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Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 2x08 - "Mercy"

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Yeah, what happened in Regeneration retconned first contact with the Borg in such a way that it was no longer "Q's fault" - which it arguably was up until said point.

But the point - if Q goes down this road - isn't about the Borg, it's about humanity. It's about realizing that he taught Picard (and thus humanity as a whole) the wrong lesson with the Borg.
It was already incorrect back when Q-Who happened. The Borg had already assimilated Federation and Romulan outposts in the 1st season Neutral Zone. SO Guinan's comments were wrong from the get go. But Picard's were accurate, having them encounter the Borg and survive gave them a true heads up about the threat the Borg were to the Federation in advance of their first serious advance into the Heart of the Federation.

Regeneration simply could've been the original reason a Cube went and assimilated some outpost on both sides of the Neutral Zone. While Q-WHo's interaction of a cube with the a state of the line Starfleet ship might have hastened the importance the collective placed on Earth itself. Simply too much that we actually don't know on the side of how the Borg interpreted any of the events. Without that everything we have is just making educated guesses.
 
Another thing to consider: Q never told them that ensuring Renee went on the mission would fix the timeline. They inferred that from info that the Queen gave them. And now the Queen is herself trying to (apparently) sabotage the mission, which strictly speaking seems to be unneeded if she wants to assimilate 21st century Earth.
 
Raffi: Did that guy Jurati killed even have a name?

Seven: ID found shows 'Tolian Soran'. Strange name for a human. Sounds familiar but I can't tell from where. Anyway we have bigger problems right now.

(Season finale ends with Picard having a drink with James T. Kirk in Ten Forward, played by Shatner)

Tolian Soran
 
strictly speaking seems to be unneeded if she wants to assimilate 21st century Earth.
If you're trying to contact say 21st century Borg, going to a geneticist involved in the life sciences, not communications technology, is not the first idea that springs to mind.
 
So does Agent Wells learning that Vulcans aren't scary and that time travel is real lead to a family obsession culminating in his descendant Ducane becoming a Federation time cop?

If Q is now powerless and mortal, Guinan could end up killing him when she stabs him with a fork in the finale.

Are Kore and her dead sisters Soong's attempt to bring back the supermen? Or is she just a normal non-Khan?

Asshole ICE guy bothered writing down Rios' statement. Not to much of a bastard to skip out on paperwork I see.
 
Are Kore and her dead sisters Soong's attempt to bring back the supermen?

Kore is a clone of someone. The somatic cell technobabble Soong uses related to the real cloning procedure used for Dolly the sheep and many other animals. Presumably the early deaths were due to flaws in the cloning process.

The question is who Soong repeatedly cloned. I would guess a dead wife, but that's incredibly creepy...like he was gonna raise her to adulthood and then try to fuck her.
 
Another thing to consider: Q never told them that ensuring Renee went on the mission would fix the timeline. They inferred that from info that the Queen gave them. And now the Queen is herself trying to (apparently) sabotage the mission, which strictly speaking seems to be unneeded if she wants to assimilate 21st century Earth.
I knew that in episode 2.
To be precise, it is the Borg Queen who says the time-line changed, and she might not be entirely trustworthy. Perhaps we'll find out that the changes are more complex.
 
I am quite irritated that Terry Matalas tweeted that his PIC team opted to ignore the Eugenics Wars.

Who the hell cares what Matalas tweets? Doesn't make it canon.

Whatever Matalas might idly post on social media - until the series actually shows it, it didn't happen. So therefore, until we see differently, the 2024 in PIC is still one in which the Eugenics Wars have already happened.
 
This one felt like another week of plot filler….

My theories are:
The kid from Carbon Creek is the FBI agent. I rewatched CC and his mannerisms are spot on for Karnes.
I forgot Karnes was in Voyager, as a time cop, so it’s a bit sad they didn’t make that link either.
Soong better have a son stashed away called Khan……


I didn’t like that Seven had to be ‘mansplaned’ what a Li battery is…. She’s Seven, amazing 25th century scientist/engineer!

why isn’t Guinean going back with them?…. What happened to the Gary 7 alien… can they only afford one guest actress a week?
 
Kore is a clone of someone. The somatic cell technobabble Soong uses related to the real cloning procedure used for Dolly the sheep and many other animals. Presumably the early deaths were due to flaws in the cloning process.

The question is who Soong repeatedly cloned. I would guess a dead wife, but that's incredibly creepy...like he was gonna raise her to adulthood and then try to fuck her.
Or a dead child who passed due to a genetic anomaly.

Either way, reminds me so much of the Director from Red vs. Blue:
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Fantastic episode, I love how all the little pieces (the ones some believed the writers forgot about) are coming together.

Pretty tired today, so I won’t be writing much, giving this episode a 8.

For a moment, when she tried to connect with Wells, I almost could believe that woman was guinan. Almost.

Q seems in really bad shape, for sure.

I love how Kore just walks out with no plans (and no shoes!) on how to survive. I’m not sure how old she’s supposed to be, but both me and my brother did something similar as teenagers, eventually coming back after a couple of days at most, I wonder if she will do the same.

The borg queen sure is scary and manipulative. So her plan is to manipulate soong to get la sirena and leave to help the 21st century borg assimilate the galaxy while soong brings about the confederation future? Of course she could be lying and might proceed to assimilate earth once she gets the superior technology on the ship.

Speaking of soong, we now seem to know how he becomes important: it’s not his work with genetics, but his shields that make him an hero to the confederation.

Side note, I doubt we’ll get software able to estrapolate a 3D environment this quickly by 2024. Then again, with recent improvements in the machine learning field, it’s not impossible, only improbable.

Rios plans with Theresa & son are more and more baffling.

And what were those Vulcans doing on earth? And why was the mind-meld suddenly interrupted?

Not totally convinced about Wells just buying Picard’s explanation and letting them go (at the expense of his job!). I wonder if that will be it. From how the episode was written I don’t expect to see anything more from him, yet it really was way too easy.

Looking forward to next week!
 
Everything in 2024 so far took place in the span of two days.

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During this time Soong got his license revoked, made a donation to NASA to get on the board of the Europa Mission, and now has a private army? And not just any army, all ex SF!

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WTF? Where do these mercenaries come from? He just calls a general?
This is absurd. Nobody can take this seriously.

BTW, the mercenaries use Discovery armor vest (budget problems?).

This is what I imagine the plot of one of those CW DC Arrowverse shows looks like.
. While there is certainly an element of getting dropped in at a set of events with near perfect timing, most of them can actually work with the story we have. Really the only issue that bothers me to any degree, is how fast Rios was picked up taken to another location and then transferred on his way to Castiac. For the US that's incredible fast. I would have to assume that at this point all undocumented (which would be Rios) are automatically sent to the nearest Ice facility for processing, and that it happened to happen right before a normal route was being run. Unlikely but utterly not impossible if that is the way that system works.

Soong has been working on a project with the military to enhance soldiers, so I would naturally assume he has direct contracts with those high up in the project, that could very easily be a General. Not at all outside what can and has happened with special research projects of the US military in the last 75 years). Now if said General is working a specialized off the grid project, then getting a team (I assume its the soldiers that were being modified) if stationed near LA would be an hour or two tops. Now if he is using private security forces, money is basically the only limiting factor. Getting private forces boots on the ground is only determined by the means of transport. Area like LA, fastest would be deployed by Helicopter to avoid traffic and is absolutely something that money can manage. Would be done in an hour maybe 2 tops, if you have the financial means. Its done today. Absolutely;utely nothing outside things that could be done today, if you had the resources.

Being worried about repurposing existing props? Sorry this is an extremely common practice for shows and films even those with large budgets. Now Trek doesn't have a massive budget, compared to some of the largest budgets around (currently the Marvel series are running around 15-25 million an episode, and Lord of the Rings is going to be around 40 -50), but the 8-10 is considered to be having an extremely generous budget today, And even with that the productions of both Discovery and Picard have had to reuse props and FX to help get as much bang for their buck.

Sooooo as Jurati is walking away Raffi's phaser is lying close by Seven. You would think Seven -- given her ability to take hard hits in combat -- like when she was on the Borg cube -- would scramble over to the Phaser and shoot Jurati in the back.

And also Jurati just walks away from Raffi and Seven without taking any evasive action -- and in clear line of sight. But nooooooooooo. Man, even with the stiff reactions of the TOS Animated series -- the reactions were faster than this
As many people have notice Seven is completely human. And she was tossed through the air with her back slamming hard against a steel structure. Realistically she's not getting up any time quickly. And we do know that even in her weakened state the Queen's assimilation process of Jurati has enhanced her strength enough that she can lift a larger women with one hand. Jurati's walk was completely in character for a Borg. Really the only thing I would want to see different about the scene is them eventually getting the phaser and looking to see her no longer in sight. That is my quibble with that scene.

Interesting that Agnes can shrug off Borg assimilation to stop herself from killing (something many, many others in Trek including Picard were unable to do) while the same Agnes couldn't shrug off a mindmeld to prevent killing Maddox. That must be one very very weak assimilation the Borg Queen did. Except she's back to rampaging a minute later. The strength of the queen's control comes and goes with the plot.
We know the Queen from the get go is seriously a shell of herself. There is no collective, period. Now she manipulates Jurati to help her systems start to restore. In some ways it reminds me of the cut off drones in VOY "Collective" and the not fully assimilated drones weren't able to successfully assimilate or form a collective. Now the Queen was a fully developed Borg, but one that had its collective destroyed, removed, whatever, and and at her own form seriously damaged. So her even after regaining some ability, it seems reasonable that Agnes might be able to fight in brief moments of stress and regain control. Such as how Picard was able to take over from his Locutus personae and I thank he was still technically connected to the hive at the time.

Now another poster and I can't find the post, states it doesn't make sense that Soong could have access or connections to a private (or a military black ops team) since he didn't use it going after Renee. But it makes sense to me. He's in trouble with a government agency about his research. Would you risk putting your enhanced team in a very public setting, that might completely ruin your chance of being able to pursue your science research over something you could accomplish on your own with little indirect risk at further hurting your projects? Now would you do that to help cement yourself as the lynchpin for the creation of a history that sees you as a savior? One is vastly larger motivator and thus you would take risks and steps that you might not necessarily due for lesser goals.
 
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I am quite irritated that Terry Matalas tweeted that his PIC team opted to ignore the Eugenics Wars. Come on! There is no need because the Eugenics Wars should have happened in the 1990s before 2024, and the Shenzhen Convention in PIC is a perfectly logical aftereffect!

Did he ignore it though? Since it makes sense that the ratification of the Shenzhen Conventions marks the end of the Eugenics Wars in 1996, and the start of WWIII in 2026 begins if a couple of the participants decided to ignore or tear up the conventions. Thus, showing how the two conflicts are related and interchanged with each other.

It certainly seems like that’s what’s implied as to how it all went down, since Soong experimented on military personnel, and has connections to private military group. And presumably, based on the dialogue with Kore, he’s been working on eugenics since the 1990s. It all adds up here.
 
Kore is a clone of someone. The somatic cell technobabble Soong uses related to the real cloning procedure used for Dolly the sheep and many other animals. Presumably the early deaths were due to flaws in the cloning process.

The question is who Soong repeatedly cloned. I would guess a dead wife, but that's incredibly creepy...like he was gonna raise her to adulthood and then try to fuck her.

Um. I'm just going to assume he's resurrecting a dead daughter like in Fallen Kingdom.
 
hile there is certainly an element of getting dropped in at a set of events with near perfect timing, most of them can actually work with the story we have. Really the only issue that bothers me to any degree, is how fast Rios was picked up taken to another location and then transferred on his way to Castiac. For the US that's incredible fast.
I believe the term is "dramatic license." Which Star Trek employed all the time.
Being worried about repurposing existing props? Sorry this is an extremely common practice for shows and films even those with large budgets. Now Trek doesn't have a massive budget, compared to some of the largest budgets around (currently the Marvel series are running around 15-25 million an episode, and Lord of the Rings is going to be around 40 -50), but the 8-10 is considered to be having an extremely generous budget today, And even with that the productions of both Discovery and Picard have had to reuse props and FX to help get as much bang for their buck.
Similarly, ex scienta astris has a couple of articles on reused Star Trek props. This is a nonissue, as you note, because it is an extremely common practice.
 
Being worried about repurposing existing props? Sorry this is an extremely common practice for shows and films even those with large budgets. Now Trek doesn't have a massive budget, compared to some of the largest budgets around (currently the Marvel series are running around 15-25 million an episode, and Lord of the Rings is going to be around 40 -50), but the 8-10 is considered to be having an extremely generous budget today, And even with that the productions of both Discovery and Picard have had to reuse props and FX to help get as much bang for their buck.

There’s a whole section at Ex Astris on just such a thing. And it ain’t a small list.
 
voyager ignored them as well despite traveling to the 1990s.
Not my point.
I think it's a defensible thing. However, they directly referenced other things this season which happened in Trek's past, but not our present (like Nomad) or things which can't plausibly happen by 2024 (like a manned mission to Jupiter) in the real world. If you're going to go down the route of firmly establishing Star Trek as an alternate timeline, just go the whole nine yards.
Exactly. They decide to make Adam Soong a publicly-known mad scientist and yet no one can say something like 'Curse you, Soong! You're perfectly old enough to remember the Eugenics Wars! Did you learn nothing from that?'
 
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