Tuvix Episode Revisited

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by Robert Leva, Apr 7, 2021.

  1. Oddish

    Oddish Commodore Fleet Captain

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    He was wearing a Starfleet uniform with lieutenant insignia. That suggests that, for intents and purposes, he "inherited" Tuvok's rank and position.
     
  2. Mr.Mork

    Mr.Mork Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Why so much lack of concern from the crew? Did they dislike Tuvix that much or was it because they wanted Tuvox and Neelix back that they couldn't careless if Tuvix died? I know it was Capt. Janeway's decision alone, but it doesn't seem like she got much resistance from the others expect from the Dr. Does this episode make her look like a tyrant?
     
  3. Oddish

    Oddish Commodore Fleet Captain

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    More like a cult leader.
     
  4. Mr.Mork

    Mr.Mork Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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  5. Mr.Mork

    Mr.Mork Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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  6. at Quark's

    at Quark's Commodore Commodore

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    Not without some initial hesitation, though:

     
  7. Athena28

    Athena28 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I never had an issue with Janeway's decision.
     
  8. douwed

    douwed Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Although I quite liked Tuvix, I also had no problem with Janeway's decision. I can understand why Tuvix wouldn't want it, but both Tuvok and Neelix were important members of the crew, their rights should not be ignored either.
     
  9. Oddish

    Oddish Commodore Fleet Captain

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    No, they shouldn't.

    It was a terrible decision to have to make, and there was no good resolution. To paraphrase from one of DS9's lower quality efforts, I cannot condone what Janeway did... but I understand it.
     
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  10. douwed

    douwed Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    I don't think it was a terrible decision to make at all. Janewaywas speaking for two People who couldn't speak themselves. I don't think either Tuvok or Neelix complained.

    Janeway would have been damned no matter what she did. Otherwise people would have been in a fit why she wouldn't restore two cewmembers if she could.
     
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  11. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Bullshit.

    Janeway was going to let Tuvix live.

    Then Kes talked her out of it.

    She couldn't live without him.

    6 months later, she dumps Neelix.

    Lived without him fine.
     
  12. douwed

    douwed Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    And Janeway would know all of that at the time, how exactly? She had to make a choice and with the info at hand she made, what she thought at least, the best one.

    Wouldn't you want the same if your partner had been blended with one of your friends?
     
  13. Mr.Mork

    Mr.Mork Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Also, Janeway may have been considering Tuvok's wife and family back home. He was married with a family (grown adult children no doubt) but still part of Tuvok's life none the less. I think that would be more a consideration of her decision besides that of Kes missing Neelix. She may of had that on her mind as well.
     
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  14. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    There's two ways of looking at Kes. A 2 year old with the life experiences of a two year old. A Mayflower who's point of view changes a dozens more times rapidly than a human.

    In either case her concept of Love is pithy.

    That's the point.

    Kes was a place holder for T'Pel, which was one of the cited reasons why they should Kill Tuvix. Kes' outpouring of love, reminded Janeway that husbands and wives love each other.
     
  15. douwed

    douwed Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Just because she was young is not a reason to dismiss her feelings so easily. Just because she is young doesn't mean her feelings are any less valid than the feelings of someone older.

    Had I been in Kes's shoes I would want Neelix back as well.
     
  16. Swedish Borg

    Swedish Borg Fleet Captain Red Shirt

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    Yeah, Janeway murdered Tuvix based on her stupid outburst. Had I been in Tuvix' shoes I would have deleted the doctor and replaced him with a clown act. The irony is that if Tuvix had done something like that the worst that could have happened to him is being confined in his quarters and likely not for long since that doesn't qualify as murder. At best it could be considered as destruction of Starfleet property which is not that big of an offense. Plus they couldn't keep him from leaving the ship which he should have done. With friends like these assholes who watched him taken away to be executed without as much as a peep, who needs enemies?
     
  17. Oddish

    Oddish Commodore Fleet Captain

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    Kes's reaction was very, poignantly real. She didn't just declare how badly she wanted Neelix back, she declared that Tuvix didn't deserve to die. She and the Doctor were the only ones to even acknowledge that. Compare it with Janeway's coldbloodedness and the other characters' not speaking a word of protest.
     
  18. Swedish Borg

    Swedish Borg Fleet Captain Red Shirt

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    Just imagine Janeway enters sickbay to execute Tuvix and suddenly the doctor turns into a clown unable to remember anything about medicine and making all sorts of stupid clown jokes (a la Neelix) and Tuvix with a big smile turning toward Janeway: "So what are you going to do now..."Captain"?"
     
  19. Oddish

    Oddish Commodore Fleet Captain

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    I prefer...

    JANEWAY: "Mr. Tuvix, could you come with me please?"

    TUVIX: "Computer, execute program Tuvix-one."

    Zappp! The transporter engages and Tuvix disappears. Several small explosions around the bridge, no one is hurt.

    JANEWAY: "What happened?"

    AYALA: "He rigged a site to site transport."

    CHAKOTAY: "He knew what we were thinking."

    JANEWAY: "And planned ahead. Exactly what Tuvok would have done."

    COMPUTER: "Unauthorized shuttle launch in Shuttle Bay 2."

    CHAKOTAY: "Neelix's ship."

    JANEWAY: "Tractor beam."

    OPS CREWMAN (Kim is in sickbay): "Tractor beam is offline, captain. So are all long-range sensors."

    PARIS: "Neelix's ship has cleared the shuttlebay... he's gone to warp."

    JANEWAY: "Track that ship's warp signature. Prepare to pursue. He can't hope to outrun Voyager."

    TORRES: "The warp core is locked in a diagnostic cycle, Captain. I'll need at least half an hour before we can go to warp."

    CHAKOTAY: "That's not much of a head start."

    JANEWAY: "Maybe not. But we're dealing with Neelix's vast knowledge of the quadrant, combined with Tuvok's trained mind. He won't be easy to find."

    Tuvix escapes!
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2021
  20. MacLeod

    MacLeod Admiral Admiral

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    I think most of us would, but would you be ok with murdering someone to get them back?

    Wherever you fall on the matter I think most of us can all agree that this has to be one of the most often debated episodes at least on this forum.