That is a possibility.
What did Khan see in McGivers?
- Thread starter Dale Sams
- Start date
That is a possibility.
I prefer it that she was dead. It makes Space Seed even more interesting because you know her future.
Marla McGivers betrayed the ENTERPRISE, which is the Kiss of Death. As surely as Kirk falling in love with someone will cause her to get hit by a MACK truck ... or much, much worse. What delicious irony, though just when Marla thought she was about to become Queen of All She Surveyed ... justice is delivered by a bug in her ear - symbolically representing her conscience, almost.
Hm, 20 years in Starfleet's version of Leavenworth was probably looking pretty good to her after CA5 turned into a never-ending sandstorm.
Maybe Khan was just a softee at heart, who liked to hold hands and snuggle with McGivers. Nahhh, I don't have any idea why he liked her so much.
>>SNORT!!!<<< I'll tell ya ...! The things we do for "Love."
What romantic notions she must've had in her head, believing - sincerely believing - that there would be no ill-consequences to screwing over the STAR TREK ship and crew. That somehow, Khan's intellect and machismo - and a fully-charged phaser bank - would achieve only positive outcomes. As if the ENTERPRISE had never been outmatched before. Or that the only way it got out of an ugly situation was by the skin of their teeth and the mercy of aliens like the Organians. And when putting a spin on it all failed to do The Trick ... McGivers could always put stock in her Feminine wiles, that she could "change" him - change KHAN (!!!) and somehow mould him.
((...snicker)) Ah, the foolishness ...
The first time I saw Khan in TWOK, my reaction was....."Damn! Old man Khan and his grand kids are on the movie screen!"
They were, indeed! A lot of 0ld Farts made their presence known in STAR TREK II. Khan looked like somebody's grandmother, or some shit, with all of that hair.
Marla's often taken as a nitwit, weak-willed or worse by folks who either don't recognize the relationship's D/S pattern, or who've heard of that sort of thing, but don't understand or respect it. Devoid that contextual understanding, Marla comes off looking REAL bad.
Bear in mind though that Khan is quite possibly not just the first dom she's met, but the ONLY dom she's likely ever to meet in a 23rd century that's (it says so right on the label) gone in such a way gender-wise that D/S simply no longer exists!
I'm not saying that's realistic, or that TOS in fact sold that line…merely that, given that interpretation, Marla could hardly have helped but be in Khan's camp…until he went too far, and she told him so (changed sides)…which he both understood and respected for.
Not that he didn't respect her earlier. Recognizing a sub as a sub doesn't mean thinking, "Hey, here's a victim." Marla, for her part, may not quite have known what hit her…but she knew it was her choice to buy in. Which she did.
Bear in mind though that Khan is quite possibly not just the first dom she's met, but the ONLY dom she's likely ever to meet in a 23rd century that's (it says so right on the label) gone in such a way gender-wise that D/S simply no longer exists!
I'm not saying that's realistic, or that TOS in fact sold that line…merely that, given that interpretation, Marla could hardly have helped but be in Khan's camp…until he went too far, and she told him so (changed sides)…which he both understood and respected for.
Not that he didn't respect her earlier. Recognizing a sub as a sub doesn't mean thinking, "Hey, here's a victim." Marla, for her part, may not quite have known what hit her…but she knew it was her choice to buy in. Which she did.
At times I like to squint my eyes and pretend that the Bonanza episode with Ricardo and Madlyn is some bizarre post TOS AU Ceti Alpha V story:
Khan just liked to see women wearing those Bill Theiss micro-mini skirt Starfleet uniforms.
We know when our Heroes recognize Khan but it is never explicit when McGivers recognizes him.
I like the idea that she does so during the boarding party, hence her distraction, and that she hoped she could keep him to herself professionally (and personally) for a bit before our heroes react. And also before 23rd century academia descended on this "discovery of some importance." That would make the SiKh line a red herring, i.e, a stalling tactic aimed at our Heroes. and lend extra emphasis to "Magnificent!"
I like the idea that she does so during the boarding party, hence her distraction, and that she hoped she could keep him to herself professionally (and personally) for a bit before our heroes react. And also before 23rd century academia descended on this "discovery of some importance." That would make the SiKh line a red herring, i.e, a stalling tactic aimed at our Heroes. and lend extra emphasis to "Magnificent!"
It's an odd red herring, though, as it both seems to contradict the observable facts (where's Khan's beard?) and lead the others down the right path to deducing who the sleeper is.
The exact opposite would seem a more logical thing for McGivers to say: "The ponytail suggests an eccentric millionaire from the late 20th century, possibly a pop star; those often froze themselves for posterity" would match the observed facts and distract the heroes for a while.
Timo Saloniemi
The exact opposite would seem a more logical thing for McGivers to say: "The ponytail suggests an eccentric millionaire from the late 20th century, possibly a pop star; those often froze themselves for posterity" would match the observed facts and distract the heroes for a while.
Timo Saloniemi
At times I like to squint my eyes and pretend that the Bonanza episode with Ricardo and Madlyn is some bizarre post TOS AU Ceti Alpha V story:
Oh, that's awesome!
Similarly, there's an episode of Kung Fu with Shatner, and his exotic Chinese wife is played by France Nuyen. Kirk and Elaan, stepping thru the Guardian and settling in 19th century San Fran?
it's an odd non-sequitur, in general, and a line that could be removed without affecting the story at all
Maybe Khan was a trendsetter, well ahead of the curve.
Just went back and watched "Space Seed" recently because of all the talk about TWOK on the movies board, and I would say that I think it's pretty clear that he saw in McGivers someone he could manipulate psychologically - someone who would help him get an edge, and I also think he's definitely attracted to her. It's kind of funny how Khan has on her a hold that's almost reminiscent of Dracula or something. Everyone else is deeply suspicious of him, as they should be - he held a knife to Doc's throat to see how he would react, for goodness sakes.
I think Joaquin is the second in command in TWOK, and there is a Joaquin in "Space Seed," but having McGivers in TWOK would have been really cool.
I think Joaquin is the second in command in TWOK, and there is a Joaquin in "Space Seed," but having McGivers in TWOK would have been really cool.
It would also be fun to have Joachim be the son of Khan and McGivers, named after Khan's old (and now late) lieutenant. Extra poignancy to him blindly following the big man even when he turns down perfectly rational suggestions and waves off important protests...
One thing that stands out in rewatching "Space Seed" after trekbbs discussions on the "discrepancies" between the episode and the movie is the fact that Khan's crew is all-Aryan in the original episode as well. If there are any supermen who don't look at least as European as Montalban does, they must be slaves to their betters, reduced to menial off-camera jobs!
Timo Saloniemi
One thing that stands out in rewatching "Space Seed" after trekbbs discussions on the "discrepancies" between the episode and the movie is the fact that Khan's crew is all-Aryan in the original episode as well. If there are any supermen who don't look at least as European as Montalban does, they must be slaves to their betters, reduced to menial off-camera jobs!
Timo Saloniemi
Similar threads
