Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x07 - "Light and Shadows"

[Hythlodeus]

I honestly think there are fans who would eat it up. People seem more interested in Star Trek being "real" than it being "entertaining"

oh a show like that can be VERY entertaining if done right and realism seldom plays a role in that regard. One of my favourite DC comic series was a book called Gotham Central a police procedural comic-book series focused on the Gotham City Police Department and the difficulties of its officers living and working in Gotham City, home of Batman. While the cops did the hard work, ultimately it usual was a costumed super hero who solved the cases, but that doesn't mean it wasn't fun reading about the GCPD detectives.
Likewise, the TV show Powerless, also set in the DC universe, followed the non-adventures of the R&D departement of Wayne Security, a subsidiary of Wayne Enterprises. The show was actually pretty fun but was sadly cancelled after 9 episodes.

 

[JD]

To be honest - I don't think it's each individual case. It's the sum of them.
Like, if we had another character that has a tragic, unexplained past, and then we have an evil superspy on the show - I really wouldn't mind if they were connected. I think the original sin is connecting her this close to the franchises most popular character - Spock's adopted sister - in such a forced way. And once you put a spotlight on this trope - every single instance is going to be looked at critical, and if they continue to pile up at this rate, it's going to be laughable soon.

I really wish Leeland would have had this connection to another character - say, Stamets or Pike's past (in fact - him being responsible for something bad in Pike's past would actually make perfectly sense, them already having a backstory together).

I really think "Burnham as the main character of the show" should be more executed as "her doing the most important stuff every episode". Like early TNG-Riker was always the one doing the action, beaming down and stuff. And NOT "Burnham habving a personal backstory with every character and event in the show". That's okay for a few, limited instances. But every single one multiplies the weight on suspension of disbelief - it becomes harder and harder to take her backstory serious - and that's really not a burden you should put on your friggin' main character.

I really don't see where it's that bad. Sure she does have connections to the former Shenzou crew members, Georgiou and now Leland, but there are still plenty of other characters that she wasn't connected to before the series like Pike, Stamets, Tilly, Tyler, Culber, Owo, Bryce.

 

[Hythlodeus]

I understand what you're saying. I'm actually with you. I own all the reference materials and LOVE them! The encyclopedias (all versions), the tech manuals, the star charts, the chronology....all awesome stuff.

But, for whatever reason, the moment that stuff doesn't work any more, it doesn't bother me. I think I put myself in the third category...which is "I just want to enjoy what's on the screen." So, while I love my chronologies, Memory Alpha, and encyclopedias....I love the experience of simply watching the show or movie with an open mind even more.

same here

 

[fireproof78]

Someone should explain to you the human custom known as 'humour'. Then maybe you wouldn't have wasted your time typing up an uncalled-for, pissy response to a painfully obvious joke. Bye, now.

Ah, one of your human emotions.

 

[CommanderRaytas]

Ah, one of your human emotions.

I'm probably too much of a Herbert for that one, though. EDIT: Humour, I mean.

 

[matthunter]

OK, only read up to page 26 so if someone else posted similar I apologize (well, I'll find you and kill you in your sleep, but I'll feel bad about it) but!

S31's interest in Burnham and why Leland would be worried if she knew he killed/had killed her parents...

S31 could be operating on info from the future that states a child of Sarek would be of immense importance to the Federation. BUT they screwed up and the info meant Spock. Or, since Michael is vital to ensuring Spock gets back on an even keel, it's actually both of them but they can't tell which right now.

 

[Alan Roi]

oh a show like that can be VERY entertaining if done right and realism seldom plays a role in that regard. One of my favourite DC comic series was a book called Gotham Central a police procedural comic-book series focused on the Gotham City Police Department and the difficulties of its officers living and working in Gotham City, home of Batman. While the cops did the hard work, ultimately it usual was a costumed super hero who solved the cases, but that doesn't mean it wasn't fun reading about the GCPD detectives.
Likewise, the TV show Powerless, also set in the DC universe, followed the non-adventures of the R&D departement of Wayne Security, a subsidiary of Wayne Enterprises. The show was actually pretty fun but was sadly cancelled after 9 episodes.

At least we did get to see the rest of the Powerless season eventually. I would have been unhappy to have not been able to watch the episode where Lois Lane gets killed.

 

[Hythlodeus]

At least we did get to see the rest of the Powerless season eventually. I would have been unhappy to have not been able to watch the episode where Lois Lane gets killed.

Don't worry, Superman will once again turn back time to save her. So that's our chance to do what we want without consequences....what a fucking great premise for an episode

 

[Alan Roi]

Don't worry, Superman will once again turn back time to save her. So that's our chance to do what we want without consequences....what a fucking great premise for an episode

It was fucking awesome!

 

[Noname Given]

That's really not how it works...
That's stretching it even for fan-fiction.

Yeah, too bad they didn't do it like TNG - which never...oh, wait:
Remeber the connection between Picard and the Ferengi Damon Bok in TNG S1 - "The Battle" tyhe 9th episode aired?

From TNG S1 - "The Last Outpost":

Captain's log, stardate 41386.4. We are in pursuit of a starship of Ferengi design. Our mission is to intercept and recover a T9 energy converter which the Ferengi stole from an unmanned monitor post on Gamma Tauri Four. A theft which automatic scanners recorded, providing us with the long awaited opportunity to make close contact with a Ferengi vessel. If we succeed in this chase, it will be Starfleet's first look at a life form which, discounting rumour, we know almost nothing about.

And just three episodes later (From TNG S1 - "The Battle"):

PICARD [Stargazer log]: I admit I must have mistaken their subspace antenna for a weapons cluster. Unfortunately, I fired our main phasers and our direct hit destroyed the unknown vessel.

RIKER: I've assumed they've simulated your voice somehow. I've already put Data to work on it.

PICARD: Thank you, Will. I never made that log entry, of course, but it still leaves you with a duty to perform.

RIKER: I know, sir, I must report it to Starfleet. That's at least one full day for subspace communications to reach there.

PICARD: And one more full day for their answer to return. I'd like the truth on this by then. I'd hate to have to prepare a formal defence.

RIKER: I can't believe they'd ask for your command.

PICARD: Why wouldn't they? With the Ferengi making these friendship overtures, I could become a severe embarrassment to Starfleet.

RIKER: I'm certain the Ferengi are behind the faked log. No wonder they're waiting out there. Headache back, sir?

PICARD: Damn! I'll call the Doctor again.

RIKER: It's no wonder, with all this going on. Try to relax.
(Riker leaves)

PICARD [Stargazer log] This is a confession given by me, Jean-Luc Picard, commanding USS Stargazer, in the hopes that my belated honesty will be taken into account by Starfleet when judging my actions during a confrontation with an unidentified vessel.

We have Picard DIRECTLY tied to a particular Ferengi Daemon. Hell, he even returned to 'menace' Picard is TNG S7 - "Bloodlines" where Bok makes Picard believe he has a son (that Bok intends to kill) - and SOMEHOW Bok got command of a Ferengi ship but the ONLY reason his plan falls apart is that the Ferengi onboard somehow didn't know his criminal history; and they take Picard's word for what happened...
^^^
talk about 'bad fan fiction'...

 

[XCV330]

OK, only read up to page 26 so if someone else posted similar I apologize (well, I'll find you and kill you in your sleep, but I'll feel bad about it) but!

S31's interest in Burnham and why Leland would be worried if she knew he killed/had killed her parents...

S31 could be operating on info from the future that states a child of Sarek would be of immense importance to the Federation. BUT they screwed up and the info meant Spock. Or, since Michael is vital to ensuring Spock gets back on an even keel, it's actually both of them but they can't tell which right now.

Future Anti-Sarek-Descendant Commando Squad gave some shrooms to young Sybok for good measure

 

[TrickyDickie]

#2 - count me in

Okay.

 

[Gonzo]

Must admit I rather liked some of the supporting cast episodes, the Ferengi were always good for a laugh on DS9 and Garaks storylines were especially noteworthy.

I did find some of the Bajoran stuff boring though, that is the problem when you have to do over 20 episodes a year, its hard to keep it interesting all the time.

 

[XCV330]

Must admit I rather liked some of the supporting cast episodes, the Ferengi were always good for a laugh on DS9 and Garaks storylines were especially noteworthy.

I did find some of the Bajoran stuff boring though, that is the problem when you have to do over 20 episodes a year, its hard to keep it interesting all the time.

the problem with the Bajorans was a problem that would resurface a lot in the Berman era.. The idea was good but the show makers refused to commit. Over and over again when they came to the high dive, they just jumped of the side of the pool instead.

Bajorans should have been more alien. More fierce. More otherworldly. Instead they lived in the same low-pile discount-fabric costume world that every other TNG race evolved from. Nothing seemed all that desperate about them (with exceptions). How bad could the Cardassian occupation have been? So while I love DS9, yeah, the Bajoran episodes were usually sleepers.

Once in awhile they let the Bajorans be interesting, like when they suddenly as a race dropped what they were doing and switched jobs, etc because a messiah said so. More often than not they were humans with accordion noses (at least let them play their noses once in awhile, some kind of mating ritual. that would have been mildly interesting) then they suddenly came up with the pah wraiths and went from blandness to cartnoonishly awful.

 

[eschaton]

the problem with the Bajorans was a problem that would resurface a lot in the Berman era.. The idea was good but the show makers refused to commit. Over and over again when they came to the high dive, they just jumped of the side of the pool instead.

Bajorans should have been more alien. More fierce. More otherworldly. Instead they lived in the same low-pile discount-fabric costume world that every other TNG race evolved from. Nothing seemed all that desperate about them (with exceptions). How bad could the Cardassian occupation have been? So while I love DS9, yeah, the Bajoran episodes were usually sleepers.

Once in awhile they let the Bajorans be interesting, like when they suddenly as a race dropped what they were doing and switched jobs, etc because a messiah said so. More often than not they were humans with accordion noses (at least let them play their noses once in awhile, some kind of mating ritual. that would have been mildly interesting) then they suddenly came up with the pah wraiths and went from blandness to cartnoonishly awful.

DS9 didn't make the Cardassian occupation bad enough, IMHO. I mean, 15 million dead certainly sounds like a lot, but presuming Bejor had an earth-like population (in the billions) the overall casualty rate wasn't really all that high. It was supposed to be analogous to the Holocaust, and proportionally speaking was more analogous to the Algerian War of Independence.

 

[Kirk Prime]

Someone should explain to you the human custom known as 'humour'. Then maybe you wouldn't have wasted your time typing up an uncalled-for, pissy response to a painfully obvious joke. Bye, now

I understand the concept of humor, so my response would be to try being funny.

 

[DaveyNY]

No need to be so sensitive. I'm a Star Trek fan, so I'll post here... from time to time. Even if I'm not watching STD anymore.

Now you've got me confused...
You say you don't watch it, yet you post mockumentary and derogatory things that indicate that you do actually watch it... (though don't pay for it??)

Just seems like a very strange way to "enjoy" a supposedly preferred entertainment choice.

BTW: Might it be you are a bit sensitive about the show, since you find it necessary to tear it down just about every chance you get?
I was just curious as to your reasoning for watching something you say you don't like, but continue to apparently actually view each week.

 

[fireproof78]

I understand the concept of humor, so my response would be to try being funny.

Humor is subjective.

 

[oberth]

DS9 didn't make the Cardassian occupation bad enough, IMHO. I mean, 15 million dead certainly sounds like a lot, but presuming Bejor had an earth-like population (in the billions) the overall casualty rate wasn't really all that high. It was supposed to be analogous to the Holocaust, and proportionally speaking was more analogous to the Algerian War of Independence.

more like waco, tx - 15/6,000 isn't really much

the wholy bayorian stuff was kinda stOOpid. if they wanted it in any way like the shoah they needed at least a billion dead.

 

[DaveyNY]

There are two kinds of hardcore Star Trek fans: Those who like to read Memory Alpha, and those who like to read fanfic.

I will freely admit I'm the former. That said, I understand this is a minority position, and Trek cannot and should not cater to people like me.

Gees... I must really be nerd-weird case I like to do both....