The Walking Dead Season 4

[Q2UnME]

It feels like nothing is happening this season.

Sure, Carol was exiled, but she wasn't killed. Which means nothing in this world. Though if she stays away I could see her being the lead for the spin-off series.

Bolded for emphsis....

That is the first thing I thought of when the show ended last night. It fits well in the prime show and makes available a very well liked character to anchor the new show. Time will tell if they, the creators, play it that way..

Q2

 

[Scout101]

I hope not, only because I want to get out of central Georgia. I want more big picture, more of what WWZ should have been. A different camp 50 miles away doesn't add anything to the overall story that Rick's group couldn't already do. Go somewhere different, take a different angle, something.

 

[SG-17]

I hope not, only because I want to get out of central Georgia. I want more big picture, more of what WWZ should have been. A different camp 50 miles away doesn't add anything to the overall story that Rick's group couldn't already do. Go somewhere different, take a different angle, something.

It would be nice to see a series set either in the cold north or the hot southwest.

 

[Scout101]

Kinda the same deal, though. I want a different ANGLE on the end of the world, not different WEATHER. Either more global, or government group, boat people, something different. Or show more of the initial period instead of just the aftermath.

Don't just grab a different group and put them in parkas or shorts. Go beyond the 'what if Rick lived in Canada' concept and do something else. Tie it in, but don't make it a photocopy.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

People want to agree with Carol, morally, & I get that, but that's not even the point. The point is, Carol wasn't even right. By the time she killed Karen & David. Others in the camp had long since been exposed to the virus.

We did not see what condition Karen nd David were in when they were killed, but if next week's preview is an indicator, the doctor--after having having coughing symptoms--will have red eyes and more bleeding from the mouth--just like the nerd kid. We all know where that goes, and with no treatment, there is only one path: death and reanimation as a walker. Carol understood what was happening, and there are no hospitals around anymore to jump on an problem before it spreads. As she pointed out, they (Karen and David) would drown on their own blood, so while the healthy are running around trying to maintain things, Karen and David could have turned at any moment.


How long must Rick wait before buying that all important clue? From Amy to Lori, Milton to the nerd kid, the path to death--whether by bite, complications of childbirth, a mortal wound or disease only goes in one direction. If one does not act fast, what happens?

It does not take nearly two years to figure it out.

Andrea certainly did not con herself in the wake of Milton's attack, thinking, "well, maybe i'm just different, and can sweat this out. Keep your fingers crossed!" Carl did not hold back with his own mother. Rick can argue "you did not know," but Carol knew--as well as Rick--that the disease is out of control, and even a run for antibiotics does not guarantee anything, as no one is sure what they're dealing with.

She jumped the gun, killed two people, for nothing & obviously knows that, when she has her frustrated outburst with the water barrels.

We do not know that. She just as easily could be frustrated that they are now dealing with a problem that does not exclusively need a bite or cut from a walker to spread (but will if you give a walker the chance).

Rick's assessment that many won't want her there or will want her executed is correct

Big leap. Take a good look at the decision making process Glorious Rick was willing to make--or carried out: would YOU want to be around a guy who killed his best friend?

For a guy who sees himself as the moral compass of the world, think of his options with Shane: at any time during the second half of season two, he--and others seeing Shane as a threat--could have rendered him unconscious, used two cars to transport him out as far as their gas would take them (for a safe return), and exile him in the same way they were going to dump Randall. Instead, he allowed the problem to continue, but when HE was threatened--he killed Shane. Yet he justifies it (well, tries to) by saying:

I killed my best friend for you people, for Christ's sake! You saw what he was like. How he pushed me. How he compromised us. How he threatened us.

Nice turnaround. Yeah, he would go on to add Shane's Randall plot in there, but he tops it off with:

My hands are clean

His hands are clean for a killing that was all about himself, yet Carol--honestly thinking of the safety of the entire group is the pariah?

That is not maintaining a social order. He's a hypocrite.

Rick is full of crap, and i'm sure his decision will come back to kick him in the ass.

 

[DarthTom]

I hope not, only because I want to get out of central Georgia. I want more big picture, more of what WWZ should have been. A different camp 50 miles away doesn't add anything to the overall story that Rick's group couldn't already do. Go somewhere different, take a different angle, something.

I went on the Walking Dead tour which included a trip to Senoia GA [Woodbury] as well as the studios just outside the town where the prison was built as an ongoing soundstage. If they plan to stay filminng there - it seems hard that they will be able to make the area look like anything else but central GA.

I suppose parts of Atlanta could double in terms of an enviornment for any city but I'd wager it's hard to film here on a larger scale [massive zombie attacks ets] without causing big time distruptions to the business community.

 

[propita]

Cades Cove , TN. That place is hidden like the vale of Rivendell. It was a farming settlement, natural protection with the mountains, and not too far for them to reasonably make it to.

I would die of utter happiness to see them in Cades Cove, since that's just 20 miles from me (30 by car). Plus the scenery is perfect, there's almost no modern development, and I'm sure the National Park wouldn't at all mind the (further) increased tourism if they decided to film there....

Never gonna happen I'm sure, but it can't hurt to dream.

This makes me think that someplace like Yosemite could be a good place to settle. Once the walkers already there are taken care of, it’s seriously unlikely any will wander in since it’s pretty isolated. And there’s game, water, shelter, and if seeds are brought, level areas for some crops in the spring and summer. Snow can be dealt with. There’s plenty of firewood for a small enough group (less than 1000).

 

[Scout101]

That's basically the key to survival in pretty much ANY end of the world situation. Especially at the beginning of the collapse, you need to get the hell away from everyone. The more isolated, the better.

In a regular disaster situation (like power is gone in Revolution on NBC), you need to go away until the huge die-off of people. Just not enough food/shelter/medicine/skills to support these huge population centers, the more urban the place, the worse it would be. In a zombie situation, you need to stay away from population centers for good, since they population didn't really DIE

Silliest part of TWD is that they're still just outside Atlanta after 2 years. There's about 6 million people in the metro area, that's a LOT of zombies. Just not supportable that they'd be that close and still not overrun. Need to either be making for a way more isolated area, or grab a boat and pick a nice island somewhere. Can clear that thing out easy and be good to go.

 

[Dorian Thompson]

Maybe the walkers with the infection were people came there for the same reason they did, but the infection overcame them before they could treat it?

That was my take on it. They had been people sick with the flu, desperate for any kind of meds. Not so far fetched. Someone in their group new about a vet clinic nearby. That's all it would have taken to have sick people descend en masse.

I can still see both sides of the Rick/Carol thing. Shane was actively trying to murder Rick. I cannot fault Rick for that. At that point, they didn't have the gas to waste to drive Shane somewhere and "drop him off." Rick was the only one certain that Shane was trying to murder him; Shane's not going to admit it to the group.

As far as the Carl/kid thing, that kid wasn't one of the group. Perhaps a heartless difference, but still.....and then Carol did take it upon herself to do what she did. I think it was her lack of remorse of any kind and the behavior she demonstrated toward the poor, naive hippie kid and chick with the fake thing, "Sure! Go scrounging for food and supplies for us!" that shook Rick.

They'll probably face some threat next week before Rick even has the chance to say anything. The reaction of others should be interesting. Will they condemn him? The new people will hail Rick a hero since Karen and David were two of their own. Herschel may condemn him, but Maggie won't. Glen's in the sick ward. Following Carol's logic, Glen would have been dead at her hand. Lizzie and Mica won't like what Rick did since they love Carol. Michonne could go either way, and then there's Daryl, who stated he'd put a bullet in the head of the "culprit." Tyrese will give Rick a thumbs up, but Daryl....there is the fascinating conflict du jour. There's always been that little je ne sais quoi between Daryl and Carol since Sophia's demise. Friendship, strong platonic love, potential romantic connection....something. I cannot believe that the writers would craft this story just to get him a younger girlfriend.

If you follow the timeline, Carol did this right after Lizzie and Mica's father left his girls in her care. There was the attack on the ward; Carol immediately dragged him into the cell and went to get the girls. Then there was the meeting during which the infection was revealed and Karen came around the corner into the hallway. From a psychological standpoint, Sophia 2.0 and 3.0 being left in Carol's care in the midst of a new crisis may have been the trigger. Maybe Daryl would get that while Rick wouldn't. But does that mean Carol isn't worthy of punishment? Some people will recover from this flu. Didn't Karen and David deserve the chance? Or at that point did Carol not have enough information?

 

[Admiral2]

Just adding for the record, I'm on team Carol.

 

[wissaboo]

I don't know if it was just the killing that made Rick think they had to get rid of Carol, it was the sociopathic way she's been acting ever since. If she had questioned if what she did was right she would probably still be there.

I'm curious to see if Rick even has to explain what happened to her. Just coming back from the run without her and letting everyone just make their own assumptions is probably the better way.

 

[Dorian Thompson]

Yeah, others would make the assumption, but Daryl is going to ask what happened to Carol. Rick's going to lie to him by omission? I can't see it. I wonder if Rick is going to come to regret his actions. I do agree that's it's Carol's seemingly numb, cold, sociopathic behavior since the killings that put Rick over the edge. Rick has kids. Daryl doesn't. If Daryl doesn't specifically ask, the writers aren't paying attention to what went on before.

Carol obviously was affected by her actions. Her going outside to fix the water system putting herself in grave danger, her anger and tipping over the water.....it all fits. I still think the girls being left in her care was the trigger.

 

[DarthTom]

That is not maintaining a social order. He's a hypocrite.

Rick is full of crap, and i'm sure his decision will come back to kick him in the ass.

I agree with everything you've said in your post however, part of the complexity of then versus now is that there is a larger group to consider and the potential break down of what's left of the moral fabric and social order inside the prison.

We saw how Tyreese reacted to Carol's actions and basically giving Rick an ultimatum about finding Karen's murderer.

 

[davejames]

I don't understand those who say Rick wasn't justified in killing Shane. It was always obvious that he kept Shane around as long as he did because they needed the manpower and he was damn good at killing zombies. Rick gambled that it was worth the risk, until obviously things came to a head and he had no choice but to kill him in self-defense.

As for Carol, her actions might have been justified if the entire group was trapped together in the same room or something. But Karen and David had already been isolated in a separate building and were no danger to anybody anymore, except other sick people. To not even give them a chance to heal and overcome the sickness just seems wrong and cruel to me.

It showed that Carol had become so cold she might kill any ONE of them in their sleep if she thought there was the slightest chance they could pose a threat. Which is definitely not someone you want to keep around for long.

 

[sojourner]

I think Daryl will go looking for Carol. Assuming Rick doesn't lie about her fate. If he does claim she died, it will most assuredly bite him on the ass later when someone sees her alive somewhere.

 

[Admiral2]

I don't understand those who say Rick wasn't justified in killing Shane. It was always obvious that he kept Shane around as long as he did because they needed the manpower and he was damn good at killing zombies. Rick gambled that it was worth the risk, until obviously things came to a head and he had no choice but to kill him in self-defense.

As for Carol, her actions might have been justified if the entire group was trapped together in the same room or something. But Karen and David had already been isolated in a separate building and were no danger to anybody anymore, except other sick people. To not even give them a chance to heal and overcome the sickness just seems wrong and cruel to me.

It showed that Carol had become so cold she might kill any ONE of them in their sleep if she thought there was the slightest chance they could pose a threat. Which is definitely not someone you want to keep around for long.

Maybe, but watch her come back leading a bigger group. People always like direct action.

 

[marillion]

Logically, Rick will arrive back at the prison, brush off quesitons about Carol and then pull Darryl/Herschel/Glen/Maggie aside and explain to them what happened. The idea that exiling her for her own protection against Tyresse's reprisal for her actions is/was sound. Should Tyresse try to exact revenge, he would certainly have support from others from Woodbury. This would pit them against the core WD cast and create a civil war like atmosphere within the confines of the prison.

While I can certainly see merit in supporting what Carol did, the reprocussions, I think, would be too great in leaving her unpunished..

 

[Mojochi]

^ That's not why Rick did it though. He confessed to her that the reason was because even he believed she couldn't be in the group anymore. He couldn't have it & others would be of the same mind. Is she wrong in doing what she did to increase odds of survival? Maybe, maybe not. I can see support in either way of looking at it. Regardless, killing your group members because they pose a risk might be a good way to survive, but it's a bad way to survive with other people, because they will never again see you as being on their side anymore. There can be no allegiance in a group where at any turn they might cut you down, or leave you behind

It was shitty moral compass when Shane felt that way & it still is. Maybe it works to keep alive longer, but then you just need to strike out on your own. No one will be able to unite with you being that way

 

[Trekker4747]

....

Are you even watching the same show as the rest of us?! Shane was an active threat and SET TO KILL Rick. Rick killed Shane in self defense. Carol killed to innocent people who were locked up and even if/when they died and turned they were in cells and posed no threat. Carol killed them, wrongly, and without consulting the Council.

 

[Ryan8bit]

Maybe Carol will run into the Governor. Maybe she'll even join whatever group he has, although perhaps not entirely willingly. This seems like such an easy dramatic conflict though.