Star Trek: Axanar
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And sound is one of those things that's not an issue of budget. In fact, most of what fanfilms suffer from is not an issue of budget. Good framing, good lighting, good sound.... they just take the slightest amount of effort to get right.
to be fair it takes minimal effort for trained pros. when you're learning as you go it's not easy.
I don't like being disagreeable, but with the vast number of really good no-budget filmmaking tutorials online for beginners, there really isn't an excuse for getting the basics wrong. Even if it's the very first video you've ever made, you can look up how to do basic lighting and sound, and with no filmmaking skills at all - just following the instructions - you can make something decent. I've assisted in filmmaking classes where that was entirely true - kids who never touched a camera could make good stuff in just three hours of class time.
And personally, my movies shot up in quality overnight when I realized, "hey, I can just look up how to do this stuff online!"
And personally, my movies shot up in quality overnight when I realized, "hey, I can just look up how to do this stuff online!"
Well, not to go toooooo far off topic from Axanar—which I suspect will not suffer the aforementioned sound issues—I think most of these films that do suffer from it are simply because the filmmakers are enthusiasts who think "point and shoot", but never really study the first thing about cinematography or sound.
Axanar won't have that problem because they have professionals in front of and behind the cameras. Anything less would be a severe disappointment, but like I said it's not going to happen. I compare most fan films to what used to be called "Little Theater": you're going to get some productions that are surprisingly good and some that are ok and some that are cringe-inducingly bad. Then there will be some that are a mixture of both. Trying to judge all fan productions against professional standards is just being an asshole in my humble opinion.
I guess part of it comes down to budget. Do you have the resources to have a large studio space so that you can have all sets standing and not cramped into a garage? Do you have the resources to make the stage sound proof - to get the right mics, camera, lights? Is your production on a level to attract people that know how to handle these things - pro or not.
Of course it is essential to know how to handle all of that, but if you have to work with amateur equipment, chances are much higher your product will suffer in the end. So I see a definitive advantage just because of their budget for well funded shows like Axanar or STC.
Of course it is essential to know how to handle all of that, but if you have to work with amateur equipment, chances are much higher your product will suffer in the end. So I see a definitive advantage just because of their budget for well funded shows like Axanar or STC.
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I think the point is that doing sound well sounds like it is absolutely feasible for the production team that cares as much about doing sound well as it does getting the costumes, sets, and props "accurate." The trick isn't the work, or the know-how. The trick is to actually care.
You got us dead to rights. The problems with our sound--like so many of our production's numerous shortcomings--is not so much that our sound people don't care about their jobs. (They don't, of course.) But the low-level underlings on our cast and crew take their cues from us the Producers--and the larger overarching problem is that *we* just don't care all that much.
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J'accuse! I knew it! *rushes to call The Daily Planet*
Um.... was anyone talking about you guys, or was this a more general comeback about the accusation that some people do "not care"?
Sure, Phase II has had some sound issues. TTI has some too (one scene in particular makes me wince). But the fact is that while a few do make an serious effort in the sound dept. many do not, and neither record nor mix the shows well. In many cases it's innocent novice ignorance, but in some long running shows with decent photography and decent almost-everything-else, it's harder to excuse.
It was a general comeback about the accusation that some people and productions simply "do not care."
In post #1620 of this thread, Karzak indicated:
"Sound in particular seems to be a challenge for most fan films. I guess what I'm saying is I'd prefer a movie I can hear and understand vs. one with perfectly recreated sets."
I actually don't know if our Phase II production is included in Karzak's "most" fan film category--nor do I know if ours is the production with "perfectly recreated sets" that is challenged by sound issues due to simply "not caring" to which he alludes. Of course, he can weigh in on who specifically he might have meant if he wishes--if he wants to clarify the matter.
I don't think it's necessary to specify any single fan film. I certainly wasn't specifically talking about NEw Voyages alone or at all. 99% of the fan films all have bad sound because as you yourself said, nobody cares.
That is, you don't care until it comes time to deal with the people who point out "Wow, the sound is terrible on this thing." Then suddenly, let's trumpet out all the reasons why the bad, horrible sound which detracts exponentially the enjoyment of said film should be excused.
The fact is if all of the groups spent as much time on their sound as they do on things like recreating the sets, props, makeup, stunt casting and visual effects, then this wouldn't be an issue.
I get why those other things are so important; it's all about recreating the world and living that dream. I get it. I just think it's a shame something so basic and important as proper sound recording is so commonly ignored and dismissed as importnant enough to do well.
That is, you don't care until it comes time to deal with the people who point out "Wow, the sound is terrible on this thing." Then suddenly, let's trumpet out all the reasons why the bad, horrible sound which detracts exponentially the enjoyment of said film should be excused.
The fact is if all of the groups spent as much time on their sound as they do on things like recreating the sets, props, makeup, stunt casting and visual effects, then this wouldn't be an issue.
I get why those other things are so important; it's all about recreating the world and living that dream. I get it. I just think it's a shame something so basic and important as proper sound recording is so commonly ignored and dismissed as importnant enough to do well.
Didn't they have to dub over most of the dialog in TOS bridge scenes because the set had so much noise in it?
I resent the implication that "nobody cares". Not caring and struggling to make things work amidst a variety of challenges are two entirely different things.
The idea that the people making these things don't care is just insulting. Ignorance, lack of preparation, naivety; these are fair comments, all of which can be applied to my own efforts. But not caring? That's patently unfair.
The idea that the people making these things don't care is just insulting. Ignorance, lack of preparation, naivety; these are fair comments, all of which can be applied to my own efforts. But not caring? That's patently unfair.
Well, it would hardly be a FanPro thread without tone-deaf, overheated criticisms being flung around, now would it?
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