Unrealized Stories From Throwaway Lines
- Thread starter Farscape One
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True, we don't know the specifics. I was thinking more of the why we don't so doesn't really answer your initial point.
I have a feeling it was before the Romulans' isolation phase, simply because if they are like their Vulcan cousins, they have very, very long lives.
Or this line from the Samaritan Snare:
WESLEY: Before the Klingons joined the Federation?
Well, by the time of TNG (nor by the time of TOS) they most definitely weren't Federation members, so that means they must have joined and then seceded at some later time. I think that would be an interesting story to hear. The context also implies all this happened during Picard's Starfleet Officer days, so in living memory.
Or the rapid progress of galactic 'charting' between S1 and S2 of TNG. In S1 (Where No One Has Gone Before) we're told 11% of the galaxy is charted , then in S2 (The Dauphin) the number has jumped up to 19%. So that's 8% in a single year, obviously there must have been a heck of an effort that year, not seen before (in three centuries of space flight they only got it up to 11% as Kosinsky says) or after (otherwise the entire galaxy would have been charted by the time of late DS9 or late VOY).
Always assumed that the Queen was just messing with their heads there (psychological warfare). Though to be honest, such behavior doesn't usually suit the Borg (but is probably possible for the Queen).
WESLEY: Before the Klingons joined the Federation?
Well, by the time of TNG (nor by the time of TOS) they most definitely weren't Federation members, so that means they must have joined and then seceded at some later time. I think that would be an interesting story to hear. The context also implies all this happened during Picard's Starfleet Officer days, so in living memory.
Or the rapid progress of galactic 'charting' between S1 and S2 of TNG. In S1 (Where No One Has Gone Before) we're told 11% of the galaxy is charted , then in S2 (The Dauphin) the number has jumped up to 19%. So that's 8% in a single year, obviously there must have been a heck of an effort that year, not seen before (in three centuries of space flight they only got it up to 11% as Kosinsky says) or after (otherwise the entire galaxy would have been charted by the time of late DS9 or late VOY).
Star Trek Voyager, Dark Frontier when the Queen says that the Borg put Seven of Nine on Voyager and left her there for a purpose….
Perhaps a Seven of Nine spin off can elaborate.
Always assumed that the Queen was just messing with their heads there (psychological warfare). Though to be honest, such behavior doesn't usually suit the Borg (but is probably possible for the Queen).
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I wanna know what happened between TMP and TWOK. Y'know, that 15 year period in the lives of the TOS crew that is 99% unexplored and empty. Like, yeah, we know Demora Sulu was born sometime in this period, and we know Kirk left Starfleet to live in Idaho with some lady named Antonia and a dog named Butler. But is that literally all that happened to the TOS gang? Such as, was there actually another 5 year mission? When did Spock become Captain? How did Chekov get on the Reliant? To quote a wizard from another media series, "I have questions...Questions that need answering!"
So the Hur'q.
They discovered the wormhole, ignored Bajor to hit the Klingon homeworld (or did they get to Qo'noS the hard way?), ransacked the planet, stole a rusty sword from Kahless, and dipped.
But like. Why? Also how?
I guess it's less a throwaway line and more the entire plot of an episode but I've always been curious.
They discovered the wormhole, ignored Bajor to hit the Klingon homeworld (or did they get to Qo'noS the hard way?), ransacked the planet, stole a rusty sword from Kahless, and dipped.
But like. Why? Also how?
I guess it's less a throwaway line and more the entire plot of an episode but I've always been curious.
The Vaadwaur were originally meant to be a recurring villain, and they should have been. That line by Janeway was a severe case of missed opportunity.
I have always wondered about the Hur'q, too. But I have a better question.
How did Dax know it was Hur'q dna on the cloth?
I see a couple possibilities regarding the Hur'q and the journey. Either they did it the long way (and it's very possible they had a method of travel that made thousands of light years be only days or weeks), or they used the wormhole. You bring up a valid point about them ignoring Bajor, and I am of two minds on that. Either the Bajorans were deemed too easy and were left alone, or the Hur'q did attack them and it might explain why their technological advancement seems to have been on hold for so long.
No matter the scenario, I love "THE SWORD OF KAHLESS" and all the questions it raises.
Someone in another thread mentioned the Kelvans from "BY ANY OTHER NAME", and it hit me just now.
Worf mentioned he had 'stood against Kelvans twice his size' in "TIME'S ORPHAN". Is he talking the same ones from that TOS episode (we have no idea what their lifespan is), their children, or did Kelvans actually come from the Andromeda galaxy?
Worf mentioned he had 'stood against Kelvans twice his size' in "TIME'S ORPHAN". Is he talking the same ones from that TOS episode (we have no idea what their lifespan is), their children, or did Kelvans actually come from the Andromeda galaxy?
Possibly Wesley meant that some Klingons joined the Federation. It is certainly possible for an ethnic group on Earth to have more than one state at a time, like North and South Korea, North and South Vietnam, East and West Germany. In South Africa, the Boers or Afrikaners had several different Boer Rpublics ar the same time duirng most of the 19th century. In the Bible the two Jewish Kingdoms of Isreal and Judah coexisted for centuries.
During most of human prehistory and history there werer many thousands of different humans states on Earth. during the 20th century the number was briefly as low as about fifty, and since then it has risen to about 200. So the exmaple of Homo sapeens demonstrates that a species can have a number of different independent states at a time.
So posssibly there are usually several indpendent Klingon states at any one time. Klingon states might constantly split apart and join other Klingon states. And the existance of a number of Klingon states with different names at any one time might be the reason that Picard specified "the Klingon Imperial Empire" in "Sins of the Father".
And possibly one of the lesser Klingon realms joined the Federation.
If the Kelvins ruled a large part of the Andromeda Galaxy they would have have had many worlds and many resources. Depending on how high priority the Miliky Way Galaxy was in the list of prospective future homes, they mighthav esentmany expediitons to many different parts of the Milky Way Galaxy. Thus Worf might have encountered members of another Kelvin expedition,perhaps in their native Kelvin form, perhaps in the form of another species they had assumed for some reason.
Or maybe Worf encountered members of another species named Kelvins, by coincidence.
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Quinn: At the beginning of the New Era, life as a Q was a continuous dialogue of discovery and issues and humour from all over the universe.
So, Quinn establishes here that the 'omnipotent era' of the Q had a beginning (presumably not the same point in time as beginning of the universe, as claimed by the other Q, IIRC), and there was a time before that (else why call it the 'New Era'?). So what was the nature of breakthrough the Q had? What were their species like just before that? Could be an interesting story (though probably near impossible to make a good episode from).
So, Quinn establishes here that the 'omnipotent era' of the Q had a beginning (presumably not the same point in time as beginning of the universe, as claimed by the other Q, IIRC), and there was a time before that (else why call it the 'New Era'?). So what was the nature of breakthrough the Q had? What were their species like just before that? Could be an interesting story (though probably near impossible to make a good episode from).
“Transfigurations” may point the way:
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Transfigurations_(episode)
I had the impression that these guys, maybe even more so than Cytherians, might be as advanced as tech users ever get before “ascension” in Stargate terms…like Cylo’s people in Star Wars:
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Cylo
https://screenrant.com/star-wars-new-technology-future-best-ships/
I think there were likely two groups:
one wanted to embrace a more elemental approach to evolution. I think this may have been alluded to in the Star Fleet Medical Reference Manual. I seem to remember a book—perhaps that was it—that wondered what Humanity could have been going a separate path. Beyond even the early “New Humans” ideas or the sudden jolt that caught Gary Mitchell cold.
The second group were more techno-secularists…but even they seemed to be more advanced in all things biological.
They didn’t attack Enterprise D with the typical energy weapons of whatever stripe. At the press of a solenoid, their captain all but put a “Force-choke” on Picard and company—besting Vader.
That’s Time-Lord or Trelane level stuff right there…a display of power more frightening than anything else I’ve seen. A true Death Ray.
Who knows how that was done.
The Q were likely at the same level. They either survive the Krell moment and transcend…or-
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The Zalkonians from Transfigurations remind me of Jason Ironheart From Babylon 5 season 1 "Mind War". Given the B5 episode came 4 years after the TNG one i suspect that the B5 episode borrowed heavily. Yet the B5 episode did follow up on the idea, in a way as it was later revealed that the 'first ones', the settings eldest races, had undergone similar transformations in their own past, and one, the vorlons, had engineered the younger races to accellerate the process as part of their eons long ideological conflicts.
In the B5 episode though the whole thing was a fluke caused by experiments, while the TNgG episode was the whole species on the edge of such a change, which would have been very interesting to follow up on
In the B5 episode though the whole thing was a fluke caused by experiments, while the TNgG episode was the whole species on the edge of such a change, which would have been very interesting to follow up on
I never got the impression that the Zalkonians were particularly advanced, only slightly more advanced than the Federation. Ship probably is slightly faster (they're coming in at warp 9.72 which makes Riker say they are obviously in a big hurry, but they're still over 10 hours away so apparently they don't have transwarp), and the tactical size up after scanning the ship says they should be about evenly matched.
But I agree that the choking attack is hard to explain assuming that level of technology.
But I agree that the choking attack is hard to explain assuming that level of technology.
Some breakthrough was made in biology…such that perhaps other tech priorities fell away. We only saw one of their vessels.
Ironically, the early configuration of that ship model—pre roll-bar, was the most advanced looking craft Trek ever had pre-Jellyfish:
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/TNG_studio_models#Tarellian_starship
Yet the dialogue called it “primitive.”
I still fume at that one. That’s as angry as I’ve ever been at the decision making.
TNG-R should have used a Malon-looking thing, or two huge rocket bodies on each end of a tether for artificial gravity—-augh!
The globe at the core of this beautiful craft
just FITS the story being told in Transfigurations:
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/TNG_studio_models?file=Tarellian_starship,_forward_view.jpg
Had I been Gene, I might have said to Andy:
“That ship’s too cool for the Tarellians.”
Sternbach had this painting of nuclear pulse Orions here in the May 1983 SCIENCE DIGEST…that looked like this:
http://toughsf.blogspot.com/2022/03/fusion-without-fissiles-superbombs-and.html?m=1
“Get a Saturn V nose…put a sphere in place of the capsule…and glue the assembly (or a bullet shaped propeller cover) to one of those meat tenderizer things that look like that pusher-plate:
https://www.amazon.com/Fox-Run-5638...+loaded+meat+tenderizer&qid=1667727287&sr=8-4
-done.”
Ironically, the early configuration of that ship model—pre roll-bar, was the most advanced looking craft Trek ever had pre-Jellyfish:
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/TNG_studio_models#Tarellian_starship
Yet the dialogue called it “primitive.”
I still fume at that one. That’s as angry as I’ve ever been at the decision making.
TNG-R should have used a Malon-looking thing, or two huge rocket bodies on each end of a tether for artificial gravity—-augh!
The globe at the core of this beautiful craft
just FITS the story being told in Transfigurations:
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/TNG_studio_models?file=Tarellian_starship,_forward_view.jpg
Had I been Gene, I might have said to Andy:
“That ship’s too cool for the Tarellians.”
Sternbach had this painting of nuclear pulse Orions here in the May 1983 SCIENCE DIGEST…that looked like this:
http://toughsf.blogspot.com/2022/03/fusion-without-fissiles-superbombs-and.html?m=1
“Get a Saturn V nose…put a sphere in place of the capsule…and glue the assembly (or a bullet shaped propeller cover) to one of those meat tenderizer things that look like that pusher-plate:
https://www.amazon.com/Fox-Run-5638...+loaded+meat+tenderizer&qid=1667727287&sr=8-4
-done.”
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I know you will probably write a small novella in return about how I'm supposedly completely wrong in your eyes.
But the choice of words did imply the Klingons as a whole. Wesley said "the Klingons joined the Federation" not "some Klingons joined the Federation" or "before there were Klingons in the Federation"
It's pretty obvious that by the time that line was written it was meant to say that the Klingons as an entity had joined up. Later episodes contradicted that and so the line is a rejected concept and nothing more.
Plus, if Klingon populations had joined the Federation, we never hear of or see them, despite the endless Klingon episodes and storylines in Berman Trek.
Sexual attraction in LGBT+ individuals is more connected to hormones.
Given that there are many similarities of hormonal structures between gay men and female women (and despite the fact hormones and pheromones are comparable chemicals), I suspect the gay men onboard would have been similarly immune like straight females were.
Here's a more real world description of hormones and pheromones:
Hormones and pheromones are comparable chemicals; they both cause physiological and behavioral changes by communicating information between different systems. In hormones, this communication occurs between the organs and cells of one individual. In pheromones this occurs between individuals, outside the body.
And from here:
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7358-pheromone-attracts-straight-women-and-gay-men/
"Smelling a male pheromone prompts the same brain activity in homosexual men as it does in heterosexual women, a new study has found. It did not excite the sex-related region in the brains of heterosexual males, although an oestrogen-derived compound found in female urine did."
To me this is what it boils down to:
Hormones and pheromones are comparable chemicals, but they both affect individuals in different ways.
Since Orion females sexual attraction rely and predominantly works through pheromones, they wouldn't really affect gay men or straight women (because the hormonal structure in their bodies that regulates sexual attraction is different)... in essence, orion female pheromones would be 'incompatible' with how the body has been wired via hormonal structures.
As such, gay women and straight men WOULD be affected. As for trans... again, it would depend on whom they're attracted to.
If a person is bisexual, then the pheromones would work on that person irrespective of their gender.
As for asexual humans... I don't know how effective Orion female pheromones would be here because asexual people may not experience sexual attraction... but rather a romantic one.
With orion females, the pheromones mainly stimulate sexual arousal... and in asexual people, this might not work really.
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