Would you consider Sarek a key character of TOS?
Sarek, played by James Frain
- Thread starter Balok's Decoy
- Start date
Whoops. Now it seems like I'm just copying your post
No, not at all. He was in just one TOS episode. Doesn't key character mean, that the character will be one of the main cast?
Okay, they've got sarek, where's Gav?
My disappointment with CBS continues to grow.Also some bad news that will surely upset people. EW is reporting that DSC's premiere date got pushed back again. No official word on a new date. They're speculating the fall. I'm not going to freak out over this just yet, but at this point, shit why not just bring back Fuller then?
Link: http://ew.com/tv/2017/01/18/star-trek-discovery-spock-premiere-date/
Not necessarily. And Sarek became a bigger player in the Trek universe through his recurring appearances in the movies.
Kor
"A delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is forever bad."
I'll take multiple delays over a rushed mess. Can't really be disappointed.
I'll take multiple delays over a rushed mess. Can't really be disappointed.
Also some bad news that will surely upset people. EW is reporting that DSC's premiere date got pushed back again. No official word on a new date. They're speculating the fall. I'm not going to freak out over this just yet, but at this point, shit why not just bring back Fuller then?
They're pushing back the premiere date, not filming. Presumably, this delay is to accommodate post-production more than anything else, which wouldn't have given Fuller any more time to work on the scripts.
There are somewhere between 120-150 member species spread out over a thousand words in TOS. No canon population in TOS I know of but a hundred years later the estimated casualties of a drawn out dominion war is 900 billion, and that still leaves enough of a population base to eventually re organize and successfully rebel against the Dominion.
So let's say a conservative estimated population of 1 trillion among 120 species on a thousand worlds at the time of Discovery. Seems fair since humans alone are approaching 7 billion on one world 250 years earlier.
And yet both series having cross over characters, ambassadors or not, still doesn't seem small worldy?
So let's say a conservative estimated population of 1 trillion among 120 species on a thousand worlds at the time of Discovery. Seems fair since humans alone are approaching 7 billion on one world 250 years earlier.
And yet both series having cross over characters, ambassadors or not, still doesn't seem small worldy?
No, not really. Vulcan is a key player in the Federation, second only to Earth, and a founding member. Sarek is their ambassador. It is perfectly... logical.
I'm disappointed. Mark Lenard was perfect as Sarek. He had very little character development, which means I can fill in the blanks with my own head canon.
I didn't enjoy the direction they took the Vulcans in Enterprise and am concerned that if they play too much with the character it could be a letdown.
I would much rather a whole new cast. Take Voyager. Some like it, some hate it. Because it's removed from other series, it's easy to ignore if you don't like it.
I didn't enjoy the direction they took the Vulcans in Enterprise and am concerned that if they play too much with the character it could be a letdown.
I would much rather a whole new cast. Take Voyager. Some like it, some hate it. Because it's removed from other series, it's easy to ignore if you don't like it.
Well look at it this way. I went to a big college and people would sometimes ask me how I saw anyone or figured out where I was. And the answer is simple: Even though the school is big, I only used a handful of buildings and hung out with people in my dorm. I didn't see most of the school on a regular basis.
Similar with Starfleet. Sure they go seeking new worlds, new civilizations, etc. But Vulcan and Earth are friends and live in the same dorm, so to speak. The movers and shakers in that alliance are bound to run into each other.
.4% of the US pop actively serves in the military. Since the Federation doesn't have a "military" assume the same in Starfleet.
Hell, let's half that.
And then half it again. Why not? Say only .01%
That's 1 BILLION active Starfleet officers.
That's a big college dorm.
It comes down to what ship and which characters the creators decide to focus on. This is a story about the Discovery, which happened to have interactions with Sarek. They could have picked a different ship, out of thousands of Starfleet vessels, which didn't have interactions with him, but maybe interacted with other characters we've seen. It's not weird that Sarek would have hung out with Starfleet in some capacity. The show we're getting just so happens to take place on a ship that he encountered. It's not a small universe, it's a creative decision to focus on this ship.
It comes down to what ship and which characters the creators decide to focus on. This is a story about the Discovery, which happened to have interactions with Sarek. They could have picked a different ship, out of thousands of Starfleet vessels, which didn't have interactions with him, but maybe interacted with other characters we've seen. It's not weird that Sarek would have hung out with Starfleet in some capacity. The show we're getting just so happens to take place on a ship that he encountered. It's not a small universe, it's a creative decision to focus on this ship.
Fair enough. I just don't see it that way.
I see that in a Starfleet with a billion members serving a population of a trillion people made up of 120 different species dispersed over a thousand worlds every story worth telling for four decades (in universe time) across two TV shows and two different film franchises ends up being connected to the same small group of people.
To me, that's small universe
Which is why we saw Admiral McCoy touring the Ent-D? Why we saw Picard and Sisko at the beginning of DS9? Or all the times the Enterprise was the "only ship in the quadrant/sector/district/whatever" when Starfleet is "so big?"
As far as writing plausibility goes, Star Trek has always operated on a smaller scale. Kelvin universe gets lambasted for the idea, the Mirror Universe has almost all the same players interacting, Picard attended "Sarek's son's wedding" and on and on it goes.
So, it's not really anything new.
I didn't say it was new. I said I didn't like it
It's everywhere in fiction and it seems a lazy way out to me, as well as breaking the suspension of disbelief.
Lots of people love it though.
If the story is good and can make it work, what's the harm?I didn't say it was new. I said I didn't like it
It's everywhere in fiction and it seems a lazy way out to me, as well as breaking the suspension of disbelief.
Lots of people love it though.
It lessens the story for me. It ruins my suspension of belief. And, cynically, often the connections seem to be forced in for "shock" value or economic reasons when other, better, new options exist. It also restricts the story - no longer is there a fresh and new opportunity to explore - now the writers are beholden to existing characterization and histories. Or they're forced to re-write said characterizations and histories to tell new stories, rendering the point of connecting to existing characters moot.
Discovery promised new ships and new crews. A week from filming and of the few characters reveals, we've already got one who has been described as key and has already been in three TV series' and two film franchises spawning 50 real time years. That's hardly new.
Hence my disappointment.
I'm well aware a lot of people disagree on this, that's the nature of art. I'm not arguing that you or @Balok's Decoy or any of the others excited for the connection are wrong - it just doesn't work for me and seems a waste of a new opportunity to body go where no one has gone before.
