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Spoilers Supernatural Season 15--the final season

That was certainly an episode of Supernatural. I appreciate that after 15 years they managed to deliver something that was very different from anything that came before, but it was so different I'm not sure if I liked it or disliked it. I think I need to sleep on it.
 
Okay, I did not expect the season 15 storyline to be finished with this episode. So the finale must be some kind of coda for the boys.

I did not foresee Lucifer returning, nor Chuck bringing him back to get the book. Nice twist. And he is now dead. Again. I think permanently, this time.

And with Chuck killing Michael, all archangels are now dead. In a sense, this had to happen, simply because they were probably the biggest threat in the series next to Chuck.

So Jack was a power vacuum, which explains why those plants were dying around him. He was draining its essence, much the same way Kes drained the flowers in the Airponics Bay on VOYAGER's "COLD FIRE". In essence, the original plan actually worked... just had some unexpected secondary results. Another way to look at it is Jack became a white hole first, and here he was a black hole, sucking in all the power.

Jack's goodbye scene... I really liked it. I think it made sense. It freed the boys, and it didn't feel heavy handed. I like how he said to Dean that he's everywhere. And Dean said so much with just his looking at Jack... you can feel his pride at what he did and his sorrow that he is moving on. Sam, too.

I do wonder if Jack brought back everyone from the alternate world, like Bobby and Charlie. What I am surprised at was him not bringing back Castiel.

Another note... that was heartbreaking what Chuck did to the dog. Dean was so happy to see that dog... so much so, he let him sit in Baby. IN BABY!!! That moment right there shows just how desperately happy he was to see something else around, only to have it snatched away like that. Chuck had done some horrible things before, but that moment was a truly dick move. I don't think I hated him more than in that moment.

And Chuck's ending... fitting. Very fitting. Powerless, alone, and forgotten. Serves him right. And Dean's speech to him... spot on.

The episode did feel odd for some reason, but I think it worked in its favor. The fact that this one and the finale were the only ones that didn't get filmed before the Covid shutdown might have had something to do with the odd vibe.

I find myself looking forward to AND dreading the final episode at the same time. Watching it will truly mean the show is over.

And Dean's toast... amen, brother. And speaking of that... great montage at the end.
 
I thought I’d transcribe the radio promo for the series finale for you all.

Dean: At the end of the day it’s always been you and me...we’ve had one hell of a ride

Sam: what are you talking about?

THIS THURSDAY, BUCKLE UP

Dean: you knew it was going to end like this

Sam: I will find another way

FOR ONE LAST RIDE

Dean: I did not think this would be the day

ITS THE UNBELIEVABLE FINAL EPISODE OF SUPERNATURAL.
 
Well, okay. That was imperfect, but mostly satisfying. The directing was awkward and distracting in the first part of the episode, and I wonder if that was an artifact of putting the thing together in the midst of the pandemic. It was certainly ironic that the storyline involved emptying the world of people-- I'm sure it was unintentional, but it definitely made things convenient for social distancing.

Needless to say, none of my theories, either old or new, even vaguely came to pass; and a lot of what did doesn't really stand up to scrutiny. And it definitely left us with a lot of questions, some of which may or may not be answered with next week's final finale. However, this semi finale was very much a solid conclusion to the fifteen-year journey of the Winchester boys-- what I still think of as the Third Testament.

Chuck has always been an accurate avatar of the Christian god-- benign and benificent one moment, raging and wrathful the next. Saving the people of a town from the depredations of Amara was the epitome of his first aspect, and the true face of the second came here with his obliteration of Michael to the bone-chilling orchestral tune of "Save it!" That's pretty much when I knew that any hopes of Chuck being rehabilitated or just kidding around were not coming to pass.

It was a big surprise to see Michael turn up, and nice that brother Adam's long-ignored face got to show up for the Grand Finale, and an even bigger surprise to see Lucifer briefly appear. There were lots of twists and turns thrown in, including a new Death-- who was nowhere near as cool as the last two, and thankfully didn't last long. Jack becoming a power vacuum came somewhat out of left field, but was fairly foreshadowed and justified Chuck's fear of him.

The entire final confrontation and aftermath, from the arrival at the picturesque remote lake to Sam and Dean's toast back at the bunker, was wonderfully choreographed (in contrast to the first couple of acts). Chuck is defeated and free will prevails in the personification of the Winchesters, and replaced with a truly benevolent and trusting god in the form of Jack-- quite a promotion for a relatively recent addition to the story. But instead of a creation myth where a flawed species is spawned by a cabalistic deity, we have a empathic god created by the kindness of two flawed men. A cosmic metamorphosis worthy of Englehart or Gerber, and a good ending to the road so far.

It doesn't totally stand up to scrutiny-- we've been told repeatedly that Chuck and Amara are infinite beings whose true nature is incomprehensible to mortals, yet they are always played as merely super-powerful human beings. After all, how could god not know that his power was being drained and that his finger snap would be impotent? That's okay, because it's all intended as metaphor. I mean, I wouldn't really have left Chuck unattended like that, especially with the God book on the ground next to him, but there was poetic justice all over the place.

And there were certainly questions left unanswered. What about Heaven and Hell, and the Multiverse, and Cass and Mama Winchester and Eileen? That's okay, too. Maybe we'll find out in the coda or maybe the answers will be saved for the reunion tales when they come. For now, we can be comfortable with the certainty that Jack would commit no unkindness nor allow any wrongs of the Apocalypse to stand.

Oh, and that was a great closing montage, set to the tune of "Running on Empty," one of my favorite songs. I wonder what they're saving for next week....

What I am surprised at was him not bringing back Castiel.
I have a feeling that Cass is with Jack now, on whatever journey he's begun.

Another note... that was heartbreaking what Chuck did to the dog. Dean was so happy to see that dog... so much so, he let him sit in Baby. IN BABY!!! That moment right there shows just how desperately happy he was to see something else around, only to have it snatched away like that. Chuck had done some horrible things before, but that moment was a truly dick move. I don't think I hated him more than in that moment.
It was a nice touch that they included a scene of the dog alive again when all the people returned.
 
I have a theory regarding Castiel.

With all the archangels dead, I think Jack will bring Castiel back and make him his new head archangel... with some powerupping, of course.


And while putting this down, I thought of something else. Maybe the reason Jack did not bring Castiel back was because his resurrection there was what awakened the Cosmic Entity to begin with. To keep that being quiet and happy, he is simply letting Castiel keep his end of the deal and be consigned to oblivion there. It's very sad when I think about it, but it also is very uplifting and appropriate in that in a sense, he will remain truly happy forever because that was how the Empty got called to get Cass.
 
With all the archangels dead, I think Jack will bring Castiel back and make him his new head archangel... with some powerupping, of course.
That's pretty much what I envision.

And while putting this down, I thought of something else. Maybe the reason Jack did not bring Castiel back was because his resurrection there was what awakened the Cosmic Entity to begin with. To keep that being quiet and happy, he is simply letting Castiel keep his end of the deal and be consigned to oblivion there. It's very sad when I think about it, but it also is very uplifting and appropriate in that in a sense, he will remain truly happy forever because that was how the Empty got called to get Cass.
That could be, too. Maybe he'll let Cass sleep until it's time for the reunion movies. :D
 
Alright, I’ve been thinking about this last episode for a little while now and I want to give my thoughts before the series finale.

First, this season arc with God has been a bit of a mess. Not terrible, but messy. I think we can all agree on that. Given that, there was no way that this was going to have an ending on the level of Swan Song. It just wasn’t going to happen. So yeah, I guess this ending was fine. They dealt with God decently and Jack becoming the new god does fit. It is satisfactory.

This episode started off brilliantly with a bleak, empty world. God’s trick with the dog made the despair of our main characters truly sink in. Sam and Dean surrendering to God and offering to kill themselves to restore the world was heartbreaking to watch after everything they’ve been through. Unfortunately, things fell apart once Michael showed up. At this point the plot went into hyper gear with a cameo by Lucifer – blink and you’ll miss him – the rise and fall of a new Death, the death of Lucifer, the death of Michael, the defeat of God, and the rise of Jack. It all happened so fast. We needed time to breath. They needed to cut out a few MOTW episodes and give us another episode or two in this new, lifeless world. I also didn’t like them leaving Chuck alone as a human. Sure, he’s powerless now, but with his knowledge he could definitely become a dangerous threat and world-class wizard. If there were a season 16 you just know that Chuck would be back to haunt them.

Another issue I had with this season is that the plot with God has been a rehash of the Metatron arc back in Season 9. Sure, God is orders of magnitude more powerful, but having a “writer” as a villain and defeating him by reverting him to human has been done before. A bit disappointing.

Other than that, I can’t say much more until we see the real series finale. The ending was bleak with Sam and Dean alone, but for all we know Jack left the monsters dead and revived Castiel, Mary, John, Adam, Real Bobby, Kevin, Real Charlie, and Benny. Jack was being a dick for abandoning Sam and Dean, but maybe he does show up next episode for a beer in the bunker. We just don’t know yet.

So yeah, my final thoughts are that the messy God arc is over and I could write an essay nitpicking it, but I’m just glad it’s over and they didn’t fuck up too much in the process. They also completely wasted The Empty character. Now let’s wait to see what happens next episode.
 
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Okay I've been using lockdown to finally catch up on this series, I watched all of s14 and s15 in the last few weeks and am now here right in time for the finale.

I enjoyed the last season a lot, all the callbacks and references really made it feel like they were honouring their past and trying to tie it together into a coherent whole, after getting increasingly aimless and formulaic the last few years. Yes it was a bit silly to bring back these villains that had been such major antagonists before and then kill them off again after ten minutes, but seeing Lilith and Ruby and Lucifer and Michael and Amara etc again was fun.

I definitely got a sense of "this is our last chance, let's just do everything while we can" about it. LOL at the blatant excuse to get Jensen and Jared's wives on screen together. Dean gets a dance solo and gets to sing on screen with his band, etc.

I did wonder if, given that part of the premise was "bring back all the bad guys", the way to beat them would be to bring back all of the good guys as well, all the allies they had had and lost along the way. That way there would be an army of good versus an army of evil.

But the actual real solution, I found to be... nice. Appropriate thematically, in the same way the endings of Buffy (you win by sharing your power, not hoarding it) and Angel (it doesn't matter if you get a reward, the point is to keep fighting) were thematically appropriate.

By definition, you are never going to be able to beat God power-for-power. You defeat him by taking his power away from him. You stand up to him, making him understand you will never surrender no matter how much power he has. When you refuse to let God have control over your life, when you don't live by his rules anymore, that's how you save the human race.

Slightly disappointing that, after making such a big deal of our remaining allies – Bobby, Charlie, Donna, Eileen – dying in the previous ep, we didn't see them brought back to life with everyone else in this ep, or even see Dean or Sam just calling to check up on them. Maybe that was a casualty of the break in filming caused by lockdown?

I am definitely curious as to what the last episode is going to be, given that this was so obviously the end of this season's plot. The bad guy is defeated, the world is saved, we get a massive montage all the way back to the pilot episode, and there is no hook to say "you thought that was the end, haha no just you wait and see" – it was just the end.

So I wonder if the actual finale will be a Babylon 5 or Warehouse 13 style finale – the crisis is over and now we just all get together and talk about old times 20 years down the road. We'll see what life was like with no God controlling their path. Like Babylon 5, the final solution to Supernatural was not to find a bigger gun but to refuse to play the game. And a world where God has no power over you could very much qualify as a Third Age of Mankind as well. So for the finale to be the same kind of thing would seem suitable. I guess we'll see soon.

.
 
You spent a lot of time talking about the themes of the episode, but you didn't touch on the execution of those themes. That's probably why our opinions are so different. Themes are meaningless to me; all I care about is how well the episode is put together. And this episode was certainly not put together well. Oh, I said I wasn't going to nitpick, but nitpcking is fun and this is my last chance to nitpick this show. Let's go for it.

Sam and Dean didn't beat God because they stood up to him and refused to surrender. That's not how you win. That's how you lose badly and immediately. They won because they had a deus ex machina in Jack. His power absorbion abilities were poorly explained and worked based on the demands of the plot. He managed to drain Chuck's powers instantly (and silently) despite Chuck not even using his powers to beat down Sam and Dean, but he lived in the bunker for days (weeks?) with Michael and had no effect on him. We also saw with the plants that Jack has no control over those powers. That's a very convenient and specific power set that Jack developed exactly when the characters needed it.

This episode also completely wasted Amara and the Empty's characters. Just two episodes ago, when Sam spoke with The Empty in Death's Library, it was mentioned that it couldn't enter the world to help fight Chuck. Then last episode Castiel summoned it to save Dean. Now you'd expect The Empty to stick around and help kill Chuck which has been its goal for the entire season, but nope. It just instantly went home, gave up on ever going back to sleep, and got some jigsaw puzzles I suppose. They're been building this character up for years and they didn't do a damn thing with it. What a waste.

Amara was simply tossed aside. I expected her to assert some control over Chuck when he was beating Sam and -- especially -- Dean bloody, but nope. I guess Amara didn't merge with Chuck after all. She gave up on life and allowed Chuck to take her powers because Dean didn't love her. Great character arc there writers. You're really getting better at writing them women.

Jack has become the new god, but decides to keep a hands-off approach. Dean was furious with Chuck back in season 11 -- before it was revealed that Chuck was evil -- for not helping out on Earth. And yet Jack deciding to take a hands-off approach, abandon Sam and Dean, leave Cas dead, and let monsters roam the world is supposed to be a happy ending? Jack is also an extremely young, naive, and inexperienced kid with no one to advise him. And now he has super, nigh-omnipotent powers. He's going to be a terrible god. I do not have confidence in him fixing the messes that are Heaven and Hell.
 
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This is the last time I'll be able to post any of these so I thought I'd give them all one last appearance.

I'm actually rather sad that tonight is the last night of Supernatural. I know TNT will still have the morning reruns for awhile but knowing there's no more new episodes is a bit sad. Still...all good things must come to an end, eventually.

When I started watching Supernatural, I had NO idea I would ever love this oddball show so very much and get sucked into the SPN family the way that I have.

Just a few more hours to go....
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I've been waiting for those gifs. I would have been disappointed if you hadn't gone all out.

I have high expectations for tonight. Supernatural is poor these days with the big complex arcs, but they've still got it when it comes to simple character stories. Lebanon last season was an absolute masterpiece and it left me an emotional wreck. Ending this show with a simple MOTW episode focused on Sam and Dean is the best thing they could have done and it plays to the strengths of the show while avoiding the weaknesses. Bring it on.
 
Watching now..... :weep:

Edit: What’s this? My eyes seem to be malfunctioning... Where’s this damn water coming from? Damn it, I’m leaking...
 
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About 30 minutes in and I have to say...AGAIN?! Last week, we had developments that just seemed to spring out of nowhere. Tonight, it's happening again, and...I know we couldn't do business like usual because of COVID, but still...
character deaths shouldn't just spring out of nowhere because of a random nail in the back. The right thing to do would've been to have him wounded in the fight and have it be a killing blow.
 
Gotta give them props for Dire Straits. You can never go wrong with them. While I like the concept of the death it just didn’t work for me. Reminded me of Deadpool’s. To be honest I felt sadder for those poor kids who had their parents butchered.

Just finished it and it was okay. I don’t know if I would have ended it like that. I would have kept it open so they could make movies for the cinema or HBO Max. I think this show deserves a high budget adventure outside America/Canada.
 
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In one sense, I like the ending, seeing that Dean and Sam are reunited with various people, from over the years, that they lost.

However, I would have preferred for them to have some sense of normalcy, for a respectable length of time, after literally defeating God.
 
The first half had me weeping buckets. :wah::wah::wah::wah::wah::wah::wah::wah::wah::wah:

The second half was just waiting for them to meet up. It was lovely but oddly low key. I would've liked to see a little more. But it was nice that they got the peaceful heaven they wanted and deserved .
 
Hard to believe this will be the last remnant of the WB era to go
Supernatural, as a television series, lasted for 15 years (2005 to 2020). It originally premiered on The WB, which lasted as a television network for 11 years (1995 to 2006).

This means the show had a longer run than the network it premiered on.
 
I can't say it was a bad ending, but it didn't work for me. I don't find the idea of them dying and going to heaven as a happily ever after ending. As The Good Place or even Star Trek: Generations showed, Heaven isn't paradise. It's fake. It's like living in a holodeck. It's a fantastic vacation and a great reward for a hard life on Earth, but it's a pale shadow of the beauty that is real life. Sam and Dean losing out on a real life together without God messing with them is needlessly depressing, bleak, and cruel. An open-ending with Sam and Dean continuing the family business would have been a much better and happier ending.

Oh, I cried buckets tonight, don't get me wrong, but they depressed and angry tears. Not the depressed and satisfied tears of Lebanon or Swan Song.
 
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