Spoilers The Matrix Resurrections discussion and reviews

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Saul, Dec 17, 2021.

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How do you rate The Matrix Resurrections?

  1. 10: The One

    4 vote(s)
    8.3%
  2. 9: Neo. I believe

    5 vote(s)
    10.4%
  3. 8: Dodge this

    9 vote(s)
    18.8%
  4. 7: Have a cookie

    9 vote(s)
    18.8%
  5. 6: All I'm offering is the truth. Nothing more.

    9 vote(s)
    18.8%
  6. 5: The blue pill or the red one?

    5 vote(s)
    10.4%
  7. 4: Everything that has a beginning has an end

    1 vote(s)
    2.1%
  8. 3: Never send a human to do a machine's job

    2 vote(s)
    4.2%
  9. 2: I know this steak doesn't exist

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. 1: The prohecy was false

    3 vote(s)
    6.3%
  11. 0: Goodbye Mr. Anderson

    1 vote(s)
    2.1%
  1. XCV330

    XCV330 Premium Member

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    I got the feeling that Neo was well guarded both within and without the Matrix, but he did have at least some interaction with coppertops. He made eye contact with Bugs when he tried to fly, so they were at least allowed into the same physical space as him.
     
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  2. Jaster

    Jaster Captain Captain

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    24 hours after, I still don’t know what I think of this movie. Genuinely. Not sure what to make of it. Very odd.

    I don’t hate it, but I don’t love it. If it were a colour, I fear it would be taupe.
     
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  3. Mr. Adventure

    Mr. Adventure Admiral Admiral

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    After you lose the Z and N there isn't much left for IO...
     
  4. MakeshiftPython

    MakeshiftPython Commodore Commodore

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    Her kiss brought Neo back to life in the first one.

    THE POWER OF LOVE!

    Or as The Architect put it: "vis-à-vis, LOVE"
     
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  5. YellowSubmarine

    YellowSubmarine Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I interpreted it to mean they were the litmus test. If it worked on them, it worked on everybody else. Whatever the “it” was.
     
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  6. Markonian

    Markonian Fleet Admiral Moderator

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    Saw it a few hours ago.
    I love it!

    It's meta without breaking the fourth wall. It expands on the worldbuilding - Machines diversifying, fighting one another, some joining the Humans. It felt very Treklike to have the Mnemosyne's organic crew, and Neo!, treat their artificial crewmates as friends. Neo and Cybebe forehead-cuddle is a powerful and heartwarming moment.

    That means that despite Earth having been trashed and major, unrelenting wars between Humans and Machines, there's hope for a cooperative future. Something that is better than mere survival, a victory, or a temporary truce.

    For a franchise that is based around "evil machines take over the world", that's a gutsy move. (On the nerdy side, I sometimes wonder how the Machines, Skynet/Legion and the Cylons would get along if they met?)

    Next, I want merch. Ideally, hovercraft models and a plushie of that ethereal, bird-manta like blue Synthient. Thanks.
     
  7. Xerxes82

    Xerxes82 Captain Captain

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    Except if they are just proof of concept, why are they necessary to the functioning of the system? The film hinges on the idea that with the two of them removed the "New" Matrix will break down and collapse, requiring a reset to a previous version in order to maintain integrity.
     
  8. The Knappos

    The Knappos Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    This was dull and boring, nearly sent me to sleep a couple of times.

    To paraphrase Niobe, “Everything changes except Matrix sequels being awful”
     
  9. YellowSubmarine

    YellowSubmarine Vice Admiral Admiral

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    To ensure that everything is still within the necessary parameters, they need to be constantly plugged and monitored.

    The bigger issue with that interpretation is that we can clearly see Neo also has an active role, by the virtue of creating the Matrix video game and hiding the truth in plain sight.
     
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  10. Noname Given

    Noname Given Admiral Admiral

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    I liked the film. I was a little worried at the start of it because I thought they might just do a psuedo remake of the first film, but once it got into it I thought the new story was interesting. I also liked the motivation for the Sati sentient program.

    In the end I think the producers just wanted to give the fans the ending the third film should have had. Of the previous two sequels I enjoyed Reloaded but I hated Revolutions; so this came across as an attempt to fix that last film.

    The only other question they didn't quite answer is: Was the Analyst a brand new program, or was he an evolution of the Architect of the original Matrix (who had created the five previous versions of The Matrix)?

    As for the Agent Smith storyline, I agree that if they could have got Hugo Weaving back for some sort of cameo, it would have been nice and made the character's inclusion more enjoyable. That said I didn't have a problem with his inclusion here because he was still after the same thing he was in the first trilogy. He hated being a cog of The Matrix and wanted to take full control of it, and be the only one calling the shots in that digital world. Smith still wanted to do the same thing here, but knew he had to get rid of the analyst to have a shot at carrying his plan out; so he teamed up with Neo and the rest to get rid of the analyst, and once that was accomplished, he once again turned on Neo; and attempted again to take full control of The Matrix.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2021
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  11. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I just watched Resurrections. I enjoyed it a lot and I like how they made it work. I'd definitely watch it in the theater again.
     
  12. Markonian

    Markonian Fleet Admiral Moderator

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    That nobody dies is a good thing.
    It’s a staple to create drama by just offing a main or side character. Harder to maintain high stakes when everyone can survive.

    Personally, I loved the fact that the Mnemosyne’s crew gets to live instead of going out like the disposable redshirts of the Neb in Matrix I.
     
  13. USS Firefly

    USS Firefly Commodore Commodore

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    I thought the movie was ok. I really missed Weaving and Fishbourne. And I didn't like the fighting in the factory with all the scene cuts during the fights, It looked messy.
     
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  14. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    Rewatched the original trilogy this weekend and saw this one last night.

    Key thoughts:
    • The Matrix Reloaded and The Matrix Revolutions are goddamn perfect and I don't care what anyone else says.
    • It is really interesting, almost startling, how different Lana Wachowski's authorial voice is from the joint authorial voice she shared with her sister when they made the OT. It's much warmer and more humorous.
    • I disagree with the decision to bring back Smith. To me, the death of Smith should be the one true accomplishment of the original trilogy. I don't see why Smith's role in Resurrections was necessary; I could see his role being performed by the Merovingian, for instance.
    • Resurrections is clearly going for something different with its villains than the OT did; both Jonathan Groff and Neil Patrick Harris have this humorous, amused, almost-but-not-quite-winking-at-the-audience vibe to their performances. If that works for you, then I think Resurrections executes that vibe very well. I'm afraid that vibe didn't quite work for me -- I wanted a vibe that was a little bit more series, more earnest, than that vibe. But, I firmly believe in evaluating a work of art on what it's trying to be, not on what you want it to be; on that level it works well.
    • Jessica Henwick is amazing.
    • Keanue Reeves and Carrie-Ann Moss absolutely still rule and I love watching everything they do.
    • I do miss Laurence Fishborne and Hugo Weaving.
    • This movie was a bit of a Sense8 reunion for Lana! And Christina Ricci had a cameo, so it was a bit of a Speed Racer reunion too!
    • Good God do I still adore Eréndira Ibarra.
    • It is notable that while there were some instances of horror (especially people jumping out of windows en masse), nobody with a name died in this movie. This is in stark contrast to the OT, especially the first film, where almost the entire crew of the Nebuchadnezzar dies. I suspect this is deliberate; Lana has said that she wrote this film as part of her grieving process after losing her parents and a close friend all in the same year. On that level, this being a film about, quite literally, the fantasy of resurrection, it's appropriate that none of the characters we the audience bond with should die.
    • On the other hand, I think the lack of character deaths does somewhat undermine the feeling of dramatic stakes. The villains' humorous vibe already made it a little hard to find them menacing, and the lack of any murders on their part made it even harder. But given the kind of movie this wants to be, I think maybe that's appropriate.
    • I really did like the reference to the way the Matrix is able to take even things that are benign and pervert them into yet another system of control, and how frightening and infuriating that is. (As a socialist, it reminded me of capitalism's ability to co-opt radical movements and turn them into new ways to preserve itself.)
    • I absolutely adored the "Go Ask Alice" montage. Can't say enough good things about that scene. It really captures what it can feel like when time is just slipping away from you.
    • I do love seeing Humans and Machines living side-by-side together.
    • I do not know this with any certainty, but I wonder if they made a new Human city called Io instead of still using Zion to avoid people conflating the fictional city with the real-world politics surrounding the Israel/Palestine conflict.
    • The old-age makeup didn't totally work for me, but it was still good to see Jada Pinkett Smith return.
    • Vox media critic Emily VanDerWerff has a really remarkable essay about The Matrix Resurrections's relationship with the therapeutic practice known as cognitive processing therapy, and how Neo's relationship with the trauma of his past in this film spoke to her as she's been working to reintegrate the traumatic events of her past into her life today. It's a really amazing essay that helped me see a new level of depth to this film, and I think everyone should read it. Also, Emily VanDerWerff is a national treasure.
    • The bittersweet ending of The Matrix Revolutions really spoke to me; the unambiguously happy ending of The Matrix Resurrections, ending with this fantasy of absolute power on Neo and Trinity's part, feels a little too easy for me... but, there again, Resurrections's ending is more radical, promising that Neo and Trinity will be able to finally tear down the Matrix on a level that they could not at the end of Revolutions. So maybe that's still the better ending, even if I don't find as much emotional catharsis because it's so happy. The film is trying to do something that maybe doesn't fully speak to my personal aesthetics, but that doesn't make it bad.
    • Overall, I'd probably give it either a B+ or an A-. It doesn't speak to me as fully as the OT did, but it was still a damn good movie.
    Edited to add:

    I think one of my other problems with Jonathan Groff's performance is that we already had an actor other than Hugo Weaving play Smith in this series; Ian Bliss played Smith in possession of Bane's body. Groff has said that he consciously decided not to do an imitation of Hugo Weaving, but Bliss consciously did imitate Weaving's speech patterns and inflections in Reloaded and Revolutions. So it creates this sort of discontinuity that took me out of the film a little bit -- why would Smith maintain the same cadence in a Human body in the Reloaded and Revolutions but not maintain his same cadence in a new digital skin in Resurrections?
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2021
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  15. Mr. Adventure

    Mr. Adventure Admiral Admiral

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    Caught Ricci but didn't think about the connection. I really need to get a good copy of that to watch on my nice HDR OLED TV, it probably looks amazing as the cable compression never did it justice. It's too bad that's not on 4K as that's a movie that could really make it shine.
     
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  16. SJGardner

    SJGardner Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I've just seen this tonight and was pleasantly surprised by it. Ultimately, where the entire Matrix franchise falls flat for me is that the thing that truly intrigues me is the whole concept of a simulated reality, with your mind slowly unraveling as you start questioning everything around you... but the moment they exit it and our world is unquestioningly shown to be a simulation, it devolves into an - admittedly innovative - action movie storyline, where the main selling point is all the stunts. And they have to consistently up the ante every single time. You've already seen Neo stop bullets, walk on walls and jump buildings, now you have to show him battle an army of Smiths and reality glitching in slow-mo as a helicopter smashes into a skyscraper... it's really fun, but it can only go on for a while before it becomes ridiculous and repetitive.

    This movie wasn't different in that regard, but it still managed to put a somewhat fresh spin on this tendency by being absolutely self-aware about it. A great example would be one of lead developer Neo's coworkers talking about how the main selling point of the Matrix franchise (both in-universe and IRL) was bullet-time, and it was really hard to do something new with it for a new release... and then, around the climax, the main villain flat-out tells Neo that his main attack is basically a twist on the original bullet-time. Lana Wachowski's frustrations about having been asked to continue the series for 15 years were palpable during the whole first act, and I've read Smith actor Jonathan Groff admitting that the the meeting where a bunch of young adults who grew up on the Matrix franchise keep explaining what it means to its own creator actually happened in real life, more than once. Anderson being told that Warner Bros will make Matrix 4 with our without him absolutely sounds like something the studio might have actually told Wachowski as well.

    Overall, it didn't really feel like the film poked fun at itself as much as it poked fun at the audience wanting their nostalgia fix as well as at Warner wanting to keep milking a franchise that died fifteen years ago.
    The former was the most obvious in the scene where the new Morpheus meets Neo in the old theater with the leather chairs while the original red pill-blue pill scene is being projected onto the screen behind him, endlessly reciting his predecessor's lines in a bored tone and cutting them all off with blah-blah because you already know what Laurence Fishburne was saying, no need for him to repeat that. Not to mention Neo's huge collection of original Matrix trilogy memorabilia, Bugs' utter awe at accidentally finding Neo's old apartment, the entire crew expectantly looking at Neo to see if he can still fly etc.
    The entire setting of the new Matrix version and Neo's and Trinity's role in its existence can be seen as an allegory on bringing back old characters who have already been written out or even killed off, reversing their endings and robbing them of the closure they had earned just so that you can keep telling new stories about them, and hoping that it will be enough to keep the money flowing in.
     
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  17. Markonian

    Markonian Fleet Admiral Moderator

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    Let's hope it does! To quote Cabot Finch: "Less is not more. More is more. So make more!"

    I want some merch from the franchise this time round.
     
  18. Jax

    Jax Admiral Admiral

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    Just seen it - didn't hate it nor did I love it.

    Bugs was awesome and Neo/Trinity still kick ass and were wonderful in their roles but...

    I think it's the weakest of the 4 movies (I love the original trilogy). It lacked the energy of the previous films despite a very interesting 30 minutes at the start. I like we got to hear about a Machine Civil War but I disliked they undid Neo's entire story by having Zion destroyed later during this conflict and killing Morpheus in the process. There wasn't any real reason for Smith to be there - Smith was deleted/purged and rebuilding Neo should NOT of meant Smith returned. Smith doesn't even kill the Analyst anyway.

    I also don't understand why it suggested that Neo & Trinity together made him the one when we know previous versions existed without such a relationship. Neo & Trinity together forced him down a different path as we saw in Matrix Reloaded but it's not the reason why his source code made him the One in the first place.

    The ending was jarring and abrupt - Matrix 1 did the same but it worked in that film.
     
  19. wayoung

    wayoung Commodore Commodore

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    Watched it tonight. Saw the first Matrix shortly after it came out on VHS as part of my HS computer science class. Prior to that it just looked like a weird movie about leather trench coats and guns. Blew me away. My friend and I wrote a (terrible) parody and filmed parts of it.

    Found the sequels a step back. Was expecting to see Neo just ripping apart and recreating code with his mind. With no limits he shouldn't have needed to fight. Reality should have been whatever he wanted. Instead we got repetitive CGI fights with rubbery CGI models with (mostly) no stakes. Thought Revolutions was better than Reloaded but still lots of issues. Still bought The Ultimate Matrix collection upon its release.

    Was not expecting much from this and got a boring, mediocre movie. The second terribly ham fisted satire I sat through in a week (Don't Look Up and this).

    I give a lot more credit to WB for letting Lana talk so much shit about them in a $200 mil tentpole production than I give to Lana for making a movie complaining about making the movie she's making

    The story was pretty negligible. Motivations were all over the place. I still don't know why most of what happened happened. The fight scenes and effects weren't anything special. And it was boring.

    I'm a big fan of Jessica Henwick and feel like she was poorly used.

    I will give credit for them letting Keanu actually age for once. He still looks younger than his year thanks to money, trainers, nutritionists, chiefs, dye, and, I'm sure, cosmetic surgery. But he is visibly older in this film than in any other movie I've seen him in.

    I also liked the casting of the skins for Neo & Trinity's husband. It was clever using Keanus Neo stun trouble (and JW director) as Trinity's husband, and Carrie Ann Mosses actual husband as Neos skin. I didn't read anywhere anytime about Trinity's skin though. I'm sure there must be a similar connection.

    I got a big laugh from my friends for calling the magic explosions whenever Neo and Trinity held hands "The Power of Doing Hand Stuff".

    The Pitch Meeting for this was spot on. A movie about the machine civil war with humans caught in the middle that was glazed over in a couple lines of dialogue would have been a lot more interesting, and justified the resurrections better as needing Neo as a weapon instead as of a super battery.

    Was anyone else waiting for a reveal regarding the cat? I figured it would be the Oracle. Since thd Analyst is all about the Human mind & emotional drives, and her purpose was the human psyche, it would make sense if he was behind her disappearance and was using her for his own purposes.

    I gave it a 6.

    Edit: read through this thread now, saw a couple things I wanted to reply to but didn't hit quote for.

    Neo & Trinity's age:. The resurrection pods kept bringing them back at the age they died. The Analyst said it took years to bring them back, and it sure looked like they had to keep killing them and then resurrecting them over and over again. Plus, undoubtedly they were getting the absolute best in medical care and see aging technology. Can't let your power plants fail due to age if you can help it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2022
  20. wayoung

    wayoung Commodore Commodore

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    I believe this was the machines method of fulfilling their end of the treaty between the architect & the Oracle. With the events of The Matrix movies presented to people living in the The Matrix they are being given the choice to stay or leave, even if they are not aware of it. As the Analyst says, they just don't want to go. And as Bugs says, the humans just aren't trying to free people much anymore.

    It also allows them to keep Neo in a loop of knowing about The Matrix but also tricking him into thinking it's false.
     
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