Oops, my bad, you're right, as of SNW it's 200 years.
Still, though, my point stands, as Earth is fully recovered from the war even in ENT.
Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 1x05 - "Spock Amok"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
Oops, my bad, you're right, as of SNW it's 200 years.
Still, though, my point stands, as Earth is fully recovered from the war even in ENT.
I think, "Standing alone is better than standing together" is probably the least Star Trek sentiment one could express.
In the Terra Firma episodes, we also know the Vulcans cured at least one incurable human disease.
Just saying that starting around a century ago we’ve had two major wars that totally devastated Europe, today there are still obviously signs of this, but the cities have been rebuilt and the reminders of the wars aren’t obvious to anyone not deliberating thinking about them. If someone saw of Europe as little as we’ve seen of earth in ST they might not see any evidence of the world wars.
The devastation after the first two world wars was brutal, sure, but at least they left behind a world which still had most of its infrastructure intact.
A third world war, on the other hand...that's a different thing entirely. It'd be a lot harder to rebuild when you haven't got much left to rebuild WITH.
It was mostly about his dad.
Seems pretty glaring, though. Wasn't the planet's surface where the slaves were, and all the elite lived in some kind of floating city? You'd think joining an interstellar super-state would require some pretty stringent entry criteria, meaning some kind of inspection for lack of a better word.
I wonder if UFP membership requires "open borders" among member worlds. Can any UFP citizen move to any member world, or do they need some kind of permission? Was the Ardanan government actively trying to discourage visitors? Visitors would naturally want to explore a planet's surface.
Ardana would be a great subject of an episode or arc of a political Trek show. Would the Federation feel a lot of pressure to expel a member? Would that have happened before in the union's history? What would the fallout be of the Federation's negligence?
I took the dream as foreshadowing. Spock is aware of the impending ceremony. Years down the road. But T'Pring will have to make a choice then. Spock already has reason to worry about that choice!
Thanks to Amok Time, we the viewers are aware of that choice. But there are already warning signs that Spock is picking up on by this point in SNW.
That's what I love about TOS... it's more of a Utopia-in-progress and humanity still a work-in-progress as well.
Kirk basically says humans have the impulse to kill but we're going to choose not to kill. This day. And that's how you build towards something greater. With baby steps.
And, as we're seeing in the real world, treaty organizations can have reasons to fast track acceptance without the usual review process given current geo-political (or galactic political) reasons.
And, honestly, if you just saw a race nearly destroy itself, would you be in hurry to help them expand, including into your own neighborhood?!
"Hey, you know that kid who just got his driver's license after setting fire to the family home?"
"Yeah?"
"Wanna help him make a really long road trip?"
"Nope."
"Me neither."
"Yeah?"
"Wanna help him make a really long road trip?"
"Nope."
"Me neither."
This might be the first live action episode of Trek that would have worked perfectly as a Lower Decks episode if it just had faster paced sarcasm.
This episode makes it seem like Vulcans treat logic the way Klingons treat honor. Something to be proud of and that makes them superior to other races but can be thrown away when it's inconvenient.
The Vulcan makes a crack about humans evolving from apes when a few thousand years ago they were about as savage as humans at their worst. And of course we all know this ends up in a ritual where betrothals are challenged by fights to the death, obviously a traditional holdover from their savage period.
The truth emerges between this, and the way Vulcans were portrayed in DS9. Logic is not a way of life so much as a security blanket, a placebo to protect them from their worst instincts. They suppress their emotions on the belief that the only way to win the fight is to deny the battle, and are only coming to realize that by the time of the 24th century, much like for the humans, the battle has already been won.
The Vulcan makes a crack about humans evolving from apes when a few thousand years ago they were about as savage as humans at their worst. And of course we all know this ends up in a ritual where betrothals are challenged by fights to the death, obviously a traditional holdover from their savage period.
The truth emerges between this, and the way Vulcans were portrayed in DS9. Logic is not a way of life so much as a security blanket, a placebo to protect them from their worst instincts. They suppress their emotions on the belief that the only way to win the fight is to deny the battle, and are only coming to realize that by the time of the 24th century, much like for the humans, the battle has already been won.
Wasn't one of the points of that episode the fact that the Federation Council wasn't aware of the way the miners were being treated?
It was pretty obvious that Kirk & Spock were the first Fed Reps. to actually see the conditions planet-side, as the Folks in charge in the cloud city were never forthcoming with the exact details.
Purposely unaware, I'm sure.
F Ambassador: "The Federation requires all mining to be done in a ethical way!"
"You... Uh... How about you don't actually inspect the mines then?"
F Ambassador: "Deal!"
Another issue might be Ardana's proximity to the Klingon Empire. The UFP would essentially have two choices:
1. Deny them entry due to the Troglytes, only to have them side with the Klingons and enhance their worst tendencies, or;
2. Allow them membership with the goal of 'bringing them around' to the right way of thinking later, and keep their resources out of Klingon hands.
Which is the better solution, and why?
1. Deny them entry due to the Troglytes, only to have them side with the Klingons and enhance their worst tendencies, or;
2. Allow them membership with the goal of 'bringing them around' to the right way of thinking later, and keep their resources out of Klingon hands.
Which is the better solution, and why?
Your making an assumption on information we don't have.
Thus it is a false pretense.
We have no idea whether or not the Ardanan's allowed any Federation Rep's to even visit the mines pre-admission.
And given that they appeared to be most cordial and "civilized" in their Cloud City, there was probably no reason for the Federation Admission Folks to inquire further as to their mining process.
It wasn't until the Troglytes took Kirk & Spock hostage did it become apparent as to what was going on.
It would be at that point that the Federation Council, once informed, would begin steps and inform the Ardanan's that they were in violation of Fed Standards.
But of course, by that time, Kirk had already forced them into negotiations with the Trog's.
Kirk's actions most likely pretty much guaranteed that the system would stay out of Klingon hands for the foreseeable future, due to the fact that the Trog's now had an equal voice in the planets decision making and would be eternally grateful to him for making that so.
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It was a FEDERATION MEMBER WORLD. We've seen many times the process involved to become one. We also know the rules the Federation has to become one. They couldn't have past the modern day Fair Trade Coffee /conflict free diamond certification processes, let alone joined the Federation. There's no way they were admitted without willful ignorance on the part of the Federation, probably because the Federation needs their resources.
Your explanation requires vast incompetence on the part of the Federation, to the point that they'd still be morally wrong and heads should be rolling, with every other world held under a microscope, and ignores the history of the Federation doing whatever it wants if it means it gets the resources it needs. Like allowinghuman trafficking as long as the women end up on world's with Dilithium or secretly kidnapping and relocating and entire people to suck out their atmosphere.
I remind you this is the Federation during its early years. Not TNG's era.
The Federation where there's months between worlds of travel and you may not visit a planet again for decades.
They could have joined back when it was closer to "Anti-Romulan Alliance"
