Reminiscent of TMP, with all the flying around looking at V'Ger's bits. I guess that means TMP wasn't Star Trek either.
Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 4x11 - "Rosetta"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
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Reminiscent of TMP, with all the flying around looking at V'Ger's bits. I guess that means TMP wasn't Star Trek either.
I don't understand why they would give a doomsday clock and then have these last two episodes. It felt too detached from the clock. Maybe, if they didn't have 10C plot, have an overarching B story of Vance/Bryce/Tilly/Naan coordinating a evacuation effort from Earth/NiVar. That story of regular people from seemingly the most powerful planets in the galaxy having to flee would keep the stakes in perspective. Also, by making clear that there will still be massive casualities, it keeps the stakes high. Also, by showing a Romulan perspective of a second planetary evacuation in 800 years, it can fill in the lore.
It was a bit "arty", but Star Trek enough to 12 year old me. Considering all we had were TOS reruns to go on.
Indeed.
Anyway, two episodes and this is season is all done. Then we'll have a complete picture. I have other things I need to do today. So, if I don't reply to any rebuttals right away, that's why.
I feel like I start every episode this season thinking "Hey, this one's much better than those other episodes. Whoever wrote this story is pretty good!" and then it wears me down until all my joy is gone. Not because it's slow paced, but because I need more from the conversations than it's giving me.
One conversation in particular stood out to me this episode in fact, and that's the one where the President talks to the new linguist. It's pretty usual to get a scene like that without any regular characters present, it made it feel more like Deep Space Nine for a moment, and I was curious to learn more about what the linguist's deal was. He's been one of the more interesting characters to me this season, just because he's been allowed to be a bit more jokey than the others. But then it turned out that the scene was about the President chewing him out for being jokey instead of supportive, and at the end we see that he's learned his lesson. No fun allowed, only supportiveness! This is not an atmosphere in which people like Jett Reno can thrive! So it's probably for the best she got kidnapped by Tarka really.
I was a bit confused about why Book was still going rogue with Tarka and this episode helped clear it up for me: if Burnham's plan fails he's going to stop the 10-C by force! Though hang on, this doesn't seem like something anyone would argue with, of course they're going to try to stop the 10-C if communication fails, so everyone's basically on the same side now right? The two of them were sneaking around, making secret deals and kidnapping people to achieve what Discovery was going to do anyway.
It was nice that the heroes got to go out onto a planet though. I definitely approve of away missions, especially when Detmer's invited along, they're all wearing flashy Tron suits, and they're exploring such a well-realised alien environment. We've come a long way from a few rocks on a stage with a red-tinted backdrop. It's just a shame there wasn't really anything there to find, except for a few piles of hydrocarbons. I was kind of rolling my eyes at people who complained about Stormy Weather by saying things like "even the ship's got emotions now!" but I can't resist pointing out that they went to a planet and even the dirt had emotions. It's very fortunate that 32nd century spacesuits are too advanced to be hermetically sealed or else they might not have ever discovered the crucial clue. It was kind of driving me mad though that when they were trying to figure out what was keeping Detmer from suffering the hallucinations no one mentioned her implant, not even to rule it out. But I do have to give them credit for bringing up Detmer's past trauma a lot more organically than they did Owo's and Rhys' in early episodes. Even if the repetition has dramatically diluted any impact it might have had.
Overall I'm glad Detmer can fly good, but I wish characters would talk good.
One conversation in particular stood out to me this episode in fact, and that's the one where the President talks to the new linguist. It's pretty usual to get a scene like that without any regular characters present, it made it feel more like Deep Space Nine for a moment, and I was curious to learn more about what the linguist's deal was. He's been one of the more interesting characters to me this season, just because he's been allowed to be a bit more jokey than the others. But then it turned out that the scene was about the President chewing him out for being jokey instead of supportive, and at the end we see that he's learned his lesson. No fun allowed, only supportiveness! This is not an atmosphere in which people like Jett Reno can thrive! So it's probably for the best she got kidnapped by Tarka really.
I was a bit confused about why Book was still going rogue with Tarka and this episode helped clear it up for me: if Burnham's plan fails he's going to stop the 10-C by force! Though hang on, this doesn't seem like something anyone would argue with, of course they're going to try to stop the 10-C if communication fails, so everyone's basically on the same side now right? The two of them were sneaking around, making secret deals and kidnapping people to achieve what Discovery was going to do anyway.
It was nice that the heroes got to go out onto a planet though. I definitely approve of away missions, especially when Detmer's invited along, they're all wearing flashy Tron suits, and they're exploring such a well-realised alien environment. We've come a long way from a few rocks on a stage with a red-tinted backdrop. It's just a shame there wasn't really anything there to find, except for a few piles of hydrocarbons. I was kind of rolling my eyes at people who complained about Stormy Weather by saying things like "even the ship's got emotions now!" but I can't resist pointing out that they went to a planet and even the dirt had emotions. It's very fortunate that 32nd century spacesuits are too advanced to be hermetically sealed or else they might not have ever discovered the crucial clue. It was kind of driving me mad though that when they were trying to figure out what was keeping Detmer from suffering the hallucinations no one mentioned her implant, not even to rule it out. But I do have to give them credit for bringing up Detmer's past trauma a lot more organically than they did Owo's and Rhys' in early episodes. Even if the repetition has dramatically diluted any impact it might have had.
Overall I'm glad Detmer can fly good, but I wish characters would talk good.
I agree this season feels slow. I think the reason it feels so slow is because there is not enough story to the 10-C arc. Literally the entire 10-C arc is the DMA is threatening the Federation and we need to contact the 10-C to try to make peace. That could be a 2 hour movie. It is is not enough for 13 episodes.
I feel like Discovery should have either done two arcs (wrap up the 10-C arc by episode 5-6 and then transition into a second arc in the second half of the season) or add more to the 10-C arc (like have first contact with 10-C in episode 4, have it go badly, introduce an enemy to 10-C, have the Federation try to ally with the enemy of 10-C, have an episode where Tarka does reach this other universe and meets his friend and learn something big about this other universe, then have a big finale with 10-C).
I feel like Discovery should have either done two arcs (wrap up the 10-C arc by episode 5-6 and then transition into a second arc in the second half of the season) or add more to the 10-C arc (like have first contact with 10-C in episode 4, have it go badly, introduce an enemy to 10-C, have the Federation try to ally with the enemy of 10-C, have an episode where Tarka does reach this other universe and meets his friend and learn something big about this other universe, then have a big finale with 10-C).
perhaps if so many people are complaining about the bad writing, even pointing out its absurdity, even people that actually liked past discovery episodes. there is more to it than just “haters”?
well, releasing this episode concurrently with Picard wasn’t exactly the best way to avoid comparisons.
Perhaps they liked that episode more?
no, you just bring it up in every. Single. Discovery. Thread. And in many that have nothing to do with discovery.I just make it up.
exactly. This is also why I wrote that the general has no reason whatsoever to commit treason in this episode, as the plan is still “first talk than maybe shoot” for everyone involved now.
I'm sorry... We have a DMA that is wiping out entire planets and is now enroute to Earth, Ni'Var etc and can destroy those planets within HOURS... But here we have our crew talking about how bad their youth was and drinking tea and having conversations that they're feeling not quite right. It's ABSURD.
There is more to it. But that's not what said. It stands out as extremely odd in contrast to past comments.
Sad but true. And frustratingly so.
So, Discovery is fake? Got it.
It is tiresome. It is painful. I'll make no apologies for it. Treating Discovery as second class citizen and not real Trek is not OK. Just a little bit of acknowledgement of the inconsistency, the poor treatment, or anything would go a long way in mending fences.
But, as it stands, Discovery does no right. And it hurts.
Ok. Now go back read _all_ my posts since the beginning of discovery and find a single one where I wrote discovery is “fake” or anything of sorts.
This is another thing you tend to do often: putting words in someone’s mouth.
it is tiresome indeed.
Apologies. It is the feeling that by calling something "real Trek" then the implication is there is fake Trek. If that isn't the point then why call something real Trek?
Yup.
My thought as well. If they established a definitive connection between the remains of the lifeforms on this planet and the 10-C I missed it. Seems speculative to me. I am thinking and hoping that we are in for a twist and the 10-C either destroyed this planet and wipe out its indigenous species or the 10-C constructed the hyperfield to hide from and/or protect itself from whatever did destroy that planet.
I was thinking about the Adira scenes, and you know what kinda rankles me?
The writers have apparently totally forgotten that they have a trill symbiont, and access to centuries worth of other people's memories. Like, the only story function of it was getting the connection "fixed" in Forget Me Not, and getting Gray out of it this season. The memories of the earlier hosts are never a help to them, nor do they provide any perspective. Worse, their characterization has regressed from being somewhat confident and mature to being a typical human teenager with limited life experience. There is absolutely nothing left in them as a character to make you think they are the first human with a trill symbiont inside.
Edit: Like in this episode they have a platonic crush on Detmer for being so confident and having grace under pressure. You mean to tell me Tal didn't have a single host who had those characteristics that Adira could draw upon?
The writers have apparently totally forgotten that they have a trill symbiont, and access to centuries worth of other people's memories. Like, the only story function of it was getting the connection "fixed" in Forget Me Not, and getting Gray out of it this season. The memories of the earlier hosts are never a help to them, nor do they provide any perspective. Worse, their characterization has regressed from being somewhat confident and mature to being a typical human teenager with limited life experience. There is absolutely nothing left in them as a character to make you think they are the first human with a trill symbiont inside.
Edit: Like in this episode they have a platonic crush on Detmer for being so confident and having grace under pressure. You mean to tell me Tal didn't have a single host who had those characteristics that Adira could draw upon?
Memories may not carry the weight as witnessing it in action.
Same with having tangible role models rather than just reading about historical figures.
Obviously. I mean, Ezri Dax was kinda a mess (and also young/unprepared for joining) despite her access to memories. But they at least referenced her confusion regarding where her own likes/interests started and the past hosts began - that sort of thing.
The host is completely and totally invisible now in terms of Adira's characterization.
Probably a part of the confusion.
This is what's really souring me on this season and the direction the series is taking as a whole. Having maybe 1 or 2 crewmembers that freeze for an overwhelming situation I can understand, but not a whole ship's crew. It's getting monotonous and tiresome having these melodramatic moments and "me, me, me" moments when there is the fate of the galaxy at stake.
Didn't this crew take any psych tests before being assigned to starship duty? Because right now I see a ship full of expendables that fall ass-backwards into resolving something.
Before or after the trauma?
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