Spoilers Supergirl - Season 5

[Christopher]

And like any good addiction metaphor, the character must hit rock bottom before becoming sober - or fully embracing the dark side before vindicating herself in a triumphant redemption arc.

Okay, I can buy that. It's the assumption that she's just meant to be a female Lex, or is "cursed" to be evil by her genetics, that I find simplistic and obviously wrong. But a morally ambivalent character who's losing her way and needs to be brought back to the side of the angels? Yeah, that's basically what I see here. I don't believe she'll cross fully to Lex-style villainy, cackling maniacally as she guns people down with abandon or launches a device to blow up the city. But she might become the well-intentioned extremist type of antagonist, slipping a bit too far into a moral gray area and doing worse harm than she intended. It seems we agree that the endgame is her redemption and return to the side of the angels, but I think she can't descend too far into villainy if that's to remain feasible.

I'm just sick an tired of them wasting McGrath as they do.

I just don't buy that an actor is "wasted" by playing a complex and flawed figure rather than a straight-up villain. Villains are boring, just giving into their worst impulses. People who resist those impulses and strive to be better are more complex and thus more interesting.

 

[CorporalClegg]

I just don't buy that an actor is "wasted" by playing a complex and flawed figure rather than a straight-up villain. Villains are boring,

And see, I agree with you 100%. You seem to be inferring things I never said or intended to imply. In my initial post, I simply said that they need to give McGrath some edge. She's such a great emoter. While Sunday's episode was overall pretty average, that scene with Kara was one of the best - albeit subtly - acted scenes of the series so far. I want to see more of that.

But I never said I wanted her to go "Straight up, black hat, tied to the train tracks, soon my electro-ray will destroy Metropolis bad." Like you, I find that really boring. (And think it's the biggest failing of the franchise as a whole, but that's for a different discussion.)

I did say I would have preferred her to Lex as the antagonist last season, but that was with the caveat of making the clone the "final boss" instead.

 

[Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME]

I hadn't thought much about this, but you're absolutely right. Bottom line--subscriptions are down.

It's not making money. A new owner has a right to do whatever he or she wants, and Rojas is well within her rights to make changes to a failing business model. That absolutely includes a change in personnel, and that should actually START with Jimmy. He doesn't have to quit in a huff because he doesn't like a new direction. He should be fired because he failed at his job.

As for the other employees, same thing. They don't own the paper. They work for it. They should do what their boss asks. She's not unreasonable. Jimmy's business model doesn't work in 2019.

Now I do agree that a news source should actually report the news, and not ignore facts or skew things toward whatever direction they want, because if they do that, it ceases to be media, but modernizing is a good thing.

The only issue I have is the ridiculous non-compete clause, which would not work on our Earth.

For my part, right the moment the DA Office decided to pursue James Olsen for his activities as the Guardian, in particular about his eventual complicity in the operations carried out by a terrorist group, I wondered how he could have been left at the head of Catco (I remind you the charges against Olsen were serious enough for the DA to get his arrest and a prison sentence, btw => only Lena's intervention on the DA saved him). I mean, the Board could have ask him to stand on the margins the time that things settle down. At least, for the company image.
Moreover, I recall that the magazine's sales had already begun to decline under James leadership to the point that even Lena Luthor, before she starts her relationship with him, noted the situation and adviced him to lower the price of the magazine... what James had refused under the pretext that he didn't want to sell off the price of the work of his employees...
-> In fact, upon her arrival at the head of Catco, Rojas had 2 legitimate reasons to fire James Olsen. His result as CEO and his questionable reputation. By resigning, he has just proved once again that he was unable to assume his responsibilities.

About the news on a clic, this is already done since the 90s and almost all big press titles through the world, developped the e-media but that does not prevent the good reporters from doing their jobs seriously. It's a question of journalistic ethics, so a
a question of person and not of means used as such.

About the non-compte clause, this already exists in some areas and that for awhile. It's a way for companies applying this policy to ensure a form of protection against data leakage and people. For ex, a company which would work with the Army,
must sign an exclusive contract. When the contract will end of right, it couldn't
prospect with an another Army and/or companies working in this domain for a certain time.

 

[Noname Given]

Also, how can Jimmy be banned from journalism for life? No compete clauses can't be infinite, there is no way that is legal. I can see him having to wait out his current contract, but there is no way he can legally be banned from an entire industry permanently. From wikipedia:



Even if the evil woman tried to stop him from getting hired after the no-compete clause was over, at the bare minimum the Daily Planet would almost certainly take him back. It just feels like the writers trying to make him quitting seem more important then it was.

Still, it was overall an ok episode. Not amazing, but good enough to keep watching, even if I'm probably going to be paying less then perfect attention to the Catco stuff this season.

It's just the usual "she's a bad person - so she's going to throw every threat she can because she's rich..." trope.

 

[Kirk Prime]

About the non-compte clause, this already exists in some areas and that for awhile. It's a way for companies applying this policy to ensure a form of protection against data leakage and people. For ex, a company which would work with the Army,
must sign an exclusive contract. When the contract will end of right, it couldn't
prospect with an another Army and/or companies working in this domain for a certain time.

Yes, but non-compete clauses must be limited in scope and in geography. They cannot be eternal and certainly 3 years would be overturned. These are reporters. They can jump ship. They are not conscripted. The clause that Rojas described would NEVER hold up in any state--at least on this Earth.

 

[kirk55555]

Yes, but non-compete clauses must be limited in scope and in geography. They cannot be eternal and certainly 3 years would be overturned. These are reporters. They can jump ship. They are not conscripted. The clause that Rojas described would NEVER hold up in any state--at least on this Earth.

Yep, this is what I was getting at. Even in a world filled with people who can fly, an infinite no-compete clause just breaks belief, and even the fact that she'd be rich enough to try to blacklist him is laughable since he's an award winning journalist and, at bare minimum, she doesn't own the Daily Planet, and they'd almost certainly take Jimmy back.

I get what they were going for, but I don't think it really comes off as the big "threat/punishment" they think it is. Even Kara could probably get hired by the Daily Planet based off her award and her cousin and cousin's wife vouching for her. At most, the rich evil lady could stop them from getting a newspaper job in National City, and even then either one of them could probably do well with web journalism, and the evil lady doesn't control the internet or access to it.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Yeah. The subtext has been there since the first few episodes.

It's just now the subtext is quickly becoming ... text.

*It seems to me people are only seeing what they want to see because it aligned with their preconceptions of the character from the comics. I think there's a word for that...

Yes, and some fans of this show are Hell-bent on the "Lena-is-just-Kara's-bestest-friend-evar" idea that the series never sold or developed as believable. In fact, the ultimate goal of it all is a retread of Kara's relationship with Alex (which the series has mined in every conceivable manner). Lena's numerous unethical actions throughout this series does not make her the "anti-Luthor" at all, but a family prophecy fulfilled. Some seem to put on their "bestest frind evar" glasses then attempt to handwave all of the flat-out bad things she's done since her earliest episodes, all for a poorly developed friendship angle. Her character has no purpose or teeth as yet another buddy, and it wastes McGrath's talents, and loses what would have been a stronger plot for series.

 

[Kirk Prime]

Yep, this is what I was getting at. Even in a world filled with people who can fly, an infinite no-compete clause just breaks belief, and even the fact that she'd be rich enough to try to blacklist him is laughable since he's an award winning journalist and, at bare minimum, she doesn't own the Daily Planet, and they'd almost certainly take Jimmy back.

I get what they were going for, but I don't think it really comes off as the big "threat/punishment" they think it is. Even Kara could probably get hired by the Daily Planet based off her award and her cousin and cousin's wife vouching for her. At most, the rich evil lady could stop them from getting a newspaper job in National City, and even then either one of them could probably do well with web journalism, and the evil lady doesn't control the internet or access to it.

Plus, if you watch the scene, Rojas implied that these people didn't even know about the non-compete clause for 3 years. You would think that award winning journalists would research this kind of thing.

 

[USS Firefly]

Just saw the episode.
It was dissapointing, we loved Kara's revelations to Lena but for the rest?
Especially Lena's speech at the end we didn't like.
My wife don't want to watch it anymore, we have better shows to watch and not enough time, so we propably stop watching Supergirl

 

[theenglish]

It's amazing that I have an easier time accepting flying aliens than I do the idea of that non-compete clause actually being enforceable.

I laughed at this idea myself, but it is the classic fantasy fiction reaction. We buy into a world based on the "rules" given to us by the author/creator. Unless we are shown otherwise, we trust that "real world" understandings apply in all other cases. If at some point we are told more about the laws of Earth 38 being different than our own then we can chalk the contract issue up to that, but otherwise I am really shocked that such lazy writing was allowed to make it to screen.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Supergirl
Season 5 / Episode 2 - "Stranger Beside Me"

SG/Kara: SG - Kara's complaints about Day read as a possible interest in the married man somewhere down the road. ...and of course, showing his helping feed the homeless is supposed to paint him as the cad with the heart of gold. Yawn--unless that's just part of his cover.

Lena: Do No Harm programming--yes, that a heroine.... Her motives--"fixing" people from their natural inclination for deception an other negative traits is just another form of eugenics. That, and the way she spits at society is just another view of her long-established position as a true Luthor.

Taking a cue from the MCU's creation of the Vision, Lena has merged the Hope A.I. with Eve. That should go well.

Rojas / Day: Dr. Niles Jerod...Day asking for intel on Kara. I suspect he knows she's SG, but the question is whether or not Rojas knows, hence her more aggressive stand against Lena (meaning she believes she has all of the advantages on her side). ...and on that note, no matter what Rojas does, that's not enough to make Lena "see the light" when they have their inevitable conflict--no matter who Rojas is affiliated with.

James: Oh, please. An out of nowhere offer to run for senator, when he's never expressed that kind of interest before, but suddenly, its part of his "path." Ever the misused, under-developed character.

...and taking his sister--an untrained civilian--into the middle of a super-fight, all to get her back to Alex (in a relationship that was built...when?). Come on.

Brainy / Nia: Brainy knows the future, yet he continues to allows all of the mayhem and suffering his friends must endure week after week...

NOTES: The showrunners are trying to insert as many players as possible--from those who used Eve, the Monitor, Rojas / Day and their unseen allies...but it remains to be seen if it will lead to a coherent progression for the series as a whole.

GRADE: C.​

 

[Tuskin38]

Yeah Hope is def going to become a problem in the future

 

[The Realist]

The showrunners are trying to insert as many players as possible--from those who used Eve, the Monitor, Rojas / Day and their unseen allies...but it remains to be seen if it will lead to a coherent progression for the series as a whole.

I've frankly started to tune out most of your consistently and persistently negative Supergirl comments -- it's obvious the show can do no right in your eyes, just as Black Lightning can do no wrong -- but I can't disagree with this. The show feels unfocused so far this season, with too much going on, none of it particularly compelling (except perhaps developments with Lena). Last year got off to a much stronger start, with a clear and confident narrative purpose right out of the gate.

Still, I remember I thought Season Three had a weak beginning too, but then it found its stride and produced some of the series' finest entries (like "The Faithful" and "Midvale"). And it's very early days yet, so I'm going to remain hopeful things will improve in the coming weeks.

 

[Christopher]

I'm afraid I'm not really liking this season's storylines so far. I'm never fond of "modern technology is evil" stories. Kara's conflicts with her new boss and co-worker are a bit overdone. And I really don't like seeing Lena go so dark so fast.

I'm also not crazy about the new supersuit after seeing it in the daylight. It's too dark and solid-colored. I miss the red skirt.

Anyway, the idea of an "undiscovered" kind of radiation between x-rays and gamma rays is silly. They're adjacent ranges on the continuous EM spectrum, so it's kind of like saying there's an undiscovered state between Washington and Oregon. Also, "bio-Hertz?" A Hertz is a cycle per second. Putting "bio-" adjacent to that is random and meaningless. Plus 60-80 Hz is the super-low frequency radio range, at the opposite end of the EM spectrum from x- and gamma rays, whose frequencies are on the order of 10^18 Hz and higher.

 

[Dick Whitman]

That was a very disjointed exprerience watching Batwoman followed by Supergirl. Batwoman while brand new is very clear and focused in its storyline and characterizations. Supergirl was just all over the place. Too many characters and storylines. Not sure what is going on in any of them.

It’s a challenge with serialized television to keep momentum and interest in the ongoing mysteries. But to have more than I can count in a single episode? They are in danger of the audience forgetting the plots and losing interest. Which is disappointing after such a strong season last year. How much of this will be put on hold until after Crisis?

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

I've frankly started to tune out most of your consistently and persistently negative Supergirl comments -- it's obvious the show can do no right in your eyes

It has many problems, whether someone sees that or not. The only positive is Lena living up to her heritage (so McGrath can let loose as an actress), but I have no hope that this personality will last the entire season, or not after the crossover.

-- but I can't disagree with this. The show feels unfocused so far this season, with too much going on, none of it particularly compelling (except perhaps developments with Lena). Last year got off to a much stronger start, with a clear and confident narrative purpose right out of the gate.

...and we have to assume all players will have (or should have) some connection to COIE, but at present, they are just running around with agendas that are all over the place.

 

[CorporalClegg]

So Lena just stole another woman's agency over her own body. On a liberal-slanted show.

Yeah. She's not evil.

 

[Christopher]

Yeah. She's not evil.

Obviously they are pushing her toward "evil," and that disappoints me, because I don't think it's the right direction to take her character. I'm hoping that it will be what we both agreed we wanted to see, a storyline where she goes dark for a time and then redeems herself -- as you put it, where she hits rock bottom before recognizing her need to change. I thought we were already in agreement that she is not intrinsically "evil" by blood or something stupid like that, just that she's succumbing to a fatal character flaw that she needs to be rescued from.

I was just hoping she wouldn't go this dark this quickly. She's jumped so immediately to blatant supervillainy that I'm surprised she hasn't started cackling madly and petting an angora cat. It's too radical and abrupt a downfall, and it feels out of character. They should've started with some more subtle moral compromise, shown her plausible descent down a slippery slope, instead of jumping right to "I will save humanity by destroying free will!"

 

[JanewayRulz!]

So, is Hope a collection of those swarming nanobots that killed Lena's old boyfriend in season 2?

Lena is looking pretty bad here, and why doesn't the new guy ask Kara if she is Supergirl?

 

[Christopher]

and why doesn't the new guy ask Kara if she is Supergirl?

It seems they're going more for the usual clueless-supporting-character dynamic. "Gee, I followed Kara here but only found Supergirl -- I wonder where Kara went?" Although she practically gave herself away by showing shocked recognition of him while in Supergirl form. So maybe he's just playing it close to the vest for now.