Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x06 - "The Sound of Thunder"

[DEWLine]

Agent Tyler...he's what's physically left of Voq with the implanted memories of Ash Tyler running the body now. A new being, as it were.

Some in 2257 Starfleet might call it karma in action.

 

[Grendelsbayne]

Is this for certain? I don't think we have any official indication that Mount won't return.

Won't ever return? Maybe we don't. I could definitely see him being a recurring character. But I'm pretty sure it was stated up front that he's captain for this season only. Plus, you know, he's supposed to be on the Enterprise. This is only a temporary assignment.

I don't really read or watch Harry Potter, so you lost me a little here.

It's just a specific teaching job in the magic school. The character named Snape wants that job from the very beginning and it's a running joke that everyone who actually gets it turns out to be evil, incompetent or is otherwise forced to resign after a single year. Then, in the last year of the series, Snape actually gets his turn.

I agree there's no reason that it can't include Burnham and Saru. I just have no interest in that whatsoever. Burnham works uniquely as a lead of a Trek show who is not a captain, which was the entire point to begin with. Saru does nothing for me as a commanding officer. That doesn't mean I don't like the character. I just don't think he needs to be a Captain. I liked Counselor Troi...that didn't mean I wanted her to be a Captain.

I think there's a decent chance Burnham's promotion could be the end of the series arc, ie, series finale. So you may not actually see her in the position long term.

As for Saru, I have to disagree - going for command is a lot of the point of the character, especially now. Just keeping him in the background like Troi would be a waste of the character.

The only convincing reason is that it's not necessarily something I care to see. Has nothing to do with meeting standards of the past. Just a personal preference. I'm a human...I'd rather see humans in the captain positon...maybe some diverse human representation next time around.

I don't think that's a compelling reason, but, uh...

In the past, I would have said that it was a bad idea to make the Captain an alien because as the lead character, an alien is less identifiable to the audience than a human would be.

However, in the case of Discovery, the lead character isn't a Captain. Therefore, if Star Trek were to ever explore an alien captain, Discovery would be the place to do it.

Agreed, but even more than that, I'd argue Saru is probably the most identifiable, relatable and sympathetic alien we've ever seen. He's the perfect candidate precisely because his alienness does not get in the way of Doug Jones performance at all and because his character isn't burdened with a million cultural concepts like Klingon Honor(tm), Pon Farr, etc. And his biggest 'alien' shtick - the fear - is now gone and actually works pretty well as a metaphor for a developing officer.

 

[cooleddie74]

Maybe I’m missing something about Ash. After he was revealed to be a Klingon wearing a human skin suit, and then chose to live among the Klingons following L’Rell’s handwavy voodoo, why would Starfleet trust him for anything, even information about the Klingons? He seems like someone Section 31 would be torturing, not posting aboard Starfleet’s most secretive ship.

Section 31 cozied up to the Klingons to help them stablilize the Empire after the outbreak of the Augment Virus and that was at a time when tensions between humans and Klingons weren't all that much better following the disastrous first contact incident and shooting in Oklahoma and the run-ins between Archer's NX-01 and the Klingons. Section 31 clearly put at least some trust in the Klingons and it's probable that both Leland and Admiral Cornwell vouched for Ash and decided that since the Federation had just fought a war with the Klingon Empire that having a Klingon-Human hybrid who looked like a normal Terran male would be a big help in discerning the Empire's intentions and possible future military decisions.

If Section 31 has proven anything in every iteration of the organization we've seen is that they often do the opposite of what we'd expect from Earth or Federation intelligence agents supposedly operating in the names of peace and stability.

 

[oberth]

Section 31 cozied up to the Klingons to help them stablilize the Empire after the outbreak of the Augment Virus and that was at a time when tensions between humans and Klingons weren't all that much better following the disastrous first contact incident and shooting in Oklahoma and the run-ins between Archer's NX-01 and the Klingons. Section 31 clearly put at least some trust in the Klingons and it's probable that both Leland and Admiral Cornwell vouched for Ash and decided that since the Federation had just fought a war with the Klingon Empire that having a Klingon-Human hybrid who looked like a normal Terran male would be a big help in discerning the Empire's intentions and possible future military decisions.

If Section 31 has proven anything in every iteration of the organization we've seen is that they often do the opposite of what we'd expect from Earth or Federation intelligence agents supposedly operating in the names of peace and stability.

i still try to figure out where those s31-klingon ties came from, given the fact that nx-01 did all the running-in on them. in my humble opinion that's the big hole in the augment arc.

 

[cooleddie74]

Malcolm was probably feeding information to Harris for three years before he was exposed as an agent working for him.

 

[Guy Gardener]

They could have gone that way.

But there's a scene where Harris "activates" Reed who has been sleeping and forgtten about for a while.

He's outted 10 minutes into his first mission because he's a terrible spy and who ever designed the mission intentionally sacrificed Reed.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

Kaminar in Japanese means thunder so yay clever there writers.

 

[cooleddie74]

Yeah, I just remembered the scene were Harris contacts Malcolm and we learn the two haven't spoken in years. I guess that throws that theory out the airlock.

Section 31 could have gained access to Captain Archer's log entries about the Klingons since Enterprise's launch in 2151 and used those to construct an operation to infiltrate and then influence the Empire to the benefit of Earth, but that's the only other theory I can think of that makes sense and doesn't leave a gaping plot hole like the one oberth mentioned.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Harris comes off as a bad spy if he was trying to help the Klingons delethalize or overlethalize the augment virus while keeping Archer completely in the dark.

1. He wanted to conscript Archer, while having Archer think that this is all Archers plan and he had Archer over a barrel.

2. Harris wanted the Klingon empire in disarray but greatful to the Federation for Archer saving the day.



Which is the reverse of what the author thought was happening.

 

[oberth]

Yeah, I just remembered the scene were Harris contacts Malcolm and we learn the two haven't spoken in years. I guess that throws that theory out the airlock.

Section 31 could have gained access to Captain Archer's log entries about the Klingons since Enterprise's launch in 2151 and used those to construct an operation to infiltrate and then influence the Empire to the benefit of Earth, but that's the only other theory I can think of that makes sense and doesn't leave a gaping plot hole like the one oberth mentioned.

thank you for the flowers, but archer never met any of those particular klingons s31 was in bed with

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

Oh and found this, they grow here in Australia

https://sola.ai/solaoriginal/this-awesome-blue-mycean-mushroom-MDViMzl

Made me think of Discovery

 

[Vger23]

Won't ever return? Maybe we don't. I could definitely see him being a recurring character. But I'm pretty sure it was stated up front that he's captain for this season only. Plus, you know, he's supposed to be on the Enterprise. This is only a temporary assignment.



It's just a specific teaching job in the magic school. The character named Snape wants that job from the very beginning and it's a running joke that everyone who actually gets it turns out to be evil, incompetent or is otherwise forced to resign after a single year. Then, in the last year of the series, Snape actually gets his turn.



I think there's a decent chance Burnham's promotion could be the end of the series arc, ie, series finale. So you may not actually see her in the position long term.

As for Saru, I have to disagree - going for command is a lot of the point of the character, especially now. Just keeping him in the background like Troi would be a waste of the character.



I don't think that's a compelling reason, but, uh...



Agreed, but even more than that, I'd argue Saru is probably the most identifiable, relatable and sympathetic alien we've ever seen. He's the perfect candidate precisely because his alienness does not get in the way of Doug Jones performance at all and because his character isn't burdened with a million cultural concepts like Klingon Honor(tm), Pon Farr, etc. And his biggest 'alien' shtick - the fear - is now gone and actually works pretty well as a metaphor for a developing officer.

Yeah, we all have our opinions. I have mine! No desire to see Saru as captain. Don't see that changing!

 

[Succubint]

Fantastic fan art for the episode. Posters are at the bottom of the page. The two artists have been doing great posters for both seasons!

https://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/epsd-DSC2-6.php

 

[Hythlodeus]

for some reason my hype level today is very low, partly because too much is getting on in my life otherwise, partly because the trailer for todays episode was a little underwhelming and I kinda think we've been to Vulcan a little bit to often in the last decade. but honestly, I had low expectation for last weeks episode too and that turned out to be wrong.

 

[Tuskin38]

for some reason my hype level today is very low, partly because too much is getting on in my life otherwise, partly because the trailer for todays episode was a little underwhelming and I kinda think we've been to Vulcan a little bit to often in the last decade. but honestly, I had low expectation for last weeks episode too and that turned out to be wrong.

You're in the wrong thread.

 

[Hythlodeus]

You're in the wrong thread.

yeah, I realized that a couple of seconds ago.
man, I'm tired

 

[Timo]

thank you for the flowers, but archer never met any of those particular klingons s31 was in bed with

The fun thing here is Cornwell's statement that Archer and his crew walked on Qo'noS less than a century before 2257. For all we know, NX-01 really was S31's go-to resource for Klingon contact, and most of this came from adventures later than the "Demons"/"Terra Prime" one. For all we know, Reed really was their contact there. Possibly along with Archer, who may have agreed with S31's motivations even if not with their means.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Noname Given]

Don't think about it too hard, bringing Ash and Culber back was the writers not so subtly saying "Lets just all conveniently ignore season 1 okay"

So, when they brought back Spock with the Genesis Devive in STIII:TSFS...that was Harve Bennett saying:

"Let's all just convienently ignore STII:TWoK..."

I mean hell, it had continuity violations (Hey, Chekov wasn't a crewmember on the 1701 in TOS S1 - "Space Seed"); and ludicrous situations like a Federation Starship with sensors that CAN'T identify that a planet is missing from a cataloged Star System; can't detect that the planet's orbit isn't the same as previously recorded and can't detect the debris field of a full planetary explosion in said Star System...
^^^
yep, no wonder STII:TWoK is derided as one of the worst Trek feature films...oh, wait...

 

[fireproof78]

"Let's all just convienently ignore STII:TWoK..."

I wish I could

 

[Hythlodeus]

a Federation Starship with sensors that CAN'T identify that a planet is missing from a cataloged Star System; can't detect that the planet's orbit isn't the same as previously recorded and can't detect the debris field of a full planetary explosion in said Star System...

that was always a weird one..the Reliant's navigator and Science Division were rightfully massacred first by Khan's people. It was a mercy killing