Well that's "Court Martial" and "Obsession" gone then (SPOILERS)

[Dick Whitman]

Roddenberry and the other TOS writers never gave much thought to Kirk or the others back stories. They made references that suited the needs of certain episodes and that was it. None of the details of Kirk's early Starfleet career was ever mentioned again. Each new detail had no relation to what was said before. HEck Kirk had a brother who was introduced to be killed off and never be reffered to again!!! Its only the fans and the licsensed fiction which have tried to piece together this random patchwork of Kirk's history.

 

[Michael]

No Republic, no Farragut, no Garrovick ... if there won't be a canon explanation for all of this, this movie will suck even more than Nemesis did.

Oh, come on, you must be kidding me. This movie will suck if it won't adhere to established Trek canon? Since when exactly did canon equate to good entertainment? Both of them have zero to do with each other.

But it seems that most people on this board don't care that much for Star Trek as such.

What a stupid accusation to make. Just because one doesn't consider canon to be all that important doesn't mean they like Star Trek less than you. You sound like you wanted to say that all that ever made Star Trek good, was its canon.

I have the feeling you're right, considering how nasty some people can be when someone reasonably explains why altering the continuity alters all of Trek. They certainly don't lend support to their position. All they're doing is making themselves look like animals who LIKE violent entertainment, and are violent in nature themselves.

What the hell are you even talking about? Are you really implying that most of the posters on this board who accept Star Trek as entertainment and don't think its superficial canon is all that important are violent animals? Give me a break! You just can't be serious.

Is it so hard for some of you to enjoy two contradicting pieces of Star Trek at the same time??? No episode of TOS is gone. All still there. All can be enjoyed. You don't have to reconcile this new Trek with the old. Just enjoy both for what they are in and of themselves.

Exactly.

 

[Neumann]

Kudos to NCC-1701!!!

 

[God Magnus]

No Republic, no Farragut, no Garrovick ... if there won't be a canon explanation for all of this, this movie will suck even more than Nemesis did.

Star Trek "canon" has contradicted itself plenty of times over the years and (for a time) thrived despite such contradictions. Can Data float or does he sink like a rock in water? Is Kirk's middle name "R." something or Tiberius? Why didn't Troi remember kissing Riker with a beard in the TNG series? Is Data bulletproof or not? Despite these various inconsistancies, I managed to enjoy Trek over the years.

But it seems that most people on this board don't care that much for Star Trek as such.

If by "caring" you mean having to nit pick every last tiny bit of continuity to the point of being close-minded, you're right, not everyone does "care" by your standards. In the sense that I want Star Trek to be entertaining and financially viable (along with the production of tons of licensed fiction and product for me to enjoy) then I do care.

 

[EJA]

I'd like it if they at least had some sort of reference to Gary Mitchell, who was such a pivotal character in Where No Man Has Gone Before (one of the best TOS episodes, IMHO). Maybe he's off sick and can't graduate with the rest of Kirk's class, as was the case I believe in Vonda N. McIntyre's 80's novel Enterprise: The First Adventure? That would be fine with me

But we probably won't get that though

 

[Flake]

Holy shit, I'd better check my DVDs to make sure they are still there and some kind of temporal paradox hasn't destroyed them!

Phew, they are still there.

Any canon changes to the new movie are explained by Nero messing about with the past, a new timeline has splintered off from the old one. This is Star Trek v2. Go to the movie and think of it as such.

 

[blaXXer]

Holy shit, I'd better check my DVDs to make sure they are still there and some kind of temporal paradox hasn't destroyed them!

Phew, they are still there.

Any canon changes to the new movie are explained by Nero messing about with the past, a new timeline has splintered off from the old one. This is Star Trek v2. Go to the movie and think of it as such.

Either that, or just enjoy it for what it is: A (hopefully) good movie.

/Nemesis bored me.

 

[God Magnus]

Holy shit, I'd better check my DVDs to make sure they are still there and some kind of temporal paradox hasn't destroyed them!

Phew, they are still there.

Until May of next year!

 

[blaXXer]

I will rape the shit outta those DVDs.

 

[Oso Blanco]

No Republic, no Farragut, no Garrovick ... if there won't be a canon explanation for all of this, this movie will suck even more than Nemesis did.

Oh, come on, you must be kidding me. This movie will suck if it won't adhere to established Trek canon? Since when exactly did canon equate to good entertainment? Both of them have zero to do with each other.

Really? I think the reason why Nemesis sucked as much as it did was because of big plotholes and ignored continuity. Canon violations, if you will. Otherwise it was good enterntainment, at least to those who like space battles and explosions.

I guess it all depends on the definition of entertainment. Maybe you prefer the kind of entertainment that doesn't require higher brain functions, but I do!

 

[blaXXer]

No Republic, no Farragut, no Garrovick ... if there won't be a canon explanation for all of this, this movie will suck even more than Nemesis did.

Oh, come on, you must be kidding me. This movie will suck if it won't adhere to established Trek canon? Since when exactly did canon equate to good entertainment? Both of them have zero to do with each other.

Really? I think the reason why Nemesis sucked as much as it did was because of big plotholes and ignored continuity. Canon violations, if you will. Otherwise it was good enterntainment, at least to those who like space battles and explosions.

I guess it all depends on the definition of entertainment. Maybe you prefer the kind of entertainment that doesn't require higher brain functions, but I do!

It was boring. Period. It was stale and not even remotely engaging. Annd that was not due to being full of 'inconsistencies' as you call it but because of bad storytelling.

 

[Oso Blanco]

It was boring. Period. It was stale and not even remotely engaging. Annd that was not due to being full of 'inconsistencies' as you call it but because of bad storytelling.

And why was it bad storytelling? Because the story didn't fit into previously established canon!

 

[blaXXer]

It was boring. Period. It was stale and not even remotely engaging. Annd that was not due to being full of 'inconsistencies' as you call it but because of bad storytelling.

And why was it bad storytelling? Because the story didn't fit into previously established canon!

Nope, it is because it was told erratically and most importantly, stupidly. I do not care it something does not add up to any previous material.

 

[Lieut. Arex]

Any canon changes to the new movie are explained by Nero messing about with the past, a new timeline has splintered off from the old one. This is Star Trek v2. Go to the movie and think of it as such.

It's 3.0 or 2.5 at a minimum for filmed Trek since TNG constituted a soft reboot of the universe, altering several points in the canon/continuity to fit GR's changed perspective between 1964 and 1987. They're just close enough that most people are willing to twist, squeeze, and squint at those changes to make them fit with what went before.

This is Earth-4 Star Trek or some such with ST-TAS-Movies 1-6 being Earth-2, the ENT-TNG-DS9-VOY line Earth-1, and the Mirror Universe Earth-3. You're absolutely right that one should go see this film and judge it primarily for its own merits and its entertainment value in relation to the original, not in its adherence to previous canon and continuity.

 

[scotthm]

Jesus, are we going to have thread topics like this for the next six months? Yes, we all know that things in the TV show aren't going to be the same as the movie. End of story.

No, on the contrary. I'm expecting to see Riker and Troi at the end of the movie wondering how this holonovel got so mangled.

---------------

 

[blaXXer]

Jesus, are we going to have thread topics like this for the next six months? Yes, we all know that things in the TV show aren't going to be the same as the movie. End of story.

No, on the contrary. I'm expecting to see Riker and Troi at the end of the movie wondering how this holonovel got so mangled.

---------------

you. are. evil.

 

[sbk1234]

Jesus, are we going to have thread topics like this for the next six months? Yes, we all know that things in the TV show aren't going to be the same as the movie. End of story.

What do you mean "next six months?" People are still griping about Nemesis. This discussion will go on FOREVER!

Seriously, if it makes anything any easier to digest, just adopt the mindset that what we'll be watching is a story "ABOUT" Star Trek. Not Star Trek. Kind of like a movie about a true historical event. Hollywood always changes history for the films. Patton really didn't look like George C. Scott. The real people on Titanic didn't look like Cameron's cast.

Personally, I'm going with the alternate reality position, myself.

Whatever it takes to sleep at night.

 

[blaXXer]

I only hope JJ makes a good movie. The rest is, at best, secondary to me.

 

[Oso Blanco]

I do not care it something does not add up to any previous material.

Then why do you watch tv shows or movies in the first place? Just to entertain yourself for one or two hours and then quickly forget about everything?

 

[blaXXer]

I do not care it something does not add up to any previous material.

Then why do you watch tv shows or movies in the first place? Just to entertain yourself for one or two hours and then quickly forget about everything?

Why yes. It is entertainment, For christ's sake. If I wanted something cerebral I'd read Albert Camus, or Kafka.