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TLJ to blame?

Was TLJ the death knell for the franchise?


  • Total voters
    45
The second one
Okay so he couldn't have gone and shot a thousand volts up Pal's rear end but he could have gone and ruined his washing he had on the line and given Kylo Ren a snow day every now and again to try and cheer him up a bit.
 
Both of which were discarded due to budgetary reasons, not necessarily discarded as concepts.
Either way it's still a concept that has for all intents and purposes come out of nowhere in movie eight without any sort of build up nor an explanation for why he hasn't been doing so until now. Jaws was planned to feature the shark a lot more too, I don't think anyone would say that making another Jaws sequel where we spend lots of time lingering on shots of the shark leaping out of the water and devouring people.
 
Either way it's still a concept that has for all intents and purposes come out of nowhere in movie eight without any sort of build up nor an explanation for why he hasn't been doing so until now. Jaws was planned to feature the shark a lot more too, I don't think anyone would say that making another Jaws sequel where we spend lots of time lingering on shots of the shark leaping out of the water and devouring people.
I wouldn't mind. :shrug:

Here's the thing. There are many powers regarding the Force that are not explained. Force ghosts are not so the rules are not clear. So, much like Force ghost coming back in ESB out of nowhere, we have Yoda's power.
 
I wouldn't mind. :shrug:

Here's the thing. There are many powers regarding the Force that are not explained. Force ghosts are not so the rules are not clear. So, much like Force ghost coming back in ESB out of nowhere, we have Yoda's power.
They came back within the first like half hour of the movie. Yeah we didn't see Obi Wan but his choices were either sitting on Luke's lap while he flew the x-wing or like hanging on the wing and shouting into him. Yes neither could be done for budget or special effect reasons but I'm also going to go out on limb that they may have not gone with a visible Kenobi for other reasons too. Second if ghosts have these powers why didn't they show up and help? Why didn't Kenobi scare away the yeti or help Luke when he was getting his ass kicked on cloud city. Could he just not be bothered? Even if it was Yoda who could do this stuff he still could have lent Luke a hand over Endor. Took one or two of those force blasts for Luke. Thing is, is that by not having those things they have given us some unwritten rules of what a force ghost is. Now I'm not saying you can't break rules but to have Yoda break those rules so he can burn Luke's huse down and tell him to stop being so harsh on Ray seems a little silly. At lest to me.
Also general consensus by the people making the films and the people who watch them is that both Jaws and Alien work better due to budget and special effect limitations. Would all of that extend to force ghosts in Jedi. Personally I'm going to say yes. The dead can give us lessons and warnings but they can't help us anymore. It's up to the living to do what needs to be done.
 
They came back within the first like half hour of the movie. Yeah we didn't see Obi Wan but his choices were either sitting on Luke's lap while he flew the x-wing or like hanging on the wing and shouting into him. Yes neither could be done for budget or special effect reasons but I'm also going to go out on limb that they may have not gone with a visible Kenobi for other reasons too. Second if ghosts have these powers why didn't they show up and help? Why didn't Kenobi scare away the yeti or help Luke when he was getting his ass kicked on cloud city. Could he just not be bothered? Even if it was Yoda who could do this stuff he still could have lent Luke a hand over Endor. Took one or two of those force blasts for Luke. Thing is, is that by not having those things they have given us some unwritten rules of what a force ghost is. Now I'm not saying you can't break rules but to have Yoda break those rules so he can burn Luke's huse down and tell him to stop being so harsh on Ray seems a little silly. At lest to me
Still not explained. So, I am curious as to why Yoda's power needs an explanation now, while Force ghost does not. :shrug:
Also general consensus by the people making the films and the people who watch them is that both Jaws and Alien work better due to budget and special effect limitations. Would all of that extend to force ghosts in Jedi. Personally I'm going to say yes. The dead can give us lessons and warnings but they can't help us anymore. It's up to the living to do what needs to be done.
To each their own. I know my taste in films is not like others. I personally did not enjoy Alien or Jaws so seeing a different version is always of interest to me.
 
Still not explained. So, I am curious as to why Yoda's power needs an explanation now, while Force ghost does not. :shrug:
Because force ghosts were in movie number one. They then appeared in the next two movies doing nothing other than giving pep talks. They were established as being a thing about two minutes after our first Jedi died and we now want to know, if they could actually do things other than play charades and twenty questions why they didn't do so. You're adding a retroactive conundrum to your universe.

To each their own. I know my taste in films is not like others. I personally did not enjoy Alien or Jaws so seeing a different version is always of interest to me.
Fair enough but you can see the point I'm trying to make about limitations shaping the story/ film and that producing what is considered a good product to the point where they would be loathe to go back and change it even if they could. Whether Lucas would go back and add in Kenobi giving Luke a force shield if he could I don't know.
 
Because force ghosts were in movie number one. They then appeared in the next two movies doing nothing other than giving pep talks. They were established as being a thing about two minutes after our first Jedi died and we now want to know, if they could actually do things other than play charades and twenty questions why they didn't do so. You're adding a retroactive conundrum to your universe.
Since coming back in a physical form seems to take some effort (since Qui-Gon did not reappear) and some learning, perhaps it took that time to learn. I don't need everything explained.
Fair enough but you can see the point I'm trying to make about limitations shaping the story/ film and that producing what is considered a good product to the point where they would be loathe to go back and change it even if they could. Whether Lucas would go back and add in Kenobi giving Luke a force shield if he could I don't know.
I think art thrives under limitations. I also enjoy seeing different variations too. Good products are often a lot of happy accidents, to misquote Bob Ross ;)
 
Since coming back in a physical form seems to take some effort (since Qui-Gon did not reappear) and some learning, perhaps it took that time to learn. I don't need everything explained.

He did in at least two episodes of TCW, which is canon. ;)
 
He did in at least two episodes of TCW, which is canon. ;)
Well, no. His first appearance is implied to be a hallucination, possibly backed up by the fact that in his second episode he's only a disembodied voice, as he died before learning how to manifest himself visually.
 
Solo failed because Beckett shot first. That was a terrible creative choice that brought the whole franchise down with it.
 
Well, no. His first appearance is implied to be a hallucination, possibly backed up by the fact that in his second episode he's only a disembodied voice, as he died before learning how to manifest himself visually.
I don’t think his first appearance was an illusion, I think the reason he was visible was because they were essentially in the force, probably similar to the world between worlds in Rebels.

Obi-Wan thought the entire experience was an illusion, but Anakin didn’t. Rebels sort of proves it wasn’t, with depictions of the family on the temple walls.
 
I liked TLJ fine the night I saw it. Good, not great. I went to Rogue One before it just to experience the SW universe in theater. Plot- and character-wise an utter waste of time, i.e. a WWII, platoon-movie, defeat the weapon, you know what I mean. So I felt kinda ripped off, kinda not.

I saw SW several times in '77 in movie palaces in metro Detroit. Went to all the prequels, of course.

Didn't see Solo.

Just wasn't interested.

Now that we have SW movies coming out of ears, I'm not all that caring about ep 9. I'll prob go. They used to be rare, and a big deal. Now just another Big Movie. ymmv
 
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