Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 1x05 - "Spock Amok"

[Voodoowoman2]

I'm looking forward to Chapel/Spock flirtation and intrigue. He is out of his depth with her.

At first, I wanted them to ignore "Chapel's undying love for Spock." Now, I'm not so sure. It's not that I want them to end up together because frankly Spock is an "A@##" He becomes more rigidly Vulcan as he ages and IMHO Vulcan is always being filmed at sunset because it's culture is dying. Spock is right when he tells Christine that he can't give her what she wants. He can't. He would make her unhappy. Yet, with this actress there is chemistry. She's cast perfectly. She's feminine, pretty but not stunning, and sensitive.
I think I posted years ago that Star Trek should explore one love relationship that is Platonic. OMG! No sex! You're kidding me! Imagine truly Chivalric love. Trek has not explored that really and they had the opportunity with Kira/Odo which they screwed up by getting them together. Spock seems very open in Episode 5 to talking to her at some length. She plays her cards perfectly and hides her feelings.
Christine seems to be either bitter about men or a wee bit immature as she is emerging it seems from a promiscuity "no commitments" phase. Immaturity is fine because now she can grow and be a real character.
I, for one fan, am not of the opinion that Spock loves TPring. He's terrified of her. She has let him know that she is evaluating him carefully for signs of humanness. Vulcan seems to be a pretty ruthless society. If you don't please your bondmate she can have you killed. Spock, first and foremost when all is said and done is determined to prove he is as Vulcan as any of them. He fails at this.

 

[IMC Headquarters]

Future T'Pring's vanity borders on narcissism, doesn't it? "I don't want to be the consort of a legend." In other words, she didn't want the gossipmongers of Vulcan sniggering behind her back and pointing fingers and ears in her direction. She knows how to manipulate Spock to get what she wants. Poor Stonn might see too late the logic behind Spock's admonition that having a thing is not so pleasing a thing as wanting it.

We all know Spock is a man of integrity, but T'Pring doesn't seem to value his. In this story we see the seeds of this.

He's terrified of her. She has let him know that she is evaluating him carefully for signs of humanness. Vulcan seems to be a pretty ruthless society. If you don't please your bondmate she can have you killed. Spock, first and foremost when all is said and done is determined to prove he is as Vulcan as any of them. He fails at this.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Spock dodged a phaser bolt there.

 

[Belz...]

Future T'Pring's vanity borders on narcissism, doesn't it?

Not in any way, shape or form.

 

[Kaelef]

It's annoying the setup was one of a woman having to complain her man was working too hard like something from the 1950s, but they recovered it.

I think it was done well, and not at all like something out of the 1950's. They both have professional careers, and they both have important responsibilities. That alone makes it different from what we would've seen decades ago. And the complaint wasn't that "her man works too hard", but rather one person in the relationship was prioritizing and making sacrifices for that relationship more than the other. Chapel made that point explicitly to Spock. This is a common problem in relationships today - even in those where both are in demanding, professional careers.

 

[Yistaan]

one person in the relationship was prioritizing and making sacrifices for that relationship more than the other. Chapel made that point explicitly to Spock. This is a common problem in relationships today - even in those where both are in demanding, professional careers.

I wasn't going to say anything but since your comment brought "real" relationships into the mix, there's a lot more pressure on the man to not come off as "needy", "desperate", etc. and the difference between seeming as such or not can literally mean the difference between a relationship and suddenly no relationship and a restraining order, etc.

I don't want to sound unequal but the stats are there that men have a higher rate of becoming stalkers, etc. so in our society men try our best to be aloof etc. and ironically "minimize" priority of a relationship (if we're lucky enough to have one) so as not to suddenly find ourselves on the other end of the fine but very, very, very significant line.

Back to Trek, Spock has logic but he also has intuition. If he did dump his entire career for T'Pring, chances are she STILL would have dumped him for Stonn, and he'd have a restraining order on top of the hell he lived through in Amok Time. As it was he barely came out unscathed and just dodged, thanks to McCoy, life imprisonment for killing Kirk under plak tow.

Not in any way, shape or form.

T'Pring was perfectly ok with Spock going to jail for his 2 century long half-Vulcan life and living the rest of his life in guilt and horror that he killed his best friend. That is a MASSIVELY disproportional retribution crossing into un-Vulcan emotional revenge over her arbitrary beliefs that Spock prioritized his demanding job over her some years ago. We have no indication at all that T'Pring was involved in McCoy's efforts to save Kirk's life.

 

[TRON JA307020]

At first, I wanted them to ignore "Chapel's undying love for Spock." Now, I'm not so sure. It's not that I want them to end up together because frankly Spock is an "A@##" He becomes more rigidly Vulcan as he ages and IMHO Vulcan is always being filmed at sunset because it's culture is dying. Spock is right when he tells Christine that he can't give her what she wants. He can't. He would make her unhappy. Yet, with this actress there is chemistry. She's cast perfectly. She's feminine, pretty but not stunning, and sensitive.
I think I posted years ago that Star Trek should explore one love relationship that is Platonic. OMG! No sex! You're kidding me! Imagine truly Chivalric love. Trek has not explored that really and they had the opportunity with Kira/Odo which they screwed up by getting them together. Spock seems very open in Episode 5 to talking to her at some length. She plays her cards perfectly and hides her feelings.
Christine seems to be either bitter about men or a wee bit immature as she is emerging it seems from a promiscuity "no commitments" phase. Immaturity is fine because now she can grow and be a real character.
I, for one fan, am not of the opinion that Spock loves TPring. He's terrified of her. She has let him know that she is evaluating him carefully for signs of humanness. Vulcan seems to be a pretty ruthless society. If you don't please your bondmate she can have you killed. Spock, first and foremost when all is said and done is determined to prove he is as Vulcan as any of them. He fails at this.

Yeah the the Odo/Kira relationship. It was odd. Auberjonis seemed uncomfortable acting the romance parts. The actors were different ages and it was obvious. I am not a fan of relationships between star trek characters.

 

[fireproof78]

In other words, she didn't want the gossipmongers of Vulcan sniggering behind her back and pointing fingers and ears in her direction.

That's not narcissistic. A lot of people don't like being talked about behind their back. It's rather uncomfortable and usually causes a lot of fear and worry and anxiety.

I think it was done well, and not at all like something out of the 1950's. They both have professional careers, and they both have important responsibilities. That alone makes it different from what we would've seen decades ago. And the complaint wasn't that "her man works too hard", but rather one person in the relationship was prioritizing and making sacrifices for that relationship more than the other. Chapel made that point explicitly to Spock. This is a common problem in relationships today - even in those where both are in demanding, professional careers.

Especially those who have demanding professional careers.

 

[Jack Wolfe]

All my military friends say Enterprise Bingo is the most realistic thing ever for Enlisted.

The unbelievable thing is the officers didn't know what it was.

Una and Laan should have sent them off to get some headlight fluid or tank grease.

Or a spool of flight line.

 

[Belz...]

T'Pring was perfectly ok with Spock going to jail for his 2 century long half-Vulcan life and living the rest of his life in guilt and horror that he killed his best friend. That is a MASSIVELY disproportional retribution crossing into un-Vulcan emotional revenge over her arbitrary beliefs that Spock prioritized his demanding job over her some years ago. We have no indication at all that T'Pring was involved in McCoy's efforts to save Kirk's life.

Which has precisely nothing to do with whether she's a narcissist.

 

[Dar70]

Some people are overly vain and look at themselves in the mirror constantly. That's pretty much the same thing. No sexual attraction there just vanity or admiration.

Pubert no one is saying it's sexual attraction where you want to have sex with the guy. Wayoung just told you that. For example. Would you ever say another guy is handsome???

 

[Yistaan]

All my military friends say Enterprise Bingo is the most realistic thing ever for Enlisted.

And now we know how O'Brien ended up the perpetual loner seen at the 'O'Brien at work' webcomic.

He refused to play Enterprise Bingo with other enlisted and probably told Picard all about it, earning O'Brien the enmity of all the other enlisted.

He's not good enough to hang out with the officers. "You are on this conference, but we do not grant you the rank of officer." Oh wait, wrong Star franchise. Doesn't help both Windu and Picard are bald.

Poor O'Brien. He won't get his due as Starfleet's greatest hero until centuries later apparently.

 

[Charles Phipps]

I think they'll probably go with T'Pring suffering Pon'Farr herself during the events of Amok Time.

Basically, both of them were suffering horniness induced psychosis.

She is not normally plotting murder.

 

[Noname Given]

Bang on the money here.

The Chapel from TOS is what, 8 years (so more reserved than young Chapel) or so older, has gone through some shit, especially with her husband abandoning her.

Pretty sure that would change a person.

FYI - Rodger Korby was her fiance not her husband.

 

[TRON JA307020]

Pubert no one is saying it's sexual attraction where you want to have sex with the guy. Wayoung just told you that. For example. Would you ever say another guy is handsome???

I think the previous posters were saying that. I forget who it was now and I am too lazy to go back and check but he said something along the lines that Kinsey says most people are bisexual. Not sure where that really came from but that's what I was basing the earlier debate about. Most people are not bissexual.

 

[Yistaan]

I think they'll probably go with T'Pring suffering Pon'Farr herself during the events of Amok Time.

Basically, both of them were suffering horniness induced psychosis.

She is not normally plotting murder.

I disagree. Spock concludes at the end of Amok Time that the whole episode had to require a LOT of logical planning, which would take longer than any pon farr we've seen on Trek. Plus Stonn was obviously in the picture long before even if she were undergoing a current pon farr.

She could've, you know, just told Spock about Stonn, ask to break the engagement, and tell him to get together with Chapel or something, especially now that it's established they actually know each other (I think a genuinely caring ex-girlfriend would at least try to help her ex find a new girlfriend to move on with)

Barring some massive retcon in her history in a future SNW episode, T'Pring is a jerk.

 

[Charles Phipps]

FYI - Rodger Korby was her fiance not her husband.

Characterization Marches On too.

Remember that Rom was a technical moron, strongly traditionalist, and a harsh disciplinarian to Nog.

I disagree. Spock concludes at the end of Amok Time that the whole episode had to require a LOT of logical planning, which would take longer than any pon farr we've seen on Trek. Plus Stonn was obviously in the picture long before even if she were undergoing a current pon farr.

She could've, you know, just told Spock about Stonn, ask to break the engagement, and tell him to get together with Chapel or something, especially now that it's established they actually know each other (I think a genuinely caring ex-girlfriend would at least try to help her ex find a new girlfriend to move on with)

Barring some massive retcon in her history in a future SNW episode, T'Pring is a jerk.

I don't think it really requires much planning other than, "Spock shows up, I tell him I choose ritual combat."

Especially when you do the math and don't want Spock or Stonn killed.

Kirk struck me as a fairly random choice.

 

[fireproof78]

I think the previous posters were saying that. I forget who it was now and I am too lazy to go back and check but he said something along the lines that Kinsey says most people are bisexual. Not sure where that really came from but that's what I was basing the earlier debate about. Most people are not bissexual.

I would not base much off of Kinsey's reports.

 

[Captain Jollydark]

At first, I wanted them to ignore "Chapel's undying love for Spock." Now, I'm not so sure. It's not that I want them to end up together because frankly Spock is an "A@##" He becomes more rigidly Vulcan as he ages and IMHO Vulcan is always being filmed at sunset because it's culture is dying. Spock is right when he tells Christine that he can't give her what she wants. He can't. He would make her unhappy. Yet, with this actress there is chemistry. She's cast perfectly. She's feminine, pretty but not stunning, and sensitive.
I think I posted years ago that Star Trek should explore one love relationship that is Platonic. OMG! No sex! You're kidding me! Imagine truly Chivalric love. Trek has not explored that really and they had the opportunity with Kira/Odo which they screwed up by getting them together. Spock seems very open in Episode 5 to talking to her at some length. She plays her cards perfectly and hides her feelings.
Christine seems to be either bitter about men or a wee bit immature as she is emerging it seems from a promiscuity "no commitments" phase. Immaturity is fine because now she can grow and be a real character.
I, for one fan, am not of the opinion that Spock loves TPring. He's terrified of her. She has let him know that she is evaluating him carefully for signs of humanness. Vulcan seems to be a pretty ruthless society. If you don't please your bondmate she can have you killed. Spock, first and foremost when all is said and done is determined to prove he is as Vulcan as any of them. He fails at this.

Promiscuity seems to be a word uniquely applied to women.

 

[Yistaan]

I don't think it really requires much planning other than, "Spock shows up, I tell him I choose ritual combat."

Especially when you do the math and don't want Spock or Stonn killed.

Kirk struck me as a fairly random choice.

We now know T'Pring knows a lot more about Spock's friends and career than we might have assumed from Amok Time. She knows Spock will go to jail for killing Kirk. She knows enough about Kirk that "If your Captain were victor, he would not want me, and so I would have Stonn."

"If your captain were victor" sure sounds like she's fine with Spock dying.

 

[Charles Phipps]

We now know T'Pring knows a lot more about Spock's friends and career than we might have assumed from Amok Time. She knows Spock will go to jail for killing Kirk. She knows enough about Kirk that "If your Captain were victor, he would not want me, and so I would have Stonn."

"If your captain were victor" sure sounds like she's fine with Spock dying.

Yes, but Spock is also clearly stronger and psychotically powerful so the odds were in his favor.

And my argument was that Pon Farr made her act out of character the same way Spock was.

Since Spock normally wouldn't kill Kirk.