Star Trek: Phase II (the original)

[TREK_GOD_1]

"The Making of Star Trek: The Motion Picture" listed the short list of candidates for Decker. One of them was a young Andrew Robinson (the future Garak) .

Good he did not get the role. At the time, Robinson was very well known as the "Killer" from the original Dirty Harry (Warner Brothers, 1971), so i'm not sure his turning up as Decker would have been anything other than a visual distraction for a public that remembered the villain from a big movie then only a few years old.

 

[Forbin]

There's a difference between work-for-hire as in a staff writer like Coon, whose script ideas and characters created for the show become the property of the studio and freelancers submitting scripts, who have what are called "separation rights". It's a complicated relationship. For instance, Norman Spinrad sold his script "He Walks Among Us" to Star Trek in the 60s and it was never produced, but when he tried to self-publish it a few years ago he was stopped by IP owners because it's Star Trek, but if CBS were to produce anything based on that script even today they'd still have to pay him. This all exists because of UNIONS. The WGA is a very powerful force in Hollywood because no scripts no movies, so they negotiate contracts with the studios to protect the writers to make sure they are properly compensated for their work and derivatives of their work.

One of my coworkers in our art department was asked to create a series of cleanliness posters for the building. He came up with a cartoon character, a cat who was a janitor, who groused about how messy things were and told us to keep the rest rooms clean. The actual cleaning staff took it as an insult that they weren't doing their jobs, bitched about it, and there was never a second poster. So my coworker asked if he could develop and market the character himself and maybe make some extra money on the side. He got a call from the corporate lawyers quickly. The cat was created on the job, the company owns him. If you try to sell him outside the company, you're fired, sued and screwed.

So that's how young, naive me learned about work for hire.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

We knew the ship sank, we didn't know the fate of the characters, since they were actually made up for the movie.

Hi, Bill. We did know her fate in Titanic.

I was saying that T'Pol should not have been named T'Pau because then we'd know that she could never die in Star Trek Enterprise, because we see T'Pau as an old lady in "Amok Time." And I joked that that's why Titanic was a flop.

You're correct that Jack and Rose were fictional characters, but we knew from her first moment that Rose could not die in the shipwreck, because we see her as an old lady in the "present day" scenes. Same idea, and of course it didn't hurt the film.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

One of my coworkers in our art department was asked to create a series of cleanliness posters for the building. He came up with a cartoon character, a cat who was a janitor, who groused about how messy things were and told us to keep the rest rooms clean. The actual cleaning staff took it as an insult that they weren't doing their jobs, bitched about it, and there was never a second poster. So my coworker asked if he could develop and market the character himself and maybe make some extra money on the side. He got a call from the corporate lawyers quickly. The cat was created on the job, the company owns him. If you try to sell him outside the company, you're fired, sued and screwed.

So that's how young, naive me learned about work for hire.

When Harry Mudd came back, the episode was written by the same writer.

When Kevin Riley came back, it was a different writer, but the first writer had been employed by Star Trek as a story consultant, so Riley would be owned by the series.

It all checks out.

 

[johnnybear]

I think Kevin Riley turns up in the novel The Galactic Whirlpool doesn't he?
JB

 

[Pauln6]

When I think about all the great potential recurring characters that have been wasted in this way, it makes me sad.

 

[psCargile]

Well anyway, I like that warp core.

 

[Therin of Andor]

i'm not sure his turning up as Decker would have been anything other than a visual distraction for a public that remembered the villain from a big movie then only a few years old.

Typecasting.

I think Kevin Riley turns up in the novel The Galactic Whirlpool doesn't he?
JB

Numerous great appearances in the fiction:
https://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Kevin_Riley

 

[Pauln6]

Yeah Robinson doesn't exude corn-fed wholesome hero like Thomerson does. Bruce Boxleitner was a fraction too young and unknown. Maybe Parker Stevenson from the Hardy Boys ?

 

[Henoch]

Typecasting.

Typecasting is such an alien concept for Star Trek actors.

Maybe Parker Stevenson from the Hardy Boys ?

or David Cassidy...

 

[JonnyQuest037]

I think I have heard of them somewhere before, yes, but they ain't Trek are they, Jonny?

You said "Beat that," not "Beat that with another example from Star Trek."

I think Kevin Riley turns up in the novel The Galactic Whirlpool doesn't he?

Yes. He's on the contact team, a specialized team of folks whose job it is to be on the landing parties/boarding parties for any first contacts the Enterprise makes. The TNG concept of the Captain staying on the ship while others go take the risks originated with Gerrold.

 

[STEPhon IT]

Is there anyway of getting access to Norman Spinrad's Star Trek script "He Walks Among Us"? Just to read it.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Typecasting.

Typecasting is a real thing, which is why Robinson often played villains in the reminder of that decade, such as his appearances in two Marvel TV series: The Incredible Hulk ("Life and Death" - 5/12/78) and The Amazing Spider-Man ("The Con Caper" - 11/25/78). Typecasting might not be a fair practice, but its the hand dealt to many actors--including Robinson, the very reason he may have been seen as a distraction as innocent good guy Decker.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Is there anyway of getting access to Norman Spinrad's Star Trek script "He Walks Among Us"? Just to read it.

It is definitely around as a bootleg!

Norman Spinrad even put up a digital copy for sale once, but was ordered to take it down. IIRC, there was a plan to produce it as a fan film, with Spinrad directing, which is what brought this version to Paramount's attention.
https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/he-walks-among-us-lost-spinrad-script.162760/

Typecasting is a real thing...

Yes, I know. That's why I mentioned it. Really good actors can sometimes thwart it and Robinson is a bit of a chameleon in his roles.

 

[johnnybear]

He was also Larry Cotton in the Hellraiser franchise! Appearing in the first movie (1987) and he had filmed scenes for that film that were later put into the second although he was told he wasn't required for the second instalment! Hellbound (1989)
JB

 

[Marsden]

He was also Larry Cotton in the Hellraiser franchise! Appearing in the first movie (1987) and he had filmed scenes for that film that were later put into the second although he was told he wasn't required for the second instalment! Hellbound (1989)
JB

Something cool about him being in Hellraiser, he played a nice guy but when his evil brother stole his skin he played a bad guy, too.

 

[Delta Vega]

They could have cast David Cassidy as Decker
Instead of the plank of wood that got the part eventually
Cassidy, in the wake of The Partridge Family, and loads of hits, would have got a fair amount of young teenagers (girls) watching

 

[Henoch]

They could have cast David Cassidy as Decker
Instead of the plank of wood that got the part eventually
Cassidy, in the wake of The Partridge Family, and loads of hits, would have got a fair amount of young teenagers (girls) watching

Exactly. If Laurie Partridge could go on play a lawyer, then why not Keith Partridge as a 1st Officer. Cassidy was playing to sold out stadiums in 1974, but he took it hard when girl got killed in a stampede at a London concert. But in 1978, Cassidy starred in an episode of Police Story titled "A Chance to Live", for which he was nominated for an Emmy Award. He was available and he could act. He was in his mid-twenties, so, he would have to be a young rising officer like Kirk was.

 

[diankra]

It is definitely around as a bootleg!

Norman Spinrad even put up a digital copy for sale once, but was ordered to take it down. IIRC, there was a plan to produce it as a fan film, with Spinrad directing, which is what brought this version to Paramount's attention.
https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/he-walks-among-us-lost-spinrad-script.162760/



Yes, I know. That's why I mentioned it. Really good actors can sometimes thwart it and Robinson is a bit of a chameleon in his roles.

IIRC, Robinson was dubious about Empok Nor because the controlled Garak effectively became a serial killer, and he'd been trying for ages to escape that typecasting.

 

[Maurice]

They could have cast David Cassidy as Decker
Instead of the plank of wood that got the part eventually
Cassidy, in the wake of The Partridge Family, and loads of hits, would have got a fair amount of young teenagers (girls) watching

He was old hat by 1978. Teen hearththrobs have a short shelf life.