whatever. But after 20 years, the final get together in the most dangerous event in decades in the Federation? Yeah. Let the fan wank go nuts. Throw the Borg and the Changelings together. Hell, next episode lets' have Sela and some TNG-era Warbirds come and save Earth guns blazing when that nebula ends up being a Transwarp Hub, even though Sela doing that would make no sense. Have fucking Martok show up in an Epilogue to high five Worf. Really, its a time to just set off every firework they got.
But SNW in Season 2 gets held to a different standard and should be much more circumspect with fanwank. Which is one reason in Season 1, I liked the changes they made to the Gorn (very un-Star Trek), even though it was a massive and shameless Xenomorph rip off I'm a bit surprised the producers ever let get approved.
As I understand it, Harlan was willing to let others use the Guardian - if he was properly paid for it. Which was his right.
I mean, it's not like he was 100% dead-set against anyone else ever using the Guardian. He wanted compensation for the character he created. Again: His right.
And I'm sure his estate still needs to approve any future use of the Guardian. DSC got away with it, so they must have been able to negotiate. I don't know if this would have been possible with Harlan himself - guess we'll never know (perhaps his estate didn't ask for as much as he would have).
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This is actually important for future possible shows, regardless of what they are.
You...uh, have fun with that.
This I completely agree with, especially this season. If you're going to give me this level of nostalgia then better ground it in a damn good story.
The story this season is damn good. At least I think so. It's filled with great deep cuts and modest retcons. And a lot of continuity fixing and quite little continuity breaking.
Frankly when your biggest offense is "The Titan isn't REALLLYYY a refit", you're doing pretty well. But really, I didn't care about that dumb point about 20 seconds after it came up, and really appreciated that bit of production art of the old Titan's parts being moved to the new Titan.