Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x04 - "An Obol for Charon"

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Stamets has apparently never been intended to be the "proper" Chief Engineer.

A display in "Choose Your Pain" (DSC) did list him by that title:

But according to Ted Sullivan, that was "a flub." (Nevertheless, as it was prominently seen onscreen, we might posit that Stamets did act in that capacity during the time when the ship's primary mission was to get the spore drive working.)

-MMoM

Or like the early voyages of the Enterprise-D, the Discovery has multiple chief engineers and assistant chiefs. Stamets was chief engineer of the Spore Drive. The other chief is the one for the warp drive.

 

[GMSkarka]

I love linus!!! I want to see a caitian now!

“I had a cold last week. It SUCKED. ...Saurian: six nasal passages.” More Linus, please!

 

[Nyotarules]

20 somethings who like Beethoveen?

Liking Beethoven is one thing, (I like classical music, I like all sorts of music, most of it composed in my life time) but I suspect the average 20 something year old would not have Ode to joy as their top ten favourite piece of music. When was the last time it was on the US billboards or UK Top 20 downloads?
Tilly was not asked 'sing something you like', she was asked 'sing your favourite song' and she picked something 300 years old, she might as well have sung Amazing Grace.

 

[ALF]

Was this a 'bottle show'?
I don't recall any new sets and they didn't leave the ship.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Do you actually need to pay for usage rights if a character sings a few lines of a pop song barely in key, with no musical accompaniment?

It’s the very reason “Happy Birthday” wasn’t sung in “Parallels”. Curiously, they’d end up having it sung for Bashir later on.

 

[GMSkarka]

Liking Beethoven is one thing, but I suspect the average 20 something year old would not have Ode to joy as their top ten favourite piece of music. When was the last time it was on the US billboards or UK Top 20 downloads?

Counter-example: In 1976, "A Fifth of Beethoven", a version of Beethoven's Fifth Symphony, by Walter Murphy, went to #1 in the US, 172 years after the symphony's debut.

It hit the charts again 26 years later when Robin Thicke added some lyrics to it, and released it as "When I Get You Alone." That's 198 years after the original.

So... just saying: Does happen.

 

[Amaris]

...
So you could not connect to TOS when it made up its own music, in the few musical scenes it had, it disconnected you from the story did it? I don't know whether Bowie's music will be timeless, cos none of us will be around in 2256 to find out. Liking music 50 years old is still within the life time of most living humans, liking music that is 300 years old will not be, so your comparison is not the same.
But would be a shame if under a United Earth its major musical influence still came from the British or American 20th century top 40. Next time have someone sing something from Jimmy Cliff, Bob Marley or Hugh Masekala, or something from Asia. Show that fictional future humans might have some cultural differences, rather than Earth's humanity turns into a global America.

None of this explains why it's out of order for Tilly to consider "Space Oddity" one of her favorite songs.

 

[XCV330]

Liking Beethoven is one thing, but I suspect the average 20 something year old would not have Ode to joy as their top ten favourite piece of music. When was the last time it was on the US billboards or UK Top 20 downloads?
Tilly was not asked 'sing something you like', she was asked 'sing your favourite song' and she picked something 300 years old, she might as well have sung Amazing Grace.

Oddly, i can answer that, I think.
1993
Sister Act 2 soundtrack with Lauren Hill.


I do wish they'd move away from 20th/21st century references. it's been fun but really, they can move on.

 

[Lord Garth]

Liking Beethoven is one thing, but I suspect the average 20 something year old would not have Ode to joy as their top ten favourite piece of music. When was the last time it was on the US billboards or UK Top 20 downloads?

The best possible thing I can think of is they know the songs like we know the songs from the 19th Century. I know "Home On the Range" but it's definitely NOT one of my favorites. I think music that's survived 50 years will survive into the future but it's more a song everyone knows than what they go out of their way to listen to.

Tilly's favorite music, I'd think, would be from the 2230s-2250s. Maybe she likes some of her parents' music. That would still make it all 23rd Century. That's what would make sense at face-value.

Maybe "Space Oddity" is one of her favorite songs from school.

 

[Nyotarules]

Counter-example: In 1976, "A Fifth of Beethoven", a version of Beethoven's Fifth Symphony, by Walter Murphy, went to #1 in the US, 172 years after the symphony's debut.

It hit the charts again 26 years later when Robin Thicke added some lyrics to it, and released it as "When I Get You Alone." That's 198 years after the original.

So... just saying: Does happen.

Exceptions to the rule are not The rule

 

[Nyotarules]

Oddly, i can answer that, I think.
1993
Sister Act 2 soundtrack with Lauren Hill.


I do wish they'd move away from 20th/21st century references. it's been fun but really, they can move on.

Thank you, that is my point!

 

[cooleddie74]

I was kind of hoping that the song Tilly sang would be something like, say, a Jim Croce standard with deep emotional resonance. "I Got A Name" is eminently singable and sounds beautiful and would have been a way to give a nod to a lesser-known musical artist of the 20th century, but hey, I get using a Bowie song because it is so much more well-known and popular.

 

[GMSkarka]

Exceptions to the rule are not The rule

And pedantic fanboys who don't have the class to admit that they were mistaken in their assumption, when provided with an answer to their direct question, are, and always have been, tiresome.

We get it. You didn't like the 20th-century music reference. That fact has been established. It is, also, based entirely on your own tastes, and not something you're going to be declared "right" about. Move on, maybe?

 

[Nyotarules]

The best possible thing I can think of is they know the songs like we know the songs from the 19th Century. I know "Home On the Range" but it's definitely NOT one of my favorites. I think music that's survived 50 years will survive into the future but it's more a song everyone knows than what they go out of their way to listen to.

Tilly's favorite music, I'd think, would be from the 2230s-2250s. Maybe she likes some of her parents' music. That would still make it all 23rd Century.

Maybe "Space Oddity" is one of her favorite songs from school.

Exactly, even music from the ENT era would be way old, over 100 years old and would be her great grand parents music. If I started singing White Cliffs of Dover by Vera Lynn (an English singer who is 101 years old) as my favourite song my peers would find that unusual and I'm over 50.

 

[Burning Hearts of Qo'nos]

It is pretty far fetched that 20/21st century music would still be that popular, but not completely far fetched that it would at least be known and enjoyed by some. We've only just entered the digital age of music and between now and 300 years from now it won't be hard to find and listen to all the music ever made during that period. It's still a bit goofy though. But also, what if its only Stamets and Tilly that like these old-oldies...that would be pretty cute in itself.

It could be that every time he mentions a Beatles cover band, literally no one in the room besides him and Tilly knows what he's talking about. For all we know, when Tilly and Stamets are singing together (also, so stupid cute I couldn't stand it, gimme more please) Reno was just standing there, 'WTF century are these two weirdos from?'

 

[Nyotarules]

And pedantic fanboys who don't have the class to admit that they were mistaken in their assumption, when provided with an answer to their direct question, are, and always have been, tiresome.

We get it. You didn't like the 20th-century music reference. That fact has been established. It is, also, based entirely on your own tastes, and not something you're going to be declared "right" about. Move on, maybe?

Sure as soon at says 'Moderator' on your tag line.

 

[Amaris]

Thank you, that is my point!

Renaissance Fairs.

 

[Greg Cox]

I think character credit royalties only apply when the character was written for TV, and if used again in TV that specific writer who created the character would be paid. I don't think the same applies to books or comics, since that is licensed out by the studio itself and whatever is created for those books and comics is already owned by the studio and not by the writers themselves. I could also very easily be wrong about this.

You are correct. Tie-in works, whether they be novels or comics, are generally done on a work-for-hire basis. Which means the author is a hired contractor who does NOT own the copyright on the finished work. It's like being a carpenter and building a porch for somebody; doesn't mean you own the porch or have any say in what's done with it afterwards.

All STAR TREK books and comics are copyrighted in the name of CBS or Paramount or whomever, NOT in the name of the writer or the publisher, which means the contents belong to STAR TREK, who can do with them as they please. (This is not unique to STAR TREK; it's how pretty much all licensed products work.)

TV writing is different because TV writers are unionized.

So, yes, characters in STAR TREK comics belong to STAR TREK, period. No payments would need to be made to any other entity.

 

[Kor]

You are correct. Tie-in works, whether they be novels or comics, are generally done on a work-for-hire basis. Which means the author is a hired contractor who does NOT own the copyright on the finished work. It's like being a carpenter and building a porch for somebody; doesn't mean you own the porch or have any say in what's done with it.

All STAR TREK books and comics are copyrighted in the name of CBS or Paramount or whomever, NOT in the name of the writer or the publisher, which means the contents belong to STAR TREK, who can do with they as they please. (This is not unique to STAR TREK; it's how pretty much all licensed products work.)

TV writing is different because TV writers are unionized.

So, yes, characters in STAR TREK comics belong to STAR TREK, period. No payments would need to be made to any other entity.

Thanks for the clarification @Greg Cox.

Kor

 

[Nyotarules]

It is pretty far fetched that 20/21st century music would still be that popular, but not completely far fetched that it would at least be known and enjoyed by some. We've only just entered the digital age of music and between now and 300 years from now it won't be hard to find and listen to all the music ever made during that period. It's still a bit goofy though. But also, what if its only Stamets and Tilly that like these old-oldies...that would be pretty cute in itself.

It could be that every time he mentions a Beatles cover band, literally no one in the room besides him and Tilly knows what he's talking about. For all we know, when Tilly and Stamets are singing together (also, so stupid cute I couldn't stand it, gimme more please) Reno was just standing there, 'WTF century are these two weirdos from?'

Would make a funny scene and make sense for the time period, but after that 'lets dance to the 300 year music' scene from Season 1, I doubt the writers can think outside the box when it comes to cultural influences.