Who is the better captain Picard or Jellico

[Mojochi]

When Riker tells him at the end he’s arrogant, closed-minded, needs to control everything and everyone, and doesn’t provide an atmosphere of trust or to inspire his crew to do their best, that’s significant. That’s what the character was about.

No. That's what Riker thinks Jellico is all about, Riker, who has already made it known he thought from the beginning that the guy should never have been given command in the 1st place, before he ever even met him. Riker's perspective couldn't be more biased, & he too is basing his critique on this one mission, just like all of the Jellico condemners do.

We saw Jellico at his best with the Cardassians.

That's an entirely baseless claim. We saw Jellico at the ONLY example of his leadership shown to us. That somehow people don't see it as unjust to base their entire critique of his whole career, on this singular crisis, is utterly baffling to me, especially when they decide to give a negative critique, when the result is entirely positive

I can give you singular examples of Picard's command where if I were to base his entire worth as a person & a commander on it, the conclusion could just as easily be distorted to suggest he too is a tyrant... namely how he completely disregards everything Geordi tells him in Ensigns of Command, instead continuing to demand an impossible result, to which Geordi is actually quoted as saying that such is the short definition of "Captain". If we based everything we claim about Picard on that one interaction, he is a jerk too, but we know better than that, because we have more context. So quick to condemn Jellico are we though, based on just as little

Jellico strikes me as someone the crew wouldn’t go that extra bit for, and, again, that’s a problem that he causes. You could tell Picard was being effected by the situation but with Jellico, it was just his standard operating procedure.

Also baseless. We don't know that this is his standard operating procedure for anything more than this one mission, with these highly irregular circumstances. It's not like anyone said he ASKED to be made the captain of the Enterprise. Picard was being reassigned, & they still wanted the ship "Enterprise" to handle the negotiations, & THEIR pick was him. This is a giant pile of unpleasantness being dumped in his lap, from top to bottom, on both sides of the negotiating table. That he can field that pitch at all is impressive

I also don't accept the All Good Things... example as being comparable. Picard is making odd & disturbing demands of a crew he knows. They don't know him yet, but he's from the future. He knows THEM. He is at half the disadvantage in that regard as Jellico is, & that's a generous estimate imho

Also, Picard heeded Lily’s personal criticism. He didn’t suck it up like Jellico did going to Riker for professional reasons (he needed Riker specifically if his plan was to work) and, again, to Jellico’s credit, he did suck it up.

He didn't need Riker specifically to make it work. Geordi himself said he could do it. He stood the best likelihood of total success by using Riker, because Riker was the best... not the only. If he was as small minded & petty, & awful at command as everyone is claiming he is, then surely he'd opt to use anybody else that could do it, but that's not his motive. The best potential success is

I think it could be argued that Jellico was partly using the "danger" factor as an excuse.

Why? Because we never see him let them all get into danger? Hallelujah imho. Picard was leaving any minute to illegally cross into their territory to spy, which they were anticipating, & were already waiting on an assault, with a fleet hidden in a nebula, not to mention the potential WMD that Picard is being sent to investigate, that could be unleashed at any time. Dude, everybody is already up to their neck in this crap, long before the dress uniforms were unmothballed for the ceremony. Any wasted time is wasted time, decreasing their potential for the best possible success, which I've already pointed out was Jellico's goal

 

[Locutus of Bored]

Also I meant keeping the peace. My phone likes to change my words When I use dictation. because I’m too lazy to type it all.

If you can't put in the basic minimum effort to communicate your ideas legibly with your fellow posters, why should they bother paying attention to what you say? This isn't a lack of education, a learning disorder, or a physical impairment according to you, you just don't want to be bothered with typing up your posts in a clear, concise manner. That shows a lack of respect for the other people you're talking to. It's also not very efficient if it causes misunderstandings or you have to go back and correct yourself frequently. Everyone makes typos or screws up sometimes, and that's fine. But at least they're trying.

 

[Gabriel]

If you can't put in the basic minimum effort to communicate your ideas legibly with your fellow posters, why should they bother paying attention to what you say? This isn't a lack of education, a learning disorder, or a physical impairment according to you, you just don't want to be bothered with typing up your posts in a clear, concise manner. That shows a lack of respect for the other people you're talking to. It's also not very efficient if it causes misunderstandings or you have to go back and correct yourself frequently. Everyone makes typos or screws up sometimes, and that's fine. But at least they're trying.

I was being sarcastic. When ever I use dictation I always proof it before I posted it. Is just this time I missed something. And I was just trying to make sure people know I meant something harmless because my phone put down something that was inappropriate. However I can see how my comment was wrong and I apologize.

 

[Voth commando1]

The thing with Jellico is that he was operating under a crunch, Picard is the sort of captain the crew would follow, they respect, trust and even adore him. Jellico didn't have time to try to develop that sort of rapport with the crew, was he doing his job? Yes but he was operating under understandably difficult conditions.

If I were any sort of SF personnel, Picard is the captain I'd most want to serve under, regardless, and I could easily see myself resenting Jellico, but from the outside one can understand why he is the way he is.

 

[Spot261]

Data.

 

[Infern0]

Bosses like Jellico "get things done"

But they also get a lot of people requesting transfers or quitting, sometimes for the better but other times they miss out on a rough diamond

 

[Discofan]

Bosses like Jellico "get things done"

But they also get a lot of people requesting transfers or quitting, sometimes for the better but other times they miss out on a rough diamond

We only saw Jellico under the worst of conditions. There was a crisis, time was of the essence, he was given a new crew, he had to change things around with a crew that didn't seem very adaptable.

In all good things, in the past when Picard first took command of the ship, he behaved then like a lunatic. No doubt that if Jellico had done the same things he would have been vilipended!!!

 

[Elephant999]

During times of War, a leader has to become more autocratic.

Jellico proved his negotiating skills were on point. I like Riker but he came across as a petulant child particularly following a reasonable order to change to a 4 shift system.

 

[Discofan]

During times of War, a leader has to become more autocratic.

Jellico proved his negotiating skills were on point. I like Riker but he came across as a petulant child particularly following a reasonable order to change to a 4 shift system.

The more I watch that episode the less Riker's attitude makes sense. It's as if he's trying to take revenge on Jellico (who maybe doesn't even like his new assignment) for having been chosen as a replacement for Picard instead of him!!!

 

[Admiral2]

You know what? Next time one of these threads pops up, I'm going to save myself some typing and just re-link this:

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[Discofan]

You know what? Next time one of these threads pops up, I'm going to save myself some typing and just re-link this:

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It's like that guy read my mind!!!

 

[Makarov]

In all good things, in the past when Picard first took command of the ship, he behaved then like a lunatic. No doubt that if Jellico had done the same things he would have been vilipended!!!

Based on what we saw of Jellico's leadership he probably wouldn't have been able to inspire them to take that leap of faith. Meanwhile Picard was able to do that with strangers many times in the series.

 

[Admiral2]

Based on what we saw of Jellico's leadership he probably wouldn't have been able to inspire them to take that leap of faith. Meanwhile Picard was able to do that with strangers many times in the series.

Based on what we saw of Jellico's leadership, it would never have gotten to "All Good Things" because, much like Ben Sisko, he would have bitch-slapped Q ages ago and would only have to have dealt with him that one time.

 

[Gabriel]

Based on what we saw of Jellico's leadership, it would never have gotten to "All Good Things" because, much like Ben Sisko, he would have bitch-slapped Q ages ago and would only have to have dealt with him that one time.

That’s one of the reasons I respect Jellico and that’s one the reasons Sisko is my favorite captain.

 

[Discofan]

That’s one of the reasons I respect Jellico and that’s one the reasons Sisko is my favorite captain.

If it was Sisko instead of Jellico, he would have punched Riker in the face!

(Edison, Garak, and Q can vouch for that.)

 

[Nyotarules]

I don’t think picard would say that. He thinks I’m self as an explorer. As said in nemesis. Now Jellico I doubt he would deny the fact that he’s a warrior.

Probably explains why the cruise ship Enterprise avoided the Cardassian war and the Dominion war. Picard is not a soldier

Picard has only moments to avoid the destruction of humanity, but takes the time to get the (bridge) crew on board

Picard is operating from a position of knowledge about the crew, he knows them, they do not know him. Its a different situation. Riker was acting up because Jellico was not Picard, plus he did not get the top seat.

 

[Makarov]

Based on what we saw of Jellico's leadership, it would never have gotten to "All Good Things" because, much like Ben Sisko, he would have bitch-slapped Q ages ago and would only have to have dealt with him that one time.

Or Q takes one look at Jellico and wipes out humanity because there's no joy in anything

 

[Gabriel]

If it was Sisko instead of Jellico, he would have punched Riker in the face!

(Edison, Garak, and Q can vouch for that.)

Pretty sure about that

 

[Gabriel]

Or Q takes one look at Jellico and wipes out humanity because there's no joy in anything

I doubt Q thinks like Riker.

 

[Doc Mugatu]

I think there should have been a fifth option for the poll, "Situational." That's my answer anyway. Truth be told the worst thing that could happen to any organization would be to have a stockpile of just one type of leader or, in this case, starship captains therefore to ask which one is better is predicated on an invalid proposition. Picard, I would say, is better for a mission of exploration and diplomacy. Captain Jellico would be preferred in the maintenance and enforcement of order. Jellico would be better at fighting a war while Picard would be better at negotiating it's end. In most instances being decisive is better than being right. Jellico is more of a disciplinarian while Picard is less so. Neither is necessarily right or wrong. So long as the captain's are consistent and uniform in their respective approaches both could be, and probably would be, just as effective in their governance of their ships.