Spoilers STAR TREK BEYOND - Grading & Discussion

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by Commander Richard, Jun 29, 2016.

?

Grade the movie...

  1. A+

    15.4%
  2. A

    27.8%
  3. A-

    21.1%
  4. B+

    15.0%
  5. B

    7.1%
  6. B-

    4.5%
  7. C+

    3.3%
  8. C

    1.6%
  9. C-

    1.7%
  10. D+

    0.3%
  11. D

    0.2%
  12. D-

    0.5%
  13. F

    1.6%
  1. inflatabledalek

    inflatabledalek Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2011
    You know how, against all logic, you always keep an eye out for Sisko and company when watching The Trouble With Tribbles? It's going to be the same with looking out for Elba whenever the MACO's are in Enterprise isn't it?









    It's just me that does that isn't it?
     
  2. Jax

    Jax Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2003
    Location:
    Waiting for Entropy
    Saw it yesterday and really enjoyed it, I went with a non Trek fan who had seen ST09 & STID and he enjoyed it too though it was an 11am showing so not many people there in the screening. I gave it a B+ and to compare that I gave ST09 (A-) and STID (B+) though I always feel maybe I should give that a B.

    The film looks beautiful, it really does and being set mainly on a planet and not on the ship in deep space was a refreshing change. When I first saw the trailers and saw the big E bite the dust I remember not being happy but it was done so dam well that I loved it. The characters all got something to do and the story was pretty well paced and put together from Pegg & co. So many references and nods to the franchise made me smile throughout and also feel very sad when the Nimoy bit was shown. Krall while not quite the fleshed out villain we hoped for was indeed a positive for the movie and Idris played him very well. Justin Lin directed the action well though once or twice it was a little hard to follow but it was exactly what the franchise was crying out for.

    Jaylah was a superb character who had great chemistry with the cast especially Scotty and I would love to see her return in the 4th movie, she would make a great weapons/tactical officer and replacement for Chekov IMO. The only issues I had are small Trek fan stuff we all typically can't help but notice with the big one being the history of the Franklin. For me it should be one of the last NX classes ever built but Scotty said it was an early one? Warp 4 vessel? all NX ships were 5 far as I am aware and it did seem far out from Earth for such a low warp ship since the big E was 3 years into her deep space mission and her engines dwarf the NX star ships.

    Bring on Star Trek 4 in 2019 I presume.
     
  3. Norsehound

    Norsehound Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    May 21, 2013
    Location:
    Livermore, CA
    I just came back from seeing it earlier this afternoon.

    Of the three reboot movies, I think this one is the best. There aren't any story glitches as bad as Delta Vega being in sight of Vulcan, and no jammed-in story moments like Kirk in the reactor. It had the same vibrancy as the other two reboot movies, but this time the story made a lot more sense than Khan's blood and the Federation conspiracy.

    I laughed at the humor, cried in a few parts. When Quinto was talking about Ambassador spock in a heart to heart moment, I actually cried, because you know Quinto is thinking of Nimoy in that scene. And I cried again when I saw the old cast photo as Spock was looking at it. Realizing that the only way reboot Spock could have this photo is if Ambassador spock carried it on his person through his trip to the past, implying perhaps that Spock always kept it after the crews parted ways in six.

    The shout-outs to various parts of TOS lore were incredible and fun to hear. Picking up the Saurian Brandy (The enemy within) from Thesus (Charlie X) was great, while both Bones and Kirk always had Checkov pegged as a Vodka man (Trouble with Tribbles). Other shout-outs included the Franklin maybe being grabbed by a giant green hand!

    Another small thing to note about the Franklin... the bridge. If you think about it, the console-chair-back console arrangement... is identical to the stolen Klingon BOP in Trek 3! I also caught one of the classic beeps in there when someone pressed a button.

    I also liked the shoutouts to Enterprise. I didn't think much about the series until the last season, but canon is a big sticking point with diehard fans, and I could appreciate that this time around, the story had some research behind it to be informed. While the registry number is weird to reconcile with NX-01, I really appreciate that not only did they name the old-style weapons correctly, but they created a character with significant ties to the Enteprise pre-Nero era.

    Also, to anyone who has seen the Discovery trailer reading this... is it me, or does the Franklin have a lot in common with the new NCC-1031?

    As for the climax... I think it's very appropriate for this anniversary movie, because the argument over starfleet as a military organization is an old one I think. There are clear threats to the peaceful federation that Edison was trained to fight, and at the time the Federation did grow because of those conflicts to become stronger. But conflict shouldn't be sought as means of Growth, which is I think what Kirk would argue. That Krall gradually shifts into Edison, giving the visual theme of recognizing the enemy comes from within than without, is interesting. It is also interesting to have Edison in a classic uniform fighting with Kirk who is wearing a new one. How about that for metaphor?

    Lastly, I'll end with this. I'm dedicated enough of a Star Trek fan to list off quotes from TOS episodes, appropriately name the weapons systems of the starships, and tell you how Trek physics are supposed to work. But I'm casual enough that I'm not beholden to Roddenberry's "vision" and feel any deviation is a travesty. I had Fun with this movie, just as I feel that these new movies have been more fun than Trek's been allowed to have since the 80s. What's different now over the past two films is that the story is significantly more cohesive. Between this and Into Darkness, I want to see this one again.

    I'm sorry that we have lost Yelchin, because Checkov also makes a great team with the Captain. But I'm really looking forward to Trek 14 now, because I want to see This crew from This movie go further.
     
    Vger23, BigJake and jespah like this.
  4. Yoda

    Yoda Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2000
    Location:
    San Diego
    This was probably my least favorite of the three reboot films on first viewing. It wasn't really any smarter than the first two, but also managed to be pretty boring. Krall's origin was kind of obvious as soon as we got to Jaylah's "house". Yorktown was a bit silly and over the top. The Enterprise meeting its end in the third movie is pretty lame considering that it didn't get a 79 episode run beforehand. It probably didn't help that I couldn't really get away from HEY THE ENTERPRISE IS GONNA BLOW UP IN THIS ONE advertising. Nothing in the movie really clicked for me, I don't know, maybe I'll like it more on a rewatch in a few months.

    And I didn't get the lack of Carol Marcus. Seeing more of their relationship as a counterpoint to the deadbeat dad era Kirk/Carol from the original movies seems like a no-brainer to me. It would have had to have been better than Spock/Uhura in this one.
     
  5. HaventGotALife

    HaventGotALife Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2011
    60 million dollar opening is in-sights. But it's still 10 million less than "Into Darkness." Damn. This is the best of the three movies, and here we are. Fans and word-of-mouth good, movie is struggling, again. Looks like someone will get nervous and lower budget (and expectations) or kill the story in the next one, to make what is bankable. Damn.
     
  6. TrekGuide.com

    TrekGuide.com Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2002
    Location:
    California, Earth, Sector 001
    I'm saying the plot about a disgruntled veteran wanting to release a smoke bomb in a large city, and being defeated in the nick of time in a fistfight, is not terribly creative or original. It's basically the same plot as half the other "Star Trek" movies, not to mention "Mission: Impossible" or "24" or, yes, even "CSI." They can add Vulcans and starships and alien doodads, but that doesn't make the story original.

    Like many recent science-fiction movies, the fate of the galaxy is once again determined by two guys having a fistfight. Really, that's the same plot as the last Trek movie. Can't we resolve a "Star Trek" movie without a fistfight? Heck, that's how every "Rocky" movie is resolved. Why have an entire Starfleet if it all comes down to punching a guy in the face to save the galaxy? Personal vendettas and fistfights are not what the Star Trek universe is for. There should be larger-scale stories about alien empires and conflicts and interstellar politics.

    I mean, for these last four or five Trek movies, they might as well star Jason Statham and Jean-Claude Van Damme, if the whole story hinges on who is going to punch the other guy hardest. To my recollection, there were hundreds of episodes where Picard and Janeway solved a problem and saved the ship without punching even one person in the face. Surely they can translate that type of storytelling to a two-hour movie. ...
     
  7. { Emilia }

    { Emilia } Arabic's friendliest letter Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2011
    Location:
    Cologne, EU
    It's probably too early to tell from the opening weekend. This summer has been pretty awful for movies at the box office so Beyond looks like a success for the studio, for sure. I also think good word-of-mouth is unlikely to affect the opening weekend a whole lot but will effect its longevity. We'll see how much it drops in the second week.
     
    Amaris and SalvorHardin like this.
  8. HaventGotALife

    HaventGotALife Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2011
    While I agree, we are getting lost. See the forest, not the trees. This is a problem with action films, which is what Star Trek is, when it is bankable. I would love to see an ending like "Best of Both Worlds," in the movies. It's not what this movie franchise does. This is why I want them on the small-screen. Watch "Star Trek: Discovery" and we'll see if they need a bigger phaser or bigger brawn, or if they return the series to its origins of being a morality play and more cerebral than television would allow. It will, after all, require money to watch the show. Also, remember, science and music destroyed the swarm. They used their brains on that one. Contrast that to Spock saying "The Enterprise is not prepared for this type of engagement" at the beginning of the film. We cannot just fire phasers at the swarm--there is too many of them. It took music to take them down. So, it's both, in this movie. Remember, it's not exactly Picard and Ru'Afo at the end of Insurrection. This says a lot about Kirk's character, about the Star Trek universe, in the middle of a fist-fight. They were innovative, despite the need to keep the formula.

    Don't get me wrong--I like your premise--I thirst for a big-budget sit-down-and-talk-our-enemy-out-of-it, Trek movie. But there isn't a word uttered between Spock and Khan in "Into Darkness." A Vulcan bent on revenge. A man trying to not be apprehended. That's all that's going on there. In '09, where's the character moment with "I've got your gun!" The most we get is Nero saying that Kirk will never be a great man, which is better than "Into Darkness," for sure. The problem is money. They need to have the "showdown," and this one was less showdown, then Kirk just doing his job. He tries to connect with him. He tries to talk him through his motivations. In '09, he doesn't do that. He just sits there drooling on the Narada and finds the strength to fight him, after he's beaten. Is it formulaic? Yes. Do I want something different? Yes. But, we won't get it from a movie because general audiences support the franchise, not us fans. If you want that type of movie, become a school teacher. Expose action flicks for what they are. And shape the next generation to want more cerebral characters, better endings. Short of that, 13-year-olds are going to think that's stupid, or be confused by it. This isn't an arthouse movie. It's not an Indie pic. It's a big-budget action-adventure film. And, we have to settle for the trappings around the formula.
     
    Sparky and plynch like this.
  9. RAMA

    RAMA Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 1999
    Location:
    NJ, USA
    Or it could be..you know, copyright violations and earning income from Trek...
     
    Campe, Amaris, SalvorHardin and 2 others like this.
  10. RAMA

    RAMA Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 1999
    Location:
    NJ, USA
    There are no new stories out there, so the fun is in how the variations are told..and in this case, it was pretty spectacular...and very science fictiony.

    RAMA

     
    Vger23 likes this.
  11. VOODOOXI

    VOODOOXI Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2007
    I'm torn about this film.

    One one hand it was just as I had feared it would be. Fast + Furious set in space...On the hand hand it has some truly wonderful + unexpected character moments that represented the best of ST.

    As I mentioned much of the film was Fast + Furious set in space. Essentially it was two hours of things loudly banging into each other in an attempt to make ST into Guardians of the Galaxy. The dumbing down of ST goes into overdrive with this movie.

    This film may contain the two worst scenes in the history of ST. The scene with Kirk popping wheelies was cringe inducing. That was a scence out of a Kubrick film compared to the utterly embarrassing use of Beastie Boys music in a critical scene.

    On the other hand there were a few moments of real magic...Not to give anything away, but when Spock opens that picture at the end of the film it brought the house down. The theatre I was in broke out into applause.

    There were several other really great character moments (many centered around the passing of Ambassador Spock) placed throught the destruction + cgi, but not nearly enough.

    I am not in the camp that says you must make an intellectual ST film as if it were 1978. I get that the reality of the film industry is if you attempted that in 2016 in the era of Transformers you would be out of business really soon, but there has to be a better balance than Star Trek Beyond.

    Overall I'd give it 3 out of 5 stars
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2016
  12. ElimGarak.93-99

    ElimGarak.93-99 Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2014
    Location:
    Europe
    I saw Beyond Thursday evening the 21st.
    It definitely didn't disappoint me and absolutely enjoyed it. I think it's the best of the three.
    I think that you can really see that people who know and love Star Trek wrote, produced and directed this movie,
    and that's always a big +.
    I enjoyed the references and loved the TOS movie picture that Spock held in his hand toward the end of the movie.
     
  13. Makarov

    Makarov Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2013
    There's ways to end a general audience pleasing movie without just having the main character beat up the villain actually. One way is to introduce an obstacle for them both to work together against, maybe have his weapon go out of control or something.
     
  14. Serial thread killer

    Serial thread killer Vice Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2003
    Location:
    uk
    There are only so many ships to give out and not every captain is going to get a state of the art brand new ship. Remember Picard's first ship was a rust bucket.
     
  15. Michael

    Michael In alignment with canon Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Location:
    Aloha Quadrant
    I'm going to see the film again in a few hours. I hope I'll notice some things I didn't the first time around. Two questions:
    • Does anyone recall where and when we see Cupcake in the movie?
    • When exactly are they calling out the Stargazer?
     
  16. SalvorHardin

    SalvorHardin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2008
    Location:
    Star's End
    I was looking for him in the movie but I missed him. I also haven't seen anyone else mention that they spotted him.
     
  17. ancient

    ancient Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2005
    Location:
    United States
    As far as I can tell, Cupcake is not in the movie.

    When they first arrive at Yorktown, just before Sulu runs over to his family, there is a PA announcement that the Stargazer is departing.
     
  18. timtonruben359

    timtonruben359 Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    I saw Beyond last night and I loved it but my biggest beef was really the pacing of the movie. I felt it was too fast and I suspect that had more to do with editing choices rather than the actual script. It feels like the movies was edited down to within an inch of its life. My friends and I who went all said the same thing that we had a hard time following what has just happened a few times.
     
    Computer Voice likes this.
  19. RAMA

    RAMA Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 1999
    Location:
    NJ, USA
    The RT rating is down to 84% but the IMDB rating is a very solid 7.8/10 so far. Metacritic is at 70/100.

    RAMA
     
  20. CaptainDonovin

    CaptainDonovin Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2006
    Location:
    Labrador City. woof
    I thought Cupcake didn't survive the engagement with the Klingons in Into Darkness.