Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x12 - "Through the Valley of Shadows"

[thribs]

The non batshit-crazy ones, that is.

Lorca wouldn’t save them. Why risk your life to rescue some cadets?
Hence why he’s the best.

 

[XCV330]

No thanks

I love how suddenly in the last couple of years Enterprise has become the gold standard of how to get it done by the curmudgeonizers when that show was treated like sewage when it was on and for a long time afterwards.

 

[thribs]

I love how suddenly in the last couple of years Enterprise has become the gold standard of how to get it done by the curmudgeonizers when that show was treated like sewage when it was on and for a long time afterwards.

I wasn’t on this site back then so I didn’t know that. I always liked it.

 

[Agony_Boothb]

I love how suddenly in the last couple of years Enterprise has become the gold standard of how to get it done by the curmudgeonizers when that show was treated like sewage when it was on and for a long time afterwards.

I know, right? I do love the fickle and selective memory some fans have.

 

[Kzinti]

holy molly that was awesome far better than the last 2 episode

They had the perfect chance to show the TOS aesthetic with that future vision. Bummer.

some people really need to stop living in 1966...

 

[Yistaan]

Or maybe more people would have died, or a great future starfleet captain doesn't get a life defining event that helps them in some way. I can also see Pike thinking that making sure a command officer of a stronger species or whatever as being a way of him abdicating responsibility. Trying to avoid the event is also the type of meddling with the timeline that Starfleet doesn't like, hence why the Defiant will still be sent on it's mission in 10 years.

Regardless, now that Pike knows of that future and the lives at stake I can imagine someone of his character feeling responsible to ensure it happens not only to protect the timeline but because it is the right thing. It's what Starfleet captains do.

To put it bluntly, no it's not what they do. Every time till now a captain is shown a bad future, from picard in times arrow to janeway in the voyager finale, that captain does everything possible to prevent it.

Pike has a decade after this control business wraps up to try to prevent this one.

The first thing Picard did after All Good Things was tell everyone what the future was like.

 

[Gov Kodos]

I know, right? I do love the fickle and selective memory some fans have.

This has all happened before.

 

[MvRojo]

Are they going to change the name of the show in Season 3, like they kinda did with Enterprise? It will be interesting to see how Discovery herself survives the next two episodes.

Since the show is focused on Burnham, I guess they could keep the title and have something other than the Discovery being the hero ship.

 

[Turd Ferguson]

Damn! With this episode, Anson Mount's Captain Pike has surpassed Jason Isaacs' Captain Lorca as my favorite Trek captain. He looked at his future, stared at his own face melting in the beep-boop chair and asked what was taking so long in getting that time crystal! I don't think anybody would be the same after having a vision like that and he looked (rightfully so) haunted talking with Tyler and L'Rell afterward. Badass! We'd better be seeing more of Pike after this season!

I love that they opened the "previously on" segment with Leland's "Struggle is pointless" quote, just to dig in Control will become the Borg. Then, the "Control"led Shenzhou officer mentioned something about assimilation before attempting to recreate First Contact's needle-to-the-eyeball scene with Michael

Great episode!

Also, I'm guessing this episode confirms that Jett Reno is now chief engineer? In her chat with Dr. Culber, she mentioned she needed Stamets in top form, which, in my mind, translates as she's in a leadership position.

Also-Also - Guy from Shenzhou (who's name I can't remember) sounded A LOT like the Borg when he was antagonizing Michael.

 

[MvRojo]

I like L'Rell's hair and make-up in this one. Especially the hair.

Yeah, her whole look reminded me of Azetbor

 

[Agony_Boothb]

To put it bluntly, no it's not what they do. Every time till now a captain is shown a bad future, from picard in times arrow to janeway in the voyager finale, that captain does everything possible to prevent it.

Pike has a decade after this control business wraps up to try to prevent this one.

In Time's Arrow you had aliens, going back in time to turn people's brains into slushies. Janeway altered the timeline for potentially billions of individuals across two quadrants of space to get her crew home a little earlier and make sure Seven could continue her lack of chemistry with Chakotay they aren't remotely the same to each other let alone to Pike's decision. And to rebut your point, generally when we see Captains altering bad futures it's because that future was made bad in the first place by either their own actions or the actions of a third party.

Pike is taking responsibility for his future regardless of the outcome to him. Yes he, could change his future but he's selfless enough to accept his fate.

 

[Cyrus]

I don't think Pike's future is grim. There could be a lot worst fates than spending your life with the beautiful Vina.

The future wheelchair Pike was done extremely well. So did the purists expected it to look identical to the one in The Menagerie?

 

[Turd Ferguson]

I don't think Pike's future is grim. There could be a lot worst fates than spending your life with the beautiful Vina.

The future wheelchair Pike was done extremely well. So did the purists expected it to look identical to the one in The Menagerie?

We know Pike's future isn't grim. Pike doesn't know that. All he knows is his face gets melted saving some cadets and he's confined to a chair. And he takes that time crystal like a boss

 

[Lakenheath 72]

I was waiting to see Vina. Not seeing her, I suppose that would make her the better part of his future. That chair really conveys the feeling of being in a cage far more convincingly than the old chair, and his injuries are far more terrifying.

What is up with Control? If Michael Burnham is a threat, stop playing with her like she is a toy. You are not a sadistic serial killer. You are an artificial intelligence killer whose logic has led you to the conclusion she is a threat. Get rid of her asap. Stop the chit-chat. Jesus F***ing Christ.

 

[Yistaan]

In Time's Arrow you had aliens, going back in time to turn people's brains into slushies. Janeway altered the timeline for potentially billions of individuals across two quadrants of space to get her crew home a little earlier and make sure Seven could continue her lack of chemistry with Chakotay they aren't remotely the same to each other let alone to Pike's decision. And to rebut your point, generally when we see Captains altering bad futures it's because that future was made bad in the first place by either their own actions or the actions of a third party.

Pike is taking responsibility for his future regardless of the outcome to him. Yes he, could change his future but he's selfless enough to accept his fate.

The first thing Picard did after All Good Things was tell everyone everything in the future. Despite the fact that doing so could very well undo the future timeline that ended the anomaly and saved humanity to begin with.

 

[Gov Kodos]

I don't think Pike's future is grim. There could be a lot worst fates than spending your life with the beautiful Vina.

The future wheelchair Pike was done extremely well. So did the purists expected it to look identical to the one in The Menagerie?

He doesn't know about that. It makes his telling Spock no all the more poignant. He wouldn't even take personal escape for himself at the cost of Spock's future.

 

[Norsehound]

I joked with my wife that L'rell's son looked like he was trying to cosplay as a Minbari from Babylon 5.

I didn't think Pike could be any cooler until that scene in this episode. It makes me even more sad that we can't have a Pike show set on the Enterprise- I'd gladly welcome any more TOS if this is what they can do.

I wonder if Pike will realize that now, since he's seen the future and knows it's guaranteed, that he can march into this fight knowing he can't die. He hasn't been promoted to fleet captain yet, and presumably if he's overseeing training then the conflict with Control may be over. So he can go to this, because if he can't, the future he saw won't happen.

We only caught a glimpse of the D7, it was short enough that I only noticed the engines were new. I kinda hope we see more of it later, but I'm also hoping not, least it seem over-pandering.

If Control/The Borg can do the grey goo thing why does it even bother with humanoid bodies, or have the need to assimilate folks by plunging in tubules? In first contact they could have taken over the ship by flooding the plumbing with all of that grey matter that would just crawl up and take over people. Still disappointed Control is our big bad, and not some phenomenon or another race. And if you're going to drag out an existing race from Trek mythology to imply as your big bad, how about someone else more interesting like the Tholians or that parasite race from TNG Conspiracy? The Borg? again? Really hope this red herring dies swiftly.

 

[MvRojo]

Man, Boreth looks awesome.

It did look cool. Though it must have gone through some massive climate change in the 100 year between this episode and "Rightful Heir."

 

[MvRojo]

Unimaginative? The imaginative way would be to use the aesthetic and expand on it. Like what Enterprise did.

I enjoyed the amount of effort Enterprise put into making the bridge look accurate for the sake of nostalgia. I didn't like whatever those giant Jeffries tubes were where Archer fights the Gorn.

 

[Cyrus]

It did look cool. Though it must have gone through some massive climate change in the 100 year between this episode and "Rightful Heir."

There is a price to pay for keeping the time crystals.