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Spoilers Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker - Grading & Discussion

Grade the movie...


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Finn's story was one of the most enjoyable for me in the ST. I don't see all the bad stuff people keep insisting is there.
The thing with Finn is that he had an interesting introduction, a half-baked and yet heavy handed arc about...you know iI still don't quite get what his arc in TLJ was actually driving at...and in TRoS he was just kinda *there*. The latter part wouldn't be so bad since that's pretty much what happened to literally everyone other than Luke in RotJ, but it's kinda made worse by seemingly attempting to set up some kind of arc but then not actually bothering to follow through on it.
It's fairly typical of JJ; he's the master of the half baked and unresolved plot thread...sorry, I mean "mystery box".
 
The thing with Finn is that he had an interesting introduction, a half-baked and yet heavy handed arc about...you know iI still don't quite get what his arc in TLJ was actually driving at...and in TRoS he was just kinda *there*. The latter part wouldn't be so bad since that's pretty much what happened to literally everyone other than Luke in RotJ, but it's kinda made worse by seemingly attempting to set up some kind of arc but then not actually bothering to follow through on it.
It's fairly typical of JJ; he's the master of the half baked and unresolved plot thread...sorry, I mean "mystery box".
Completely disagree, by mileage will vary.
 
I was not really stating an opinion, those were all essentially facts. Whether or not you let that bother you; that's the subjective part.
Stating you don't know what his arc was in TLJ is subjective. I think he had a decent arc. More could have been done, of course. I could make my suggestions to. But, overall, I'm satisfied.
 
Stating you don't know what his arc was in TLJ is subjective. I think he had a decent arc. More could have been done, of course. I could make my suggestions to. But, overall, I'm satisfied.
OK, so let's break it down: -
Act 1: Finn only cares about Rey, doesn't buy into the cause and wants to run away (again!.)
Act 2: Finn sees some slaves and animals mistreated and gets a 2 min lecture on socioeconomics from Rose.
Act 3: Finn takes that on board and decides to kamikaze a deathray...but is stopped because hate is bad and a weirdly timed kiss before she croaks...but she's not actually dead and they all run away THE END!

It started out like it was expanding upon his arc from TFA (what was at least coherent) but then it all goes wibbly and starts chasing it's own tail. And after all of that, what did he learn? How did he grow? Is it that war profiteering & slavery = "bad"? Or "don't trust thieves you meet in prison"? Or how about "Finn just do as Rose says because he clearly has no clue what he's doing"?

Just to be clear: TLJ is my favourite of the three ST movies by a fairly wide margin. But I'm not about to pretend that everything that isn't Rey/Luke/Kylo centric is a hot mess. Just like despite liking AotC, I'm not going to try and defend how poorly executed the Anakin/Padme thread was.
 
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OK, so let's break it down: -
Act 1: Finn only cares about Rey, doesn't buy into the cause and wants to run away (again!.)
Act 2: Finn sees some slaves and animals mistreated and gets a 2 min lecture on socioeconomics from Rose.
Act 3: Finn takes that on board and decides to kamikaze a deathray...but is stopped because hate is bad and a weirdly timed kiss before she croaks...but she's not actually dead and they all run away THE END!

It started out like it was expanding upon his arc from TFA (what was at least coherent) but then it all goes wibbly and starts chasing it's own tail. And after all of that, what did he learn? How did he grow? Is it that war profiteering & slavery = "bad"? Or "don't trust thieves you meet in prison"? Or how about "Finn just do as Rose says because he clearly has no clue what he's doing"?

Just to be clear: TLJ is my favourite of the three ST movies by a fairly wide margin. But I'm not about to pretend that everything that isn't Rey/Luke/Kylo centric is a hot mess. Just like despite liking AotC, I'm not going to try and defend how poorly executed the Anakin/Padme thread was.
Again, I disagree. Mileage will vary.
 
Genuinely surprised that a trilogy with a boring and flawless protagonist flopped.

Who cares about overcoming the odds...
 
Well, I have an answer. Earlier in this thread, I expressed my thought that Nien Nunb was killed during the battle. It has been confirmed that he was killed. Poor Nien Nunb and goodbye Tantive IV.
 
Well, I have an answer. Earlier in this thread, I expressed my thought that Nien Nunb was killed during the battle. It has been confirmed that he was killed. Poor Nien Nunb and goodbye Tantive IV.
The actor who plays him disagrees. We didn't see his ship explode. They filmed a scene early on in the shoot with him returning to base to celebrate.
 
Until Mike Quinn confirms that Nien Nunb was killed I'll go with his belief that Nien survived and returned to base.
 
Didn’t see the ship crash onscreen nor a body. Nien’s not dead for me until there’s real evidence.
 
The thing with Finn is that he had an interesting introduction, a half-baked and yet heavy handed arc about...you know iI still don't quite get what his arc in TLJ was actually driving at...and in TRoS he was just kinda *there*. The latter part wouldn't be so bad since that's pretty much what happened to literally everyone other than Luke in RotJ, but it's kinda made worse by seemingly attempting to set up some kind of arc but then not actually bothering to follow through on it.
It's fairly typical of JJ; he's the master of the half baked and unresolved plot thread...sorry, I mean "mystery box".
At least when it comes to Star Wars, JJ Abrams really does seem to hate explaining things. I enjoyed both of his Star Wars movies, but they both could have really had a bit more time taken out to explain the things they introduce.
 
It started out like it was expanding upon his arc from TFA (what was at least coherent) but then it all goes wibbly and starts chasing it's own tail. And after all of that, what did he learn?

First he learned there were things worth fighting against, which is what he saw on Canto Bight, and then Rose interrupting his suicide run taught him that that's different from having something to fight for (which she literally says in so many words). He doesn't fully assimilate that last bit by the end of the movie, but that's fine, because that heavily overlaps with Poe's arc, and we need to see that he's gotten the message more than we need it for Finn. Ideally, Finn would either develop or exhibit an appreciation for building the future rather than merely tearing down injustice in the next movie, but TLJ left them nowhere to go. :rolleyes:

How did he grow?

He went from being, let's be nice, a conscientious objector who liked exactly one person in all of creation, to someone that recognized that whether or not he could take down the First Order (or the snobs on Canto Bight), it was still morally worthwhile to stand up to them and declare himself in opposition to them.

Is it that war profiteering & slavery = "bad"? Or "don't trust thieves you meet in prison"?

That's a very superficial understanding of DJ's character as just a subversion of the "rogue with a heart of gold" archetype of Han and Lando. His dramatic purpose is far more straightforward. DJ tells Finn that there are no good guys or bad guys, it's just idiots fighting over nonsense while other idiots make money off of them. "They kill you today, you kill them tomorrow. Don't join." In the parlance of the time, it's written on his hat. Finn, about to be die for convictions he's only just found out exist at all, tells DJ he's wrong, ideas and people are worth fighting for, there's a difference between the Resistance and First Order beyond the color of their clothes and whether their ships are shaped like an "H" or an "X." And DJ, not giving a shit, just says, "Maybe" and walks off with a shrug. DJ uses cynicism as a substitute for wisdom, like so many people in the world.

Then Finn faces off against Phasma, the symbol of his oppression, declares himself to have joined in defiance of DJ's advice ("You were always scum." "Rebel scum"), but he's still not self-actualized. He has meaning, but it comes from rebellion, opposition to the bad rather than devotion to the good, which is a common Star Wars problem. In "The Mandalorian," we've got another character who hates the Empire, but when they're gone, she's got nothing left for the world without them. Rose is trying to protect Finn from that.
 
Here is an article about the confusion over whether Nien Nunb died:
https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2020/01/no-one-is-sure-if-nien-nunb-is-alive-or-dead/

They say in the article that the Tantive IV was seen arriving back at the Resistance base. I have seen the film five times, and four of those times I was looking for Nien Nunb or his ship after the battle. I have not seen the ship landing. And, it would not be hard to miss seeing the character in the crowd, as he was the only one of his species seen at the base. He stands out in a crowd like a Wookie does.
 
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