Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 4x04 - "All Is Possible"

[Finn]

Those shuttlecraft...has an Orville vibe to it, don't they?

 

[TimeIsAPredator]

I'm too confused about how I felt to rate this episode yet:

• Discovery is getting like Game of Thrones where every time is start to like a character they are gone
• Why is Kovich now in the nice Grandpa role. He seemed like a different character to last season
• On a personal level I hate shuttle crash stories. I can't think of a single one in any Trek that I liked.
• Burnham is on the path to Federation dictator. That was some fine snaking into a position of power from her. Next stop is to vote that the council which she is unelected leader of take control from the President.
• I miss Detmer.
• Book goes from great character to my most hated everytime he starts up with the "I used to pray to the wikiwaka birds underneath the nupidupi tree" crap.
• That green screen background is awful looking. Makes me feel like I am watching a Command & Conquer cut scene.
• The new/reimagined aliens continue to look like the poor background characters from Mo's Eisley with the big emotionless plastic heads and lack of neck movement.

Despite all that I didn't hate this episode but I can't tell if I liked it either

 

[BigJake]

8/10.

Spoiler

Holy fuck is this gonna stir the "how dares Burnham be a hero?!" hornet's nest, but I enjoyed her and Saru's excursion on Ni'Var and I'm loving the hell out of Saru this season overall. They've been setting up some kind of transition for Tilly so I guess I'm not too surprised at her departure here, but I've really enjoyed seeing her blossom into a leader for all her goofy nerdiness. I'll miss her, though I have a feeling the season arc will bring her back sooner rather than later and in the meantime, Adira has the goofy nerdiness more than covered.

I love callbacks to "The Galileo Seven," which Tilly's plot absolutely was. I also love TNG-style diplomatic maneuvering and enjoyed seeing Burnham do some of that sweet thing here. The C-plot with Culber and Book was kinda disposable so a couple points off for that, but I could also watch Culber and Book literally just read the phone book to each other and be entertained, so there's that. I guess they'll be kind of easing Gray into things but in the meantime HOLY CRAP WHAT AN AWESOME MULLET, IAN ALEXANDER. Point added for that.

 

[Andyliini]

Even better episode than the the one from last week, 9 out of 10 from me this week.
The episode kept me hooked all the way through, and it certainly felt shorter than the 54 minutes it ran. I was really surprised to see Tilly leave, I wonder if it was the producers choice or if Wiseman wanted to leave herself. It really felt like they were making up basics for the possible Starfleet Academy show. Maybe Tilly could even lead the show, who knows.

As for this episode, all three plots worked, and were different enough from each other. The actors all seem to be completely in sync with their characters, bringin out the best in each scene. Very promising, for rhis season.

 

[dinzy]

I am getting caught up in nitpicking, but writers need to do better to make some of the events more realistic. Last week Stamets was an anti-science whiner and that basically offended me. This week I am pissed at the scene where Kovich, who is a consultant, offers Tilly a position. I just expected that to come through a normal chain of command. This is much less jarring than Stamets crying like a baby when his theory, which he knew to be lacking, did not fit the data, but that last one set me up to get ticked off.

 

[TimeIsAPredator]

What exactly was achieved by Burnham's compromise ?
Now there will be a council of member worlds to look out for the interests of the member worlds in the Federation council which is a council of the member worlds that apparently wasn't looking out for the member worlds

 

[1001001]

Loved this one. Is Saru going to be getting some Ni'Var lovin'? Sure looked like it.



The stuff with Tilly and the cadets was pretty cliche, but effective nonetheless. My wife was convinced in the moment that Wiseman was leaving the show. I assured her that was not the case. Tilly is simply too awesome to leave (she might need her own comedy spin-off when Discovery ends...someone get to work on that).

The scenes with Book and Culber were very nicely done.

9

 

[seigezunt]

I love the whole bit about "this generation of young people has grown up in isolation." I see what they did there.

I love everything going on with Saru right now, of course.

I saw an interview with Mary Wiseman in which she said she will be back later this season with a different hairdo and uniform. I'm putting my bet in now for the return of Captain Killy.

"I used to pray to the wikiwaka birds underneath the nupidupi tree"

I screamed. This is now my daily mantra.

 

[Romulan_spy]

What exactly was achieved by Burnham's compromise ?
Now there will be a council of member worlds to look out for the interests of the member worlds in the Federation council which is a council of the member worlds that apparently wasn't looking out for the member worlds

I think the idea is that this committee will be an independent 3rd party and will provide oversight over the Federation Council. The issue is that the Federation Council might make decisions that favor the majority but could hurt individual member worlds that are in the minority. Ni'var feels that their wishes and interests were ignored pre-Burn. They fear the same thing will happen again if they rejoin the Federation which is why they wanted an exit clause. The hope is that this third party committee will step in and prevent the Federation Council from ignoring any individual member worlds or making policies that disenfranchise individual member worlds.

 

[eschaton]

I agree to all of these. The Ni'Var and Book/Culber stories were the best of the lot today. But the Ni'Var and cadets' story were not nearly as fleshed out as they needed to be. They were all surface-level stuff. Surface-level complaints from the cadets and surface-level stuff from the Vulcans/Romulans. One quick interaction, Burnham thinks for a minute or Tilly tells one cadet to tell his backstory, and boom all problems are solved.

This gets back to the problem with Discovery's serialization. Having to service three (or 4) plots each week, they only have time for about 3 scenes for each plot: intro problem, discuss for a minute, solve. There is no time for actual dilemmas, no weighing of options, no conundrums or barriers, no ethical or moral decisions to make. Just get on to the next story beat. Just like last week we didn't learn more than about 3 surface-level details about the hibernating alien race (who were the most interesting part of the whole episode), there were no real barriers to finishing the mission other than a bit of fisticuffs and a quick tech fix, and no real exploration of why the Warrior Nun (TM) did what she did [because PLOT!] when there were many less violent options, all because there was no time.

Thanks for succinctly putting into words what I was trying to say. Overplotting has been one of Discovery's most omnipresent issues. I wish they'd learn from say DS9, and realize you don't need to have all regular cast members have story-critical roles every single week. Whoever isn't needed, just give them some "flavor" dialogue and/or character moments, and let a single story play through to completion.

 

[ToddCam]

I'm sure I'm not the only one who tagged Callum as dead from the beginning. I understand the plot necessity of ignoring the magic-like tech of the 32nd century for story purposes, but why make it so obvious? I didn't really get anything out of Tilly's scramble. I would have preferred something horrible like a beam through his chest or something. Something that is clearly beyond emergency medical treatment.

Otherwise, good episode. I hope this was a backdoor pilot, because I will really miss Tilly. And I really like the cadets. I love the politics of reassembling the Federation, even if it's kind of absurd (the solution). Starfleet captains claiming they are not involved in politics. Are they unaware that they are representatives of a government? And as someone who has been dealing with grief for years, I really appreciate the care of the story with regards to Book. And echoing others in this thread, the acting of those two is excellent.

 

[Deks]

Well, Discovery and its writers simply aren't interested in anything about the science fiction part of the show. It could take place in 2180, 2280, 2380, or 3180. The timeframe doesn't matter, and neither does the technology - they just write the characters to do what they "always do in Trek" regardless of the actual setting. This is at least the third episode this season where someone dies and there is only a rudimentary attempt to save them: "well all I have are these cloth bandages in this medkit, so I guess this guy's a goner."

If I had to synthesize a conclusion about the show from the above points, I would say the writers just don't care about the WHY of anything nor the implications of they things they put on screen. They are interested in hitting these character moments for their main characters, not in the coherency of the story or plot, or in fleshing out or fully using the future setting - it's just window dressing or framing for their character beats. Which for the most part are good character beats, just a little insubstantial in terms of the bigger picture.

Its a scifi show... ergo, having convincing setting and stories that fit that setting with advanced technology (and consistency) is how Trek should be done.
Furthermore, pushing the show so far into the future was an idiotic move. They wanted to 'get away' from the existing things (and constrictions of canon)... but that's impossible because they would STILL have massive passage of time to contend with and what came before in terms of technology and science.

They had an opportunity to do better and this blatant 'we don't care' attitude is what doesn't sit well with me and makes it difficult to enjoy the show from S3 onward.

 

[TimeIsAPredator]

I think the idea is that this committee will be an independent 3rd party and will provide oversight over the Federation Council. The issue is that the Federation Council might make decisions that favor the majority but could hurt individual member worlds that are in the minority. Ni'var feels that their wishes and interests were ignored pre-Burn. They fear the same thing will happen again if they rejoin the Federation which is why they wanted an exit clause. The hope is that this third party committee will step in and prevent the Federation Council from ignoring any individual member worlds or making policies that disenfranchise individual member worlds.

Right I get what you mean. Essentially they are moving to a 2 house parliament and senate model.
With a Starfleet officer at the head of the senate (who was also nominated by herself) this really should set of alarm bells with anyone worried about how dictatorships start

 

[Deks]

I'm sure I'm not the only one who tagged Callum as dead from the beginning. I understand the plot necessity of ignoring the magic-like tech of the 32nd century for story purposes, but why make it so obvious? I didn't really get anything out of Tilly's scramble. I would have preferred something horrible like a beam through his chest or something. Something that is clearly beyond emergency medical treatment.

Given the extreme passage of time, even emergency medical equipment would have to be capable of doing FAR more advanced procedures compared to what needed to be done in sickbay using an actual physician in the late 24th century.

In fact, I'd posit that most medical procedures which had to be done in sickbays leading up to say mid 29th century should have been doable in the field by the time the Burn happened.

That's kinda how things would work with extreme passage of time and automation. They had various pen like devices already in 24th century for treatment of burns and general dermal regeneration which could be operated by virtually anyone who can point the device.

Only more complex medical procedures (or at least those that would be considered 'complex' in 31st/32nd century terms) would (realistically) be done in sickbay using physicans and possibly in the field.

Otherwise, most of the 31st/32nd century emergency medical equipment would be capable of treating majority of severe issues much like a dermal regenerator of the 24th century could.

I'd prefer they creatde stories that take this into account.

Otherwise, good episode. I hope this was a backdoor pilot, because I will really miss Tilly. And I really like the cadets. I love the politics of reassembling the Federation, even if it's kind of absurd (the solution). Starfleet captains claiming they are not involved in politics. Are they unaware that they are representatives of a government? And as someone who has been dealing with grief for years, I really appreciate the care of the story with regards to Book. And echoing others in this thread, the acting of those two is excellent.

The usual ignoring of technology aside, I agree it was a relatively good send off for Tilly.
And this episode thankfully wasn't overloaded with emotional drivel.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Was this a backdoor pilot/proof of concept for that Starfleet Academy series? Starring Teacher Tilly??

2009 callbacks - the cadet uniforms and the Delta Vega ice monster(s), mixed in with hints of "Galileo Seven"

I was screaming about them not using their badges to beam to the ridge, but FAR too close to the resolution they explained the thunderstorm interfered with them.

Nice for the ice planet monsters to wait for Tilly's impromptu therapy session to conclude before resuming their approach.

By the end of the season I'm pretty sure it'll just be Michael, Book and 12 pending spin-off series'

 

[TimeIsAPredator]

Given the extreme passage of time, even emergency medical equipment would have to be capable of doing FAR more advanced procedures compared to what needed to be done in sickbay using an actual physician in the late 24th century.

In fact, I'd posit that most medical procedures which had to be done in sickbays leading up to say mid 29th century should have been doable in the field by the time the Burn happened.

That's kinda how things would work with extreme passage of time and automation. They had various pen like devices already in 24th century for treatment of burns and general dermal regeneration which could be operated by virtually anyone who can point the device.

Only more complex medical procedures (or at least those that would be considered 'complex' in 31st/32nd century terms) would (realistically) be done in sickbay using physicans and possibly in the field.

Otherwise, most of the 31st/32nd century emergency medical equipment would be capable of treating majority of severe issues much like a dermal regenerator of the 24th century could.

I'd prefer they creatde stories that take this into account.



The usual ignoring of technology aside, I agree it was a relatively good send off for Tilly.
And this episode thankfully wasn't overloaded with emotional drivel.

With programmable matter all you need is a little box that has an EMH and that little gun Tilly had. He could just holoproject a bed and everything, holo nurse the whole lot

 

[XCV330]

What exactly was achieved by Burnham's compromise ?
Now there will be a council of member worlds to look out for the interests of the member worlds in the Federation council which is a council of the member worlds that apparently wasn't looking out for the member worlds

That's how bureaucracies grow and develop. The solution was a probably-meaningless patch that will never be mentioned again and probably would have been watered down post-negotiations once Ni'Var rejoins as it would not want its own authority within the Federation to be constrained as a member world anymore than any of the others. By that time Trina's opposition will have been placated, negated, and relegated to concentrating on new issues. And if a few pensioned Starfleet officers and members of the Federation Board of Sanitation and Programmable Matter Inspectors get a nice sinecure at the end of their days, what's the harm? No one gets exactly what they want but everyone gets something .

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

With programmable matter all you need is a little box that has an EMH and that little gun Tilly had. He could just holoproject a bed and everything, holo nurse the whole lot

Speaking of EMH.

Where was the EMH on the shuttle?

If Crisotbal Rios can have a entire crew of Holograms to help him on his little ship.

Why doesn't every Shuttle/StarShip have their own set?

Every StarFleet Vessel/Shuttle should have a Emergency Hologram or LongTerm Hologram set as a full set of extra helpers.

Rios had these holograms that we know of:
Engineering, Hospitality, Medical, Navigational, & Tactical holograms;

Why shouldn't every StarFleet Vessel/Shuttle have one to help the users out?

I'm sure the poor student who died would've LOVED to have a EMH attend his wounds.

The EEH (Emergency Engineering Hologram) could've helped fix the shuttle.

The ETH (Emergency Tactical Hologram) should've been able to help out with dealing with the local planetary monster.

 

[nic3636]

Given the extreme passage of time, even emergency medical equipment would have to be capable of doing FAR more advanced procedures compared to what needed to be done in sickbay using an actual physician in the late 24th century.

In fact, I'd posit that most medical procedures which had to be done in sickbays leading up to say mid 29th century should have been doable in the field by the time the Burn happened.

That's kinda how things would work with extreme passage of time and automation. They had various pen like devices already in 24th century for treatment of burns and general dermal regeneration which could be operated by virtually anyone who can point the device.

Only more complex medical procedures (or at least those that would be considered 'complex' in 31st/32nd century terms) would (realistically) be done in sickbay using physicans and possibly in the field.

Otherwise, most of the 31st/32nd century emergency medical equipment would be capable of treating majority of severe issues much like a dermal regenerator of the 24th century could.

I'd prefer they creatde stories that take this into account.



The usual ignoring of technology aside, I agree it was a relatively good send off for Tilly.
And this episode thankfully wasn't overloaded with emotional drivel.

By the 29th century you would think everyone would have medical nanobots in their blood that automatically heal injury (maybe a Borg origin story). I get that they moved to the 31st century to get past all the canon which is fine, but I wish they portrayed the world more dystopian where technology actually took several steps back relative to the 24th century. If you advance the technology too much it becomes impossible to write a good story because the technology can solve any problem. It's like the Superman conundrum.

 

[XCV330]

Speaking of EMH.

Where was the EMH on the shuttle?

Season 4 medical consists of "he died". Doctor Culber is Counselor Culber. Doctor Pollard barely has a presence.