Which Spin-off is Closest in "spirit" to TOS?
- Thread starter Emperor-Tiberius
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I hope I'm not breaking any rules by quoting myself but I wanted to finish my thoughts.
OK I've got ENT now. ENT is like going to a fast food joint. Shove that Big Mac down your throat, suck up the milkshake and move on. Somewhat cookie-cutterish.
Personally I'm not fussy, I do enjoy all three modes I've listed. I like variety.
Robert
For me, TNG has the basic premise and structure of TOS and therefore, IMHO is the closest to the spirit.
To me, spirit is following the same premise, structure and style. TNG fits that. DS9 doesn't have the same structure as the storyline focus on a space station, not a solitary ship and crew. VOY doesn't have the same premise as the crew is on the mission to return home, not to explore. ENT is just incomplete.
To me, spirit is following the same premise, structure and style. TNG fits that. DS9 doesn't have the same structure as the storyline focus on a space station, not a solitary ship and crew. VOY doesn't have the same premise as the crew is on the mission to return home, not to explore. ENT is just incomplete.
Yep, exactly how I feel, too.
I voted for ENT as well. I was going to write something, but it would have sounded so much like what you wrote above, I decided just to quote you.
The only difference being that I suspect I may have liked TNG a bit more than you. Other than that, ditto.
Agreed. Of all the Star Trek spin-offs, The Next Generation is the one with the most episodes that feel like they could have been Original Series episodes. In addition to those, I would also include pretty much all of Season 1-- "The Naked Now," "Code of Honor," "Hide & Q," "Justice," etc.
However, much as I love all of the Star Trek spin-offs, I'm not sure any of them quite capture the feel of The Original Series. The 1960s were a unique time with a unique spirit. In some ways, The Original Series has far more in common with some of its 1960s contemporaries like The Prisoner & The Twilight Zone than to its spin-offs that wouldn't come until decades later.
And if we're going to talk about the cast chemistry, I'd say the show that actually comes closest to that feel is Stargate SG-1. Captain Kirk & Col. O'Neill are the stalwart heroes. Dr. McCoy & Dr. Jackson are the liberal humanists. Spock's brilliant scientific mind is represented by Samantha Carter while his stoic alien-ness is personified by Teal'c. Granted, they're not perfect parallels but I think the Original Star Trek cast has far more in common with the Stargate SG-1 characters than with the excellent denizens of its spin-offs.
Really, the reason why Star Trek has had such longevity is because each spin-off creates its own identity that distinguishes it from the others. The good ones don't try to copy each other but try to establish their own identity within the same universe. The Original Series was the 1960s examination of the human condition in a sci-fi setting. The Next Generation was dominated by it's softer, politically correct mentality of the late 1980s/early 1990s. Deep Space 9 was a gritty examination of war and how people react to situations in an imperfect world.
VOY with ENT a close second
That is what markes them both apart from the rest of Trek, for me. I love the characters in each, I like "being around them" as it were, they are given womderful moments even in bad episodes. I never felt the same way about the other crews, they all felt like cardboard cutouts. I can enjoy some EPISODES of TNG very much, there is some great writing there, but that is all, its not like the warmth I feel for these two crews (VOY and ENT are not even worth mentioning).
G
Guest
Guest
I agree very much. I feel the influence of TOS in TNG more so than in the other series, especially in its earlier seasons. Many of the early episodes were directly related to TOS, and similar in both structure and theme. TOS was clearly the template that they built from.
DS9.
I guess it comes down to what you think the "spirit" of Star Trek is. Recreating the basic concept but making it lighter and brighter and cuddlier isn't being true to the spirit of TOS, it's being true to the format of TOS. I don't think they're the same thing.
I guess it comes down to what you think the "spirit" of Star Trek is. Recreating the basic concept but making it lighter and brighter and cuddlier isn't being true to the spirit of TOS, it's being true to the format of TOS. I don't think they're the same thing.
number6
Vice Admiral
This thread isn't about that at all, though. I never thought of DS9 as cuddlier. VOY and TNG sure have some cuddly aspects of it. At times TNG was "Barney and Friends!" VOY never got that bad, but there were some serious Splenda moments there too!! ENT has similar chemistry between its characters, reminiscent of the first season of TOS, but they never took enough chances and with the fandom the way it was, never stood a chance of sucees no matter what they did!!
On the other hand, it is also necessary to be true to the format of Star Trek, otherwise it isn't Star Trek. The show has to be bright and optimistic. It can't be placed on a stationary space station. That's why I consider DS9 to be the farthest spinoff from the original in spirit. It's not enough that the show explores "the human condition." The West Wing does that, too, but it's not Star Trek.
I wish there had been a "none of the above" choice in this poll. Like some of the other posters, I had to settle for the first few seasons of TNG.
Only DS9 had the gutsiness and truth of TOS. The rest were bland excercises in political correctness.
Exccept for the Animated Series, I'd have to vote "none." Except for use of the same names and races, the spinofs were almost diametrically opposite to Trek (though DS9 is not as far off the mark as the others). As Themis said, at least DS9 didn't completely descend into banal PC and had some measure of guts. The others were far too bland.
Commander Maddux
Vice Admiral
TNG. I think VOY had the greatest untapped potential, though.
I was going to sit down and write an answer to this while my lunch microwaves, but darn it if you didn't write exactly what I was thinking, though more eloquently than I could have.
I voted DS9 though I had a hard time choosing between it and TNG. It is almost a tossup between those two shows.
TNG, particularly in the first two seasons, felt like TOS. Although I didn't realize it at the time.
For me though, Star Trek never was about spaceships and exploration, or at least not "just" about those. It was about using science fiction "trappings" to explore interesting social issues and talk about things that are hard to talk about otherwise.
For me DS9 did this with the most skill, and by the end the entire series's run felt very much more like TOS for me than the other serieses.
So I am happy to see DS9 and TNG neck and neck leading the pack.
VOY and ENT both had their moments but to me they felt more like a copy of the format of a great series, rather than a great series in its own right. Pale echoes.
It is interesting when I hear people talk about "what Gene would have liked" (not that it matters) as far as new serieses go. A lot of people thought he would have really not liked DS9. I think he would have liked it - it followed his directive that the show be "about something" ... he would have been far more dismayed by the latter seasons of Voyager and Enterprise, and the TNG movies, I think.
I just hope whoever takes over the franchise next understands this. Unfortunately, cheap franchise exploitation seems to be the rule of the day and I expect eventually Star Trek will become just another Owen Wilson comedy blockbuster vehicle...
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