Spoilers Star Trek: Prodigy 1x18 - "Mindwalk"

[Lakenheath 72]

Well, we know approximately where this encounter between ships is taking place as Gamma Serpentis is an actual location in the real world. This star is located nearly 37 light years from the Sol system.

Gamma Serpentis - Wikipedia

 

[Deks]

Very cool episode.
I was laughing with Dal as 'admiral Janeway' doing all kinds of schenanigans (Kate did a seriously great job - and it was utterly funny seeing her body do something like this)... but it was surprising the Dauntless crew allowed 'her' to behave as she did for as long as she had before taking action.... then again, since the episode took place over a relatively short amount of time, I'd say they needed to be sure she was acting WAY off before taking action.

Overall, considering how silly Dal behaved, we got some VERY good story progression and I loved when VADM Janeway interacted with holo Janeway and the rest of the crew. That sense of realization of what happened to the Protostar (the music in the background). and the worry on her face when looking at the footage and asking about Chakotay and his crew - that was a seriously gutwrenching moment to watch - at least holo Janeway is now free of the weapon's control and has her memories back).

The Diviner freeing Janeway was unexpected... and showing him kindness? Wait... didn't SF emphasize these qualities to Solum in their First contact during cultural exchanges?
Perhaps he needed 'hands on experience' to see for himself that SF is in fact 'good'.

Given what happened here, I suspect we might see the Diviner himself disarming the weapon and having another heart to heart with VADM Janeway who might mention Gwyn to him (though, seeing her actually talking with Gwyn on the Protostar would have been better if the next two episodes go down this road).

Progeny or not, his experience with Zero seemed to have 'shifted' his priorities somewhat a bit more towards Gwyn (he's not as 'distant' anymore).
Don't get me wrong, he seems to be still for completing his mission, but, Gwyn has now entered at the forefront of his mind.

The realization that Dal is an augment and never being admitted into SF (coming from VADM Janeway herself) puts a sting on things... howevee, there IS hope because she did say at the end she will make sure that ALL of them get a fair chance (I presume this included Dal - and lets face it... he never had a say in his creation in the first place - its possible VADM Janeway will try to vouch for him and get him in - and this could be what 'exhausts' her 'vouching rights' and prevents Seven from joining when she does decide to apply... remember that 7 mentioned that Janeway DID vouch for her, but the process was (apparently) stalled and she withdrew her application (I guess because Janeway even had to resort to 'vouching' for her in the first place).

A massive fleet of SF ships at the end I see... perfect 'bait' for the weapon to infect and destroy them, and now with VADM Janeway in lockdown (figures another problem would have presented itself that would inhibit Prodigies ability to convey the message to the rest of SF - will be interesting to see how Janeway gets out of the brig and stops this mess from continuing).

I suspect the Vindicator might end up being the second last big baddie... and considering she was carefully handling VADM Janeway when putting her in that small closet, I cannot help but wonder if Janeway and being in SF might have even gotten through to her too and have her disarm the Living Construct with the Diviner in the next 2 episodes - the only real threat might end up being Dreadnok (again).

Will be interesting to see how the season ends in the next 2 weeks though... but I want those two episodes now and preferably as a two parter being aired/streamed at the same time next week.

EDIT: I just want to say again how that moment between VADM Janeway and holo Janeway when looking at the footage of what happened to Chakotay... the music, the sense of loss, the worry... dang... brought back the feeling as to why I liked VOY so much in the first place... Chakotay better be ok... I would (ideally) like to see him back in command of the Protostar and tutoring the kids (and with this show giving him his proper time in the lime light with better character development).

 

[cooleddie74]

Goofy fun with some nice character moments for Admiral Janeway. Also: "I once turned into a salamander." I mean...come on. This show knows how to both honor Trek continuity and take the piss out of it.

 

[eschaton]

A big step up from last week's mediocrity. Like a lot of the show, it's in part a kiddie introduction to a Trek concept (in this case, body swapping), but it manages to layer on some characterization onto the basic premise, and move the season arc toward its conclusion.

I'll start with what I didn't like, which was primarily Dal's antics in Janeway's body aboard the Dauntless. I'm personally not a fan of "cringe comedy" and Dal in general was behaving way too suspiciously for me to seriously believe that the Dauntless crew would have given the benefit of the doubt for so long. That said, this is a kid's show, so some allowances need to be made.

The character work here is great though. To a significant extent though, this isn't a Dal episode - it's a Janeway episode. Dal just sort of stumbles through this episode from start to finish, while VADM Janeway finally transforms into a full ally of the kids. Holo-Janeway gets her mini-arc from last episode completed as well, with her program purged of corruption from the Construct.

I also think this was rather smart use of technobabble for the show (at least, on the level of previous Trek technobabble). It didn't feel like a dumbed-down plot for kids, like a few of the episodes in earlier weeks - it felt like a regular episode of Trek that happened to have kids in it.

 

[ToddCam]

Very cool episode.
I was laughing with Dal as 'admiral Janeway' doing all kinds of schenanigans (Kate did a seriously great job - and it was utterly funny seeing her body do something like this)... but it was surprising the Dauntless crew allowed 'her' to behave as she did for as long as she had before taking action.... then again, since the episode took place over a relatively short amount of time, I'd say they needed to be sure she was acting WAY off before taking action.

If the Coda miniseries is anything to go by (non-canon, blah blah blah), Starfleet admirals can be completely bonkers and curse out the UFP president and still not be relieved of duty.

 

[Deks]

A big step up from last week's mediocrity. Like a lot of the how, it's in part a kiddie introduction to a Trek concept (in this case, body swapping), but it manages to layer on some characterization onto the basic premise, and move the season arc toward its conclusion.

Indeed... its a shame though to see Gwyn taken a back seat a bit in character development though... we might get more of her in the next 2 episodes.

I'll start with what I didn't like, which was primarily Dal's antics in Janeway's body aboard the Dauntless. I'm personally not a fan of "cringe comedy" and Dal in general was behaving way too suspiciously for me to seriously believe that the Dauntless crew would have given the benefit of the doubt for so long. That said, this is a kid's show, so some allowances need to be made.

I actually enjoyed Dal's antics in Janeway's body (but I have to agree with you that given his behavior, the Dauntless crew would have never allowed him to go on for as long as he had - especially after spitting out coffee and saying out loud 'how can she drink this stuff?').
Was 'interesting' (and funny) to see Janeway doing stuff like that. Totally out of character - and thinking back on her VOY days, we didn't get much comedy/fun side from Janeway as she seemed very serious (a plus if you ask me, but an occasional 'cut loose' bit would have been great too)... plus it gave Mulgrew a chance to 'cut loose' a bit from her usual Janeway persona.

The character work here is great though. To a significant extent though, this isn't a Dal episode - it's a Janeway episode. Dal just sort of stumbles through this episode from start to finish, while VADM Janeway finally transforms into a full ally of the kids. Holo-Janeway gets her mini-arc from last episode completed as well, with her program purged of corruption from the Construct.

Indeed... but for me, the biggest highlight was VADM Janeway's interaction with holo Janeway and the realization of what happened to Chakotay, the music, the sense of loss... it was almost painful to watch (for me).

I also think this was rather smart use of technobabble for the show (at least, on the level of previous Trek technobabble). It didn't feel like a dumbed-down plot for kids, like a few of the episodes in earlier weeks - it felt like a regular episode of Trek that happened to have kids in it.

Prodigy may be a kids show, but it feels more like a live action series (and far better one than Disco S3/4 and PIC)... in effect it treats kids as not dumb like some cartoons can (Lower Decks is pretty great too, but on a more 'loony' end which shouldn't be taken too seriously given how many gags and antics go on there).

 

[Deks]

If the Coda miniseries is anything to go by (non-canon, blah blah blah), Starfleet admirals can be completely bonkers and curse out the UFP president and still not be relieved of duty.

The novels aren't canon though, and I'd dread to think Admirals would behave like that unless they were utterly bonkers (in which case, they shouldn't be admirals in the first place).
But for Janeway to behave like this is way too suden and out of the blue as far as the Dauntless crew is concerned.

 

[The_Baroness]

I wonder if there is anyone we know on any of those starships?

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

"AdmirDal". That might have been one of the best body swaps of all time.

This week was a 10 for me and definitely could have been longer without losing anything.

 

[Deks]

Btw, I've noticed in the footage of Chakotay when the ship was boarded that there was another (unknown) crewmember slouched on the aft side of the doors to the main bridge (that would give us a 4th Protostar crewmember).

 

[Deks]

Well that was a fun, silly episode. Dal doesn’t really do a good Janeway.

Given how he behaved utterly out of character? Nope. But voice wise I think Brett did a pretty good Janeway, and Kate seems to have had a blast and a way to 'cut loose' a bit while doing Dal.

That line about Augments not being allowed into Starfleet isn’t strictly true. Bashir was allowed to stay. You just need to blame it on someone else.

Not accurate entirely. Bashir was an exception given that he had no say in his augomentation (although he DID go along with the lie for a very long)... but part of the reason why he was probably allowed to stay in SF was likely because he had a pretty good track record in SF itself.

Dal is an external anomaly (in the eyes of SF)... but Janeway did mention she will try to help them and make sure they are all given 'a fair shake' (I would hope Dal included).

I also posited that if Janeway vouches for Dal and he gets into SF (eventually), its possible Janeway would have exhaused her 'vouching rights' when she attempts to do so with Seven (I don't think Seven tried to apply to SF as of yet).

 

[The Old Mixer]

I finally heard Jason Alexander in the Tellarite doctor, when he had that little George-like outburst on the bridge. He's been doing a very good job of not sounding like himself.

I'd dread to think Admirals would behave like that unless they were utterly bonkers (in which case, they shouldn't be admirals in the first place).

From what we've seen, being bonkers is a qualification for promotion.

 

[Deks]

I finally heard Jason Alexander in the Tellarite doctor, when he had that little George-like outburst on the bridge. He's been doing a very good job of not sounding like himself.


From what we've seen, being bonkers is a qualification for promotion.

Janeway isn't bonkers though.
Neihter is Picard.
Nacheyev wasn't. Ross wasn't either (or at least he didn't seem to be, despite his S31 connection)... and Hayes too.
Jellico also doesn't strike me as 'bonkers' either... hard headed perhaps and set in his ways too... but certainly seems to have good intentions in the end that benefitted others - though I agree his approach could do with more flexibility.

Admirals DO seem a bit... skeptical though... and tough-ish. In this episode, Janeway mentioned that the first thing as a cadet they teach you is to keep an open mind. Its a good thing she reminded herself of that (but she already managed to reach a fairly good idea about the kids when her first officer managed to dig out the files on them and figured out they were sold, bartered and enslaved).

And a bunch of other admirals weren't bonkers either... we have seen a few admirals who played part in conspiracies though and ended up exposed and dealt with... the incidents involving UFP admirals though are seemingly few though.

Dougherty however (from Insurrection movie) might have been borderline... but even he never wanted things to progress to the lenghts they had in the movie - he just needed someone to remind him of that.

Not sure if you want to count admiral Janeaway from Endgame future timeline though. She didn't seem particularly mad to me... in pain however? Yes. Because of Chakotay's and Seven's deaths, and Tuvok's descent into madness - her bringing the ship back home seemed a bit 'empty'... and it could have a damaging effect on a person.

Hm... thinking about some other admirals who were part of conspiracies in the past... I cannot help but wonder if they had similar losses or went through things that prompted them to become party to conspiracies.

 

[Dukhat]

Nice closeup!

Can't quite decide who's cuter

We saw the fleet in the Nick ad already, but here the resolution is of course much better.

Quite the fleet, with at least 19 Sovereigns, 16 Centaurs, 8 Akiras, and 2 Defiants!

The Sovereigns, Defiants and Akiras I get…but 16 Centaurs? Huh? Not to mention that they used the inaccurate Eaglemoss version where the ship is scaled to a normal Excelsior class rather than being much smaller relative to the filming model’s Constitution/Reliant bridge dome, among other inconsistencies. And I guess having 16 of them makes it clear that the ship is its own class rather than a ‘wartime bash of Excelsior parts.’ I wonder if they will give the class name in dialogue.

 

[cooleddie74]

After Wolf 359 and then the Battle of Sector 001 I guess Starfleet rushes at least one to two dozen starships to the scene of any potential danger emerging from a subspace rift. Better to be safe than sorry, and at least it's not the Riker fleet of Inquirys from the Season 1 finale of PIC.

 

[Shawnster]

Well, I’m going to have to stay out of this thread for a few days as you all get this toon two days before me and I do not want any spoilers.

Enjoy.

Your understanding of the nature of the internet and your reasonable response is refreshing and appreciated. Thank you good being.

 

[Weyoun 251]

I have never been happier to hear a Threshold reference than I am right now!

 

[Weyoun 251]

Janeway isn't bonkers though.
Neihter is Picard.
Nacheyev wasn't. Ross wasn't either (or at least he didn't seem to be, despite his S31 connection)... and Hayes too.
Jellico also doesn't strike me as 'bonkers' either... hard headed perhaps and set in his ways too... but certainly seems to have good intentions in the end that benefitted others - though I agree his approach could do with more flexibility.

Admirals DO seem a bit... skeptical though... and tough-ish. In this episode, Janeway mentioned that the first thing as a cadet they teach you is to keep an open mind. Its a good thing she reminded herself of that (but she already managed to reach a fairly good idea about the kids when her first officer managed to dig out the files on them and figured out they were sold, bartered and enslaved).

And a bunch of other admirals weren't bonkers either... we have seen a few admirals who played part in conspiracies though and ended up exposed and dealt with... the incidents involving UFP admirals though are seemingly few though.

Dougherty however (from Insurrection movie) might have been borderline... but even he never wanted things to progress to the lenghts they had in the movie - he just needed someone to remind him of that.

Not sure if you want to count admiral Janeaway from Endgame future timeline though. She didn't seem particularly mad to me... in pain however? Yes. Because of Chakotay's and Seven's deaths, and Tuvok's descent into madness - her bringing the ship back home seemed a bit 'empty'... and it could have a damaging effect on a person.

Hm... thinking about some other admirals who were part of conspiracies in the past... I cannot help but wonder if they had similar losses or went through things that prompted them to become party to conspiracies.

Rule seems to be that if an Admiral appears just once then they are, to quote a wise man, "insane in the membrane"

You see them more than once though and they are usually pretty competent

 

[fireproof78]

From what we've seen, being bonkers is a qualification for promotion.

Well, I mean, they treat it like you have to be crazy to want to give up command of a starship. Kirk in Generations is all of that to Picard: "Don't let them promote you." Kirk didn't go crazy but he definitely became more of a jerk.

the incidents involving UFP admirals though are seemingly few though.

Yeah, but they were intense, though that might be as a source of drama.

Commodore Decker: suffered intense loss, so that checks out.
Admiral Jamison: supported a warlord then became obsessed with staying young.
Admiral Kennerly: supplied weapons to the Cardassians. Not sure what his deal was.
Admiral Leyton: paranoia.
Admiral Pressman: unknown. Paranoia perhaps at the Federation and Starfleet being hamstrung by the Romulans.
Admiral Necheyev: ordered genocide. But, against the Borg. Debatable.
Admiral Ross: more distressed and stressed out because of the massive losses from the Dominion War. Plus Section 31.
Admiral Cartwright: just pure hatred.
Admiral Janeway: Well, one she got promoted over Picard quite quickly. Two, yeah, she seemed a little distressed by the alternate timeline.
Admiral Satie: paranoid.

Maybe part of the admirals tendency towards crazy behavior is simply the fact that they get too much information about threats and it drives them crazy from trying to solve it all.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Well, I mean, they treat it like you have to be crazy to want to give up command of a starship. Kirk in Generations is all of that to Picard: "Don't let them promote you." Kirk didn't go crazy but he definitely became more of a jerk.


Yeah, but they were intense, though that might be as a source of drama.

Commodore Decker: suffered intense loss, so that checks out.
Admiral Jamison: supported a warlord then became obsessed with staying young.
Admiral Kennerly: supplied weapons to the Cardassians. Not sure what his deal was.
Admiral Leyton: paranoia.
Admiral Pressman: unknown. Paranoia perhaps at the Federation and Starfleet being hamstrung by the Romulans.
Admiral Necheyev: ordered genocide. But, against the Borg. Debatable.
Admiral Ross: more distressed and stressed out because of the massive losses from the Dominion War. Plus Section 31.
Admiral Cartwright: just pure hatred.
Admiral Janeway: Well, one she got promoted over Picard quite quickly. Two, yeah, she seemed a little distressed by the alternate timeline.
Admiral Satie: paranoid.

Maybe part of the admirals tendency towards crazy behavior is simply the fact that they get too much information about threats and it drives them crazy from trying to solve it all.

Does anybody have a record of how many on-screen Admirals go hay-wire vs how many have no major issues?