A Seven show could still be done with her serving as XO. Lower Decks works just fine with the main characters being ensigns. And Burnham not being Captain was not the issue with the first two seasons of Disco.
So is Capt Shaw the new, reigning biggest a##hole in Trek?
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A Seven show could still be done with her serving as XO. Lower Decks works just fine with the main characters being ensigns. And Burnham not being Captain was not the issue with the first two seasons of Disco.
lol no she hasn't.
The title of the show says it all: Lower Decks.
That was part of the story (She was court-martialed for mutiny).
She spent S1 under mirror Lorca, S2 under Captain Pike (an "experienced" Captain), and S3 out in the wilderness away from Discovery only to become Captain at the tail end of S3.
So let Seven do the same. What's so wrong with that?
Any spinoff is not going to have infinite number of seasons for Seven to "gain experience" (Disco's cancellation has ground the show to a halt).
It's OK for Kirk and Picard to flounder around with 500 lives in the balance but not OK for Seven?
If I didn't know any better, I'd call this sexism.
and if they named the show “Star Trek: Titan”?
and Burnham was also “Number One” to Saru. If Seven is the main character the story will be at least in large part her learning to be an actual Starfleet Officer. You act as if it somehow diminishes her if she stays XO but it doesn’t.
now your just looking for something that isn’t there.
Now that is a line too far. I'd have the same issue if Seven was a man, woman or non-binary. Gender has nothing to do with this.
They could do it in the first season.
And the Disco bashers have spent the past four seasons mewling about the show being focused on Burnham.
The show is not going to please everyone, no matter what SH does.
Ah, what? Kirk (at least in the Prime Universe) and Picard didn't become Captains until they had proven themselves qualified for the position. Seven hasn't. That has nothing to do with sex, it's just the simple fact of the matter. If Seven had a career in Starfleet along with appropriate time spent as an XO, then yes, by all means, she should be a Captain. Likewise, most everyone in general and in this thread specifically have stated they were against Kelvin Kirk being handed command of the Enterprise while still a cadet with no actual experience at all.
There is no grounds to justify an accusation of sexism on this matter at all.
It would be great if everything in life happened at just the right time when all concerned were "ready."
Unfortunately, life doesn't always work that way. There are times when you have to jump off the cliff and stitch the parachute together on your way down.
You know, i get that everyone loves Seven, but can we acknowledge that if Trek is going to keep moving forward, it's going to need new characters like Shaw, not continuing hewing to popular older characters like Seven, Picard, Janeway, etc. It's a nice bit of nostalgia, but we need more shows like Discovery, with new characters. We need characters like Saru, Burnham, Tilly, Lorca, Raffi, Georgiou, Hemmer, La'an, Mariner, Boimler, etc. Seven on a Titan show can, and should, serve the same function as Worf on DS9.
What about the bridge crew (Sidney LaForge? T'Veen?) What about Dr. Oake? Who's Chief of Engineering? Plenty of new characters there.
You would shove Seven into the background to work under a relative stranger? (A relative stranger who's a world-class cad.)
Worf came to DS9 when it was already established (Berman thought that Sisko needed another black man to talk to.)
Bear in mind, this show had Brian Bonsall playing Alexander in blackface. (It's one reason Disco went with the purple-skinned Klingons. Kurtzman didn't want the actors' skin colors being an issue.)
We still have seven episodes to go here. To put Seven through all this crap only to tell her in episode ten, "You're STILL not good enough to be Captain" would be cruel.
If it were up to me, we would not be having the Nemesis Atonement Tour.
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Put thru what crap, being called Commander Hansen. Let’s not forget she was just as if not more responsible than Picard and Riker for getting them into this mess by essentially hijacking the Titan against Shaw’s wishes.
She’ll be lucky to stay as XO and not get kicked out and sent to a penal colony Tom Paris style.
I guess I just don’t understand the NEED for her to be the Captain (in a spin-off that really may not happen) other than she’s your favorite character and that’s what you want for her. Like, if they did do a show and she remained XO would you not watch?
She’ll be lucky to stay as XO and not get kicked out and sent to a penal colony Tom Paris style.
I guess I just don’t understand the NEED for her to be the Captain (in a spin-off that really may not happen) other than she’s your favorite character and that’s what you want for her. Like, if they did do a show and she remained XO would you not watch?
Shaw is how he is because the writers appear to have been struggling to set up story arcs without falling back onto the weak crutch of using tired old tropes -- or, even worse, they have actively elected to use them!
The more I watch this series and see folks here argue, ahem, "discuss" about this or that, the more I realise that the writing is just dreadful. There is so much more they could have done instead of creating a cardboard cutout grumpy captain. Seeing just too many events that make one think "Huh..?" "Eh, what...?" or simply plain "WTF...?!" all stack up and, for me, it just means that the whole thing is inconsistent and simply hasn't been thought through properly.
Shaw -- by Ep3 the character is more than understandably upset about the utter cluster**** visited upon his ship... but the journey to get us there was ridiculous. Not having the professional courtesy to greet senior visitors to his ship? (even if he doesn't personally like them). Inviting the same guests to dinner but starting without them? Apparently having an issue with the Borg that may go back to BoBW and Wolf 359 (given the info in the credits sequence)... but yet accepting having Seven assigned as his XO? Not being present on the bridge for his own ship leaving Spacedock? Character quirks are good writing; consistently inexplicable behaviour is just very poor writing. Sure, there is the seemingly inevitable need for the writers' room to create "conflict" to drive stories but that has to be realistic in order to work; blatantly "manufactured" conflict just takes me right out of the story. It only serves to cheapen the character arcs and is so obviously hollow. Stashwick really is a perfectly good actor, making the most of what he's been given -- but what he has been given is drivel.
Titan -- why on Earth did this need to be a "re-fit" of the original? I get the need to create a link to Riker but the damn ship is just so utterly different from the original Titan that it makes no sense. OK, I get that the show runner really wanted a new shape of ship but then why not just accept that it's a new bloody ship? Sure, sure, people are doing phenomenally impressive mental gymnastics to justify the wholesale structural changes and the "A" suffix registry number over in the ship design thread... but the truth is that the very fact such massive justification is needed for it to even begin to make sense is really just a very obvious sign that it makes no sense at all. Again, poor creative decisions.
Despite great individual moments and some genuinely interesting characters and interactions, this inconsistency has been Picard's "Achille's heel" throughout S1 and S2 and, despite the hype, I don't see any improvement this time around. As much as I love them dearly, squeezing in a bunch of legacy characters doesn't really seem to be helping any.
The more I watch this series and see folks here argue, ahem, "discuss" about this or that, the more I realise that the writing is just dreadful. There is so much more they could have done instead of creating a cardboard cutout grumpy captain. Seeing just too many events that make one think "Huh..?" "Eh, what...?" or simply plain "WTF...?!" all stack up and, for me, it just means that the whole thing is inconsistent and simply hasn't been thought through properly.
Shaw -- by Ep3 the character is more than understandably upset about the utter cluster**** visited upon his ship... but the journey to get us there was ridiculous. Not having the professional courtesy to greet senior visitors to his ship? (even if he doesn't personally like them). Inviting the same guests to dinner but starting without them? Apparently having an issue with the Borg that may go back to BoBW and Wolf 359 (given the info in the credits sequence)... but yet accepting having Seven assigned as his XO? Not being present on the bridge for his own ship leaving Spacedock? Character quirks are good writing; consistently inexplicable behaviour is just very poor writing. Sure, there is the seemingly inevitable need for the writers' room to create "conflict" to drive stories but that has to be realistic in order to work; blatantly "manufactured" conflict just takes me right out of the story. It only serves to cheapen the character arcs and is so obviously hollow. Stashwick really is a perfectly good actor, making the most of what he's been given -- but what he has been given is drivel.
Titan -- why on Earth did this need to be a "re-fit" of the original? I get the need to create a link to Riker but the damn ship is just so utterly different from the original Titan that it makes no sense. OK, I get that the show runner really wanted a new shape of ship but then why not just accept that it's a new bloody ship? Sure, sure, people are doing phenomenally impressive mental gymnastics to justify the wholesale structural changes and the "A" suffix registry number over in the ship design thread... but the truth is that the very fact such massive justification is needed for it to even begin to make sense is really just a very obvious sign that it makes no sense at all. Again, poor creative decisions.
Despite great individual moments and some genuinely interesting characters and interactions, this inconsistency has been Picard's "Achille's heel" throughout S1 and S2 and, despite the hype, I don't see any improvement this time around. As much as I love them dearly, squeezing in a bunch of legacy characters doesn't really seem to be helping any.
What about the bridge crew (Sidney LaForge? T'Veen?) What about Dr. Oake? Who's Chief of Engineering? Plenty of new characters there.
You would shove Seven into the background to work under a relative stranger? (A relative stranger who's a world-class cad.)
Worf came to DS9 when it was already established (Berman thought that Sisko needed another black man to talk to.)
Bear in mind, this show had Brian Bonsall playing Alexander in blackface. (It's one reason Disco went with the purple-skinned Klingons. Kurtzman didn't want the actors' skin colors being an issue.)
We still have seven episodes to go here. To put Seven through all this crap only to tell her in episode ten, "You're STILL not good enough to be Captain" would be cruel.
If it were up to me, we would not be having the Nemesis Atonement Tour.
Worf came to DS9 because Ira Behr was told he had to add a TNG character and he chose Worf. Not sure where you got the "Black man" thing from, but I heard the real story directly from Ira Behr in person less than a week ago.
And Im not sure how being the XO counts as Seven being in the background. Its not like Riker, Spock, Kira, or Trip were background characters.
I just don't think making Seven the captain right out the door has long term story telling benefits.
A thing to bare in mind, Seven does have the collective knowledge of several Star Fleet Officers, including captain level indivuduals and their own experiences in that old noggin of hers. The main part should be how she herself uses that knowledge to become her own brand of captain.
Shaw makes the right decisions throughout when we look at it from his point of view and not that of our beloved heros. Had Seven been on the bridge at the time he would've likely thrown the responsibility onto her as it really was her fault they were in that mess, even convincing him to go "rescue the legends" in the process.
Seven also can't really rely on those she served with on Voyager as that shows favouratism and, from what we do know so far, only Chakotay would go on to be promoted to Captain.
I personally think the shows which do have that previous link to other characters tends to be better as you have something to anchor off of for older fans, rather than those with absolutely no links whatsoever.
There's plenty of fresh blood and new characters scattered around that would be nice to see "back" in something else. Even if a little puddle-like at the moment.
Riker wasn't a background character.
Have you every considered Seven may not want to be Captain?
It would be very nice to have a new character as the lead.
Much as I love seeing the old favorites, I agree with this. It's a big galaxy, supposedly.
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