Who do you think was the worst actor among the TNG cast?

[2takesfrakes]

First of all, it was a bit stupid to kill of Yar in the first place.

OK, if they hadn't, then we wouldn't have had the excellent episode "Skin Of Evil" and the writers didn't know at that time that Crosby would regret her decision to leave. Still, I think it would have been great if Yar had remained in the series.

But the Sela plot was so silly. This whole thing with that alternate universe story with Yar being captured by Romulans and then having a daugher who would be a Romulan agent gives me a severe headache.

What they should have done instead was to have Crosby play Ishara Yar in "Legacy" and have her as a recurring character. In that way, Crosby would have had a possibility to work with the TNG cast during the seasons of the series.

Denise playing her own sister who wasn't her identical twin, and looking exactly like her ... she'd have to lose the G.I. Joe haircut, at the very least. Denise's idea that Richard Castillo knocked up a willing Tasha Yar, allowing her to play her own daughter held promise. But when she pitched it to Rick Berman, he rejected it, in favour of the Sela character. The premise, in my view, is a sound one. And the potential for storytelling is phenomenal.

For example:

What of her Humanity? What frequency might that have put her on? In tune with Caithlin Dar, perhaps? See ... that would've been sweet, if Dar was Sela's mentor and mother figure, after Yar was executed. And that's just off the top of my head. ALL kinds of great stories and characters could've played a part in Sela's narrative that would've added so much to the tapestry of TNG. And what of her father? You know, I can just imagine that his agreement to spare the Enterprise-C crew just so he could pop Yar would've pissed off someone of import in the Romulan Empire.

What else would he do to get a beautiful woman to bed him? Find himself an Anna Chapman type? No ... this guy ... he's a loose cannon on deck. A potential breech in National Security. These ENT-C crewmen were ordered executed. ... Humans are the most hated by Romulans, so ... what's going on, here? Would Yar's love awaken in her Romulan Husband a new enlightenment? This could've very well played into Unification, if Pardek were Sela's father. So much to mine from. So many implications ... OH WELL!!!

Look what we did get with Unification, Part Deux: pedestrian writing, shitty-assed sets and costumes and a poor welcome for the late, great Leonard Nimoy. But TNG was good to Denise Crosby and I'm glad about it. When TNG started, she was as important in establishing how STAR TREK might continue as Sir Patrick Stewart. But the material she was given ended up not being worthy of The Best Show in Town ...

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I dunno about "worst", exactly, but I definitely did not like 1st season Riker or Troi.

 

[Jonesy]

Because she wasn't necessarily miserable, not any worse than some of them. It was an awkward start, all around. Most of them figured it was a flop, so she jumped ship figuring she'd have better options in the future, which didn't pan out. (Pet Sematary) Then by season 3 TNG caught on & she knew she'd bailed on a good opportunity, & took every bone she could get them to throw at her. They were pretty lean years for her otherwise.

I swear, if they'd offered her a job playing a holodeck Yar that Data uses to study his "multiple techniques" she'd have jumped at it in a heartbeat

That's pretty much how I look at it. I think she felt that she had a feature film career in front of her, and that she was leaving behind a sinking ship. The exact opposite happened. Denise has taken every opportunity to put herself back into the franchise, including doing a documentary poking fun at it.

To answer the main subject, I think the two worst actors are a tie between Frakes and Sirtis. Frakes has suggested before that he's a better director than actor, and I find this refreshing that he has the openenss to admit it. Sirtis really is in just about the same ballpark. I don't even consider Crosby to be a candidate as she didn't even last through one season, and she wasn't given the opportunity to do the great material that was presented to the main cast later. Plus, she had to suffer through Code of Honor, and there was absolutely nothing that could be gained by that episode other than embarrrasment. I actually thought her performance in Yesterday's Enterprise was at least acceptably good. Some here in the thread have suggested that Wil Wheaton is a candidate. I can agree and disagree with that, only because Wil was still basically a child actor when the series was created, and he was only cresting into adulthood when he left. I think Wil's performance alone in Stand By Me (yes I know that's not Trek) proves that even as a kid he knew how to act - or at the very least that a director could pull a great performance out of him.

 

[Voth commando1]

Denise playing her own sister who wasn't her identical twin, and looking exactly like her ... she'd have to lose the G.I. Joe haircut, at the very least. Denise's idea that Richard Castillo knocked up a willing Tasha Yar, allowing her to play her own daughter held promise. But when she pitched it to Rick Berman, he rejected it, in favour of the Sela character. The premise, in my view, is a sound one. And the potential for storytelling is phenomenal.

For example:

What of her Humanity? What frequency might that have put her on? In tune with Caithlin Dar, perhaps? See ... that would've been sweet, if Dar was Sela's mentor and mother figure, after Yar was executed. And that's just off the top of my head. ALL kinds of great stories and characters could've played a part in Sela's narrative that would've added so much to the tapestry of TNG. And what of her father? You know, I can just imagine that his agreement to spare the Enterprise-C crew just so he could pop Yar would've pissed off someone of import in the Romulan Empire.

What else would he do to get a beautiful woman to bed him? Find himself an Anna Chapman type? No ... this guy ... he's a loose cannon on deck. A potential breech in National Security. These ENT-C crewmen were ordered executed. ... Humans are the most hated by Romulans, so ... what's going on, here? Would Yar's love awaken in her Romulan Husband a new enlightenment? This could've very well played into Unification, if Pardek were Sela's father. So much to mine from. So many implications ... OH WELL!!!

Look what we did get with Unification, Part Deux: pedestrian writing, shitty-assed sets and costumes and a poor welcome for the late, great Leonard Nimoy. But TNG was good to Denise Crosby and I'm glad about it. When TNG started, she was as important in establishing how STAR TREK might continue as Sir Patrick Stewart. But the material she was given ended up not being worthy of The Best Show in Town ...

I always interpreted it simply as a Romulan general found Yar attractive, said hey honey come to bed with me this evening and I'll spare your crew. Tasha being a rational woman said yes.

 

[2takesfrakes]

Succinct - quite!
And yes, Yar was most attractive, indeed ...

 

[Voth commando1]

I wonder if she didn't try to run away and accepted her life as a mistress while raising Sela, that's some interesting story potential.

 

[Mojochi]

I wonder if she didn't try to run away and accepted her life as a mistress while raising Sela, that's some interesting story potential.

Exactly. The untold end to Tasha's life is WAAAAY more interesting than anything they ever did with her daughter

 

[Voth commando1]

Exactly. The untold end to Tasha's life is WAAAAY more interesting than anything they ever did with her daughter

You could have the Romulan General in question encounter the TNG crew with either Tasha in tow or have her referenced. Picard would be shocked thinking Tasha died as she did the first season and suspect treachery or deception of some kind. Sort of like when he encountered Sela having no recollection of the Klingon War Timeline.

You could still have the Spock reunification plotline but have Tasha has a supporting character in that arc.

Really Berman's idea that she be a Romulan general's bed woman was good one.

 

[Noname Given]

Definitely Marina Sirtis. Granted they never wrote the characters dialogue well to begin with, but my god, was her delivery often stiff/stilted.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

Definitely Marina Sirtis. Granted they never wrote the characters dialogue well to begin with, but my god, was her delivery often stiff/stilted.

Could part of that been the ridiculous accent?

 

[Noname Given]

Could part of that been the ridiculous accent?

She only kept that accent for two seasons as I recall (it was the most pronounced in Season 1 of course.)

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

She only kept that accent for two seasons as I recall (it was the most pronounced in Season 1 of course.)

The accent got much less pronounced, but I wonder if it hurt her delivery in the way you mentioned early on.

 

[Mojochi]

You could have the Romulan General in question encounter the TNG crew with either Tasha in tow or have her referenced. Picard would be shocked thinking Tasha died as she did the first season and suspect treachery or deception of some kind. Sort of like when he encountered Sela having no recollection of the Klingon War Timeline.

You could still have the Spock reunification plotline but have Tasha has a supporting character in that arc.

Really Berman's idea that she be a Romulan general's bed woman was good one.

You have to wonder how Worf would've felt about that, considering his feelings about Romulans

 

[2takesfrakes]

When Troi finally ended up speaking as Marina did, the only remnant of her former accent that she'd held onto was referring to her Imzadi as "Wheel."

 

[Vorpal_Blade]

I think it was Marina Sirtis

 

[Voth commando1]

You have to wonder how Worf would've felt about that, considering his feelings about Romulans

Why Worf exactly?

 

[Mojochi]

Why Worf exactly?

Romulans killed his parents. Even when the crew's safety was on the line, he'd rather let a Romulan die than give a biological sample to save thing's life. Romulans have been interfering in his whole culture's existence. Dude's got him some Romulan grudge is all I'm saying, & to know that someone he'd looked up to, the way he did Tasha, had ended up (For whatever reason) mating with one? Klingon's take mating pretty seriously, or at least he does, anyhow. I imagine him being pretty bothered by the whole thing

 

[Voth commando1]

Romulans killed his parents. Even when the crew's safety was on the line, he'd rather let a Romulan die than give a biological sample to save thing's life. Romulans have been interfering in his whole culture's existence. Dude's got him some Romulan grudge is all I'm saying, & to know that someone he'd looked up to, the way he did Tasha, had ended up (For whatever reason) mating with one? Klingon's take mating pretty seriously, or at least he does, anyhow. I imagine him being pretty bothered by the whole thing

Worf may be a Klingon but he's fairly level headed. I think he could be made to understand Tasha became a mistress/comfort woman unwillingly.

As I said after they were captured Tasha was put in a bad situation

Romulan General: Your pretty good lookin and if you want your crew to survive come to bed with me deary.

For the sake of the survivors of the Enterprise C she would acquiesce. Apparently in the Canon version she never grew soft on the general and tried to get away. I imagine had she survived long enough to run into the Enterprise again she would have at least accepted her lot in life even if she didn't love "her man".

 

[Timewalker]

I'm not saying she's bad, but Marina's acting... especially early on, not that great.

In early TNG her pronunciation wasn't that good?

Her accent was supposed to be "alien and exotic." I could have accepted that until Majel Barrett showed up. They tried to tapdance around it by having some reference to "I see you still haven't lost your accent"... which would imply that she got it from her father. But in the next season, his name sounds fairly North European. So where the hell did she get that goofy accent in-universe?

But comparing Season 1 to Season 7 (and beyond, when she appeared on Voyager and in the movies), I actually do prefer the earlier seasons. Her draaaawwwwled-out, slaaawpy accent later on just really grated on my ears.

Every Chief Engineer before LaForge took over.
Diana Muldaur
Whoopi Goldberg

Disagree with Diana Muldaur and Whoopi Goldberg.

Diana Muldaur played a character who was Picard's equal in a lot of ways, and took no crap from him. I didn't like her bigotry toward Data, but she did make an effort to overcome that. I wish she'd stayed. I really did not like Gates McFadden/Beverly, as her only real reason to be on the show was this continual question of "Is Picard Wesley's real father?".

And Whoopi Goldberg was just plain fun as Guinan. A friend once hosted the TNG version of the "How to Host a Murder Mystery" dinner/role-playing game. I was given the role of Guinan "because you have weird hats in your costume collection." We had a great meal and solving the mystery was a lot of fun.

Considering they had no idea how TNG would do, they probably couldn't sell the idea to a lot of good actors, or have a budget big enough to hire good actors.

It's kind of a shock they got Patrick Stewart to come aboard. It would be interesting to know what his midset was.

Some time before TNG was offered to him, he was in a production of Hamlet with Lalla Ward (she was on hiatus from Doctor Who) and asked her how she could stand doing a TV series instead of acting on stage. Fast-forward to 1986 (or thereabouts; not sure when he was cast in TNG), and he took the job because he honestly expected it to last a year at most, if not be cancelled after 13 weeks. He never expected it to last 7 years plus movies.

I actually think Sirtis is as good as Frakes ever was. They were mostly soap actors

I've only seen her in one other thing - a really bad TV-movie. I don't even remember the name of it. Frakes was in some miniseries... North and South? His wife, Genie Francis, is currently on General Hospital as Laura (the actor who played Luke retired a couple of years ago).

What they should have done instead was to have Crosby play Ishara Yar in "Legacy" and have her as a recurring character. In that way, Crosby would have had a possibility to work with the TNG cast during the seasons of the series.

As a twin sister?

She would have been a lot better than that stiffer-than-cardboard "actress" they did get. I remember her from Dallas, in which she played Carter MacKay's daughter and was a brief love interest for Bobby. She couldn't act worth a damn in that show, either.

I wonder if she didn't try to run away and accepted her life as a mistress while raising Sela, that's some interesting story potential.

Not to worry. Fanfiction has provided.

 

[Scotchy]

I really did not like Gates McFadden/Beverly, as her only real reason to be on the show was this continual question of "Is Picard Wesley's real father?".

I liked Bev for the most part. Her character went further than Muldaur's, she commanded the ship (doing pretty well as Captain, especially in combat against the Borg), solved Dr. Reyga's murder and she certainly had no qualms about confronting or disagreeing with Picard. I don't recall Wesley's paternity ever being brought into question during the show. Picard served more as a father figure to Wesley than anything else.