Why are the TOS movies better then the TNG movies?

[Therin of Andor]

what a random combination of favorites, as they're almost total opposites.

Exactly but, so far, only those two ST movies have given me that extraordinarily immersive experience, where I get so totally sucked in by the premise, sets, alien makeups, uniforms, SPFX, dialogue and music that I feel like I'm actually on that ship. Thirty years apart, but amazingly close.

Though I think that TWOK is a better choice if that's the reasoning, because though TMP was a box office hit, it was a critical flop and a huge disappointment, fan-wise.

Not to this fan. TMP was essentially my introduction to ST, knowing only random TAS and a few TOS episodes. Imagine my surprise joining a ST club in 1980 and finding out that most ST fans I met hated the movie. Luckily, TMP drew in others who loved TMP, so I hung around with them. By contrast, ST II (which I could see was more of a crowd pleaser) was veering my ST away from my favourite, almost erasing TMP from other fans' memories, which is what Harve Bennett was employed to do.

People choose favorite films not just because of their face value content, but also because of what they represent to them emotionally. I can totally understand the two Therin chooses. They both represent a rebirth of Trek in the mainstream with artistic flair and grandeur.

Exactly.

 

[plynch]

Gee - What does it say about me if my two faves are Day the Earth Stood Still and Cool Hand Luke?

 

[Peach Wookiee]

Gee - What does it say about me if my two faves are Day the Earth Stood Still and Cool Hand Luke?

You want the Sci-Fi/Fantasy forum down the hall.

 

[Greg Cox]

Gee - What does it say about me if my two faves are Day the Earth Stood Still and Cool Hand Luke?

Yeah, who says that your favorite movies have to be artistically compatible?

Two of my favorite movies are Singin' in the Rain and The Wicker Man (the original Christopher Lee version, of course). All depends on what mood I'm in . . . .

 

[sonak]

Gee - What does it say about me if my two faves are Day the Earth Stood Still and Cool Hand Luke?

Yeah, who says that your favorite movies have to be artistically compatible?

Two of my favorite movies are Singin' in the Rain and The Wicker Man (the original Christopher Lee version, of course). All depends on what mood I'm in . . . .

obviously that's not what I was saying. He was comparing two movies from the same film franchise in the same genre, and they were about as unlike as can be.


of course if you're choosing favorites from ACROSS whole genres you're going to have very disimilar choices, but that's a completely different issue.

 

[Lt. Beatings]

TMP hurts my eyes. Is there a warning on that thing for epileptics? So many flashing lights.

 

[MasuPu'a]

TMP hurts my eyes. Is there a warning on that thing for epileptics? So many flashing lights.

It doesn't hurt my eyes, but the visuals do get very dull very quickly. It's just on and on, staring a the screen, then staring at people who are staring at the screen, staring at the screen. Lights flickering and psychedelic clouds...actually that whole sequence might be a Hell of a lot better if you just replace all the audio with a Pink Floyd album.

 

[sonak]

TMP hurts my eyes. Is there a warning on that thing for epileptics? So many flashing lights.

It doesn't hurt my eyes, but the visuals do get very dull very quickly. It's just on and on, staring a the screen, then staring at people who are staring at the screen, staring at the screen. Lights flickering and psychedelic clouds...actually that whole sequence might be a Hell of a lot better if you just replace all the audio with a Pink Floyd album.

I've read it described as similar to "watching a bunch of people watching a television screen."

 

[Therin of Andor]

TMP hurts my eyes. Is there a warning on that thing for epileptics? So many flashing lights.

actually that whole sequence might be a Hell of a lot better if you just replace all the audio with a Pink Floyd album.

Close your eyes and listen to the pretty Goldsmith score.

 

[Bones_McCoy21]

Well I find the TOS movies more enjoyable because everybody knows it...Shatner is a BAD actor(FYI to those who didn't know that) but his bad acting makes it funny and worth watching (patrick stewart is too serious to be funny)

 

[MasuPu'a]

TMP hurts my eyes. Is there a warning on that thing for epileptics? So many flashing lights.

actually that whole sequence might be a Hell of a lot better if you just replace all the audio with a Pink Floyd album.

Close your eyes and listen to the pretty Goldsmith score.

Goldsmith is nice...But I'm thinking that putting on Pink Floyd and lighting one up would turn the whole movie experience into something epic.

 

[22 Stars]

TMP hurts my eyes. Is there a warning on that thing for epileptics? So many flashing lights.

actually that whole sequence might be a Hell of a lot better if you just replace all the audio with a Pink Floyd album.

Close your eyes and listen to the pretty Goldsmith score.

Goldsmith is nice...But I'm thinking that putting on Pink Floyd and lighting one up would turn the whole movie experience into something epic.

Well sure, and that's what millions of fans did for 2001: A Space Odyssey 10 years prior. This had a great impact on Roddenberry and inspired the tone of TMP greatly.

 

[pengbuzz]

What I noticed as the difference between the TOS movies and the TNG films was that (at least with the first 4), the scope seemed far more epic. In TMP, we see the unveiling of the Refit, and we catch up with the characters as their lives once again converge together onboard the Enterprise. McCoy was out of Starfleet, as was Spock, who was undergoing the Kolinahr on Vulcan. Kirk was Chief of Starfleet operations as an Admiral, and Decker was now the captain of the ship. In WOK, it had a "nautical" feel in it, with the music of James Horner, the many references (bot visual and spoken), and the uniforms really made it feel like the crew was part of a fleet (as opposed to the pastel pj's they wore in TMP!!). SFS was the saddest for me, as the Enterprise was destroyed, but in the fashion of being epic, it allowed for the all time epic instance of Kirk bending/breaking the rules: he STOLE the Enterprise!!! By admission, TVH wasn't as epic per se, but it was a fun comedy, and you have to admit: Spock saying "damn" every 5 minutes was hilarious.

With TNG: it didn't have the same quality of being epic and big: the crew was pretty much transplanted from the tv series to the film without much change, and the Enterprise D was just the same old ship, which got wrecked. No sense of them being people with lives, but just still doing what they were doing when we last saw them.

Speaking of the ships: the Enterprise -E, while a beautiful ship, just wasn't given the same treatment as the refit, and the ship was too agile for my tastes; it conveyed no sense of its' mass, especially during the Borg cube battle in First Contact. When a ship that big moves with a sense of being big, no matter how agile it may be, it gives it an air of being grand and large. But none of that happened; it just seemed to lack the grace that the Refit had in her movements.

In the end: the TOS films had the sense that the crew were legends as was the Ship, but that they were also people who lived. TNG just seemed to me like a feature film add on to the TV series and lacked those qualities. Yes, Goldsmith returned for the TNG films, but even then the soundtrack lacked the elegance the TOS ones possessed. But then, perhaps we are expecting too much from TNG and remembering TOS too fondly.

 

[Deckerd]

Just watching TMP and it's pretty dreadful. It was of its time but it makes Peter Jackson's editing look terse and economical.

 

[The Dominion]

You really have to look into the plot and past the dragging cinematography. It's a strong classic Trek story, just a bit too much visual filler.

 

[Bob The Skutter]

Just watching TMP and it's pretty dreadful. It was of its time but it makes Peter Jackson's editing look terse and economical.

TMP is genius and you just don't get it. What you need is the extended super extra directors cut uber edition with 3 hours of extra footage.

 

[Deckerd]

Oh I get the story and I think it's an interesting, dare I say, original take on the lost child returned story. The realisation just, well, sucks.

 

[Bob The Skutter]

Oh I get the story and I think it's an interesting, dare I say, original take on the lost child returned story. The realisation just, well, sucks.

You have to see it in HD for full effect. and on a 20 foot screen.

 

[sonak]

Just watching TMP and it's pretty dreadful. It was of its time but it makes Peter Jackson's editing look terse and economical.

TMP is genius and you just don't get it. What you need is the extended super extra directors cut uber edition with 3 hours of extra footage.

if this is sarcasm, I totally agree with the sentiment.

 

[thumbtack]

Well sure, and that's what millions of fans did for 2001: A Space Odyssey 10 years prior. This had a great impact on Roddenberry and inspired the tone of TMP greatly.

Really? Roddenberry seems like he was more the cocaine and alcohol type to me.