And what a lucky bridge that was indeed!
JB
JB
Sulu -- the forgotten lover and racism of the times?
- Thread starter Gassy Man
- Start date
- Status
Not originally Japanese, no. In the Naked Time, Sulu was originally supposed to threaten the crew with a samurai sword, but it was changed to a rapier so that the weapon wouldn't be so stereotypical nor such a strong ethnic identifier.
Where did you get that information?
. . .
The next two points are subtler. Takei and Nichelle Nichols were the only two of the key seven in THE WRATH OF KHAN to lack significant scenes or moments. And, if were George Takei, I might even wonder why of all the six major male players, I/he alone was never temporarily killed in TOS.
I'd rather pilot and command a Starship than being temporarily killed any day.
But would you rather command a Starship or get it on with the ladies?
I think I remember Sulu temporarily dying in TAS.
Perhaps they were trying to make it up to him there.
And while he had a clear field for the ladies with Chekov out of the picture I can't recall if he got any 'romance' in TAS.
From the man himself: (Sorry if you wanted to answer yourself Cyke101)
http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/mixmaster/2014/01/oh_myyy_we_talked_with_george.php
Last edited:
Didn't STAR TREK get a lot of fan mail from kids? Maybe they didn't want to see a lot of boys and girls kissing, anyway? In effect, not having a Love Interest may have actually increased George Takei's Fan Mail ... in theory.
But would you rather command a Starship or get it on with the ladies?
starship
That's non-sense.
But would you rather command a Starship or get it on with the ladies?
starship
It's true. A lot of men who score with women all the time are miserable. But if you're going to be unhappy, that's the way to go.
The issue of rascism aside for a moment: The mindset expressed in these posts – which is one oftentimes expressed by men, it seems to me – really grates on me. Just because TV fiction involves relationships doesn't make it a soap opera. "Science-Fiction adventure stories" and "stories about relationships" are not mutually exclusive!
What is it that bothers guys when it comes to plots about relationship stuff? Is it not manly enough? Sex and partnerships are part of being human. The why the hell shouldn't they be part of science-fiction, regardless of its form?
I can't speak for anyone else, but when I read/watch sci-fi, I'm looking for stories that can't be told anywhere else and relationship stuff is something that can and is done in pretty much every other genre. Plus, being married for twenty-plus years, I have enough relationship stuff in the real world.
You forgot to mention how all whites are automatically evil wiether they were involved or not.
So, in 100% absence of evidence, we should believe wild charges not grounded in TOS's historical fact?
Steering away from evidence-based history is the very reason people who believe in your Bigfoot reference are justifiably dismissed. After centuries of whispers, campfire tales, men in gorilla (later faux Chewbacca / Grodd) suits, and the expected foot imprints (of limited artistic skill), no reputable body has reached a firm conclusion that Bigfoot existed in the past, or present.
For strong reasons.
Similarly, a charge of racism regarding Sulu on a series that was one of the landmark productions to break ground with its casting of non-white actors in prominent, regular or semi-regular roles, and featured a scene of an asian male flirting with a white woman on (important) race-minded, region-sensitive 1960s TV holds as much water as men stomping around in ape suits. In other words, one can pretend as much as they desire, but that does not push make-believe even an inch closer to fact.
Again, the glaring part of all of this pointless exercise is that at no point do we see anything at all suggesting NBC, Roddenberry and Desilu committed any subtle or overt racism in the handling of Sulu in relation to women.
Since Sulu (and 1960s TV) is the subject, you are saying 1960s TV featured no Asian men in any sort of romantic role? Were they all--as you say--neutered, clowns, or asexual wise men or exotics?
But would you rather command a Starship or get it on with the ladies?
[kirk]Why not both?[/kirk]
I don't mind it as long as it's done believably and doesn't detract from the plot. I mean let's face it, Kirk losing control in "Requiem", falling for Rayna beyond all hope in a matter of hours was ridiculous. Scotty in "Lights of Zetar" was downright embarrassing and a relationship should have been avoided at all costs.
Besides the big ones, "City .. " and "Paradise Syndrome", I thought the best relationships are Mr. Spock's, that thing he does with his fingers, his "flirting" with Droxine.
I see, but if your first post was worded that way, I wouldn't have been so flip with a response. I've seen so many accusations that even potentially true one are buried in an avalanche of false ones.
Predjudice against Asian people is a fact and, for whatever reason, seems not to bother "the public" as a whole as predjudice against other groups, like Blacks. So it could be true. Just because it could be true doesn't mean it is, but doesn't mean it isn't because of lack of evidence.
My best answer is I don't know.
I saw George Takei himself say that he suggested not using the Samurai sword because he was from California and he played Robin Hood when he was young not Samurai. Although in the episode he was playing Musketeer. It was on a special feature of my Star Trek dvd set season 1.
And Plynch, please don't go!
It's a combination of seeing Takei speak at a lecture (he came to campus a few years ago for Asian Pacific American Heritage Month, and so his talk had that particular focus), his documentary, and Takei here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpQidddBIa4 (around the :45 mark).
Last edited:
I hate Droxine with Spock.
OK lets ban them all.
Lol, a couple of mind melds and she would be coming around to his way of thinking.
If you never ask questions, no matter how likely/unlikely a situation is, how can you come away with a complete historical fact for TOS?
We should never be opposed to people asking questions? The only reason to be opposed to it would be that we are afraid of the answer.
I simply still don't know. Perhaps Harvey could chime in if he's ran into anything from the Rodenberry Archive that could shed light on the subject one way or the other?
- Status
