Star Trek: Axanar

[MarsWeeps]

-According to you, Garth is now fully recovered and back in service as of "Going Boldly."

Which makes no sense to me. He was a killer and a nutcase as well as a shapeshifter. In my opinion, even if he is "recovered" he should still be in some type of nursing home. What if he has a relapse while on duty?

While it was nice to see him, it just stretches the imagination to think he would be re-instated to StarFleet.

 

[doubleohfive]

-According to you, Garth is now fully recovered and back in service as of "Going Boldly."

Which makes no sense to me. He was a killer and a nutcase as well as a shapeshifter. In my opinion, even if he is "recovered" he should still be in some type of nursing home. What if he has a relapse while on duty?

While it was nice to see him, it just stretches the imagination to think he would be re-instated to StarFleet.

It absolutely breaks any line of credibility that Starfleet --let alone Kirk-- would be ok with this after everything Garth allegedly and definitely did prior to and during "Whom Gods Destroy."

For crying out loud, the guy committed genocide. I just don't see any way to rationalize putting the guy back in command of a starship after something like that.

 

[Loken]

For crying out loud, the guy committed genocide. I just don't see any way to rationalize putting the guy back in command of a starship after something like that.

Wrong. Garth didn't commit Genocide, he attempted it but was stopped by his crew. (Watch Whom Gods Destroy starting at minute 18.)

He hasn't been put back in command of a starship, he was simply in Starfleet in "Going Boldly". Note the insignia he is wearing.

As to if he would be back in Starfleet after WGD:

1) He was in a terrible accident.

2) He was driven to madness because of the cellular metamorphosis that he was taught by the Antosians.

3) Even in 21st century America, "not guilty due to mental incapacity" is a mainstream legal principle.

4) It is clear that the inmates of the Elba II colony were the "last few criminally insane" in the Federation. Obviously, the medicine cured them as we start to see at the end of the episode. Mental illness has obviously not only been cured, but does not have the stigma it has in our day and age.

So not being at fault for his mental illness, and not being legally liable for his actions, and being fully cured, and (in our take) having no memory of anything that happened after the accident, Starfleet returning one of their most important captains to service is not unlikely in an enlightened universe that Roddenberry created.

 

[Borgminister]

Hey, if Picard came back post-assimiliation....

 

[MarsWeeps]

For crying out loud, the guy committed genocide. I just don't see any way to rationalize putting the guy back in command of a starship after something like that.

You've been here long enough that you should know how to quote properly. I never made that statement.

 

[Loken]

For crying out loud, the guy committed genocide. I just don't see any way to rationalize putting the guy back in command of a starship after something like that.

You've been here long enough that you should know how to quote properly. I never made that statement.

Sorry, accidentally left the wrong tag in. Doubleohfive made the statement. Corrected.

 

[Loken]

Hey, if Picard came back post-assimiliation....

WELL SAID. Yes, Picard was assimilated, lead a Borg Cube that devastated Starfleet and killed hundreds of thousands, and he is given back the Enterprise immediately.

 

[PattyW]

So not being at fault for his mental illness, and not being legally liable for his actions, and being fully cured, and (in our take) having no memory of anything that happened after the accident, Starfleet returning one of their most important captains to service is not unlikely in an enlightened universe that Roddenberry created.

Sorry, but you are also saying that the very nature of Human beings have changed as well. A "truly sane" individual that knows they took such actions would be traumatized by it - and moreso by the amnesia of such events. Because their guilt would make them imagine worse than people know about.

I've treated people who have amnesia, and even when there is no horrible event in their past they are traumatized and are sure they are guilty of something no one else knows about. If Garth is a decent Human being he would be seriously screwed up after being cured - forever. If that is not reflected in his story after the TOS episode, it's just silly.

 

[Loken]

Your absolutism is impressive doctor. I choose to think otherwise.

 

[RCAM]

I tend to agree it's highly unlikely Garth would ever find himself on the bridge of a ship again, but since Axanar is a prequel to TOS, that's not too much of an issue here. The project itself seems interesting. Look forward to seeing it.

 

[PattyW]

well if he's NOT bothered by what he did, then he's a sociopath...and we're right back where we began....

 

[Loken]

 

[Loken]

 

[doubleohfive]

For crying out loud, the guy committed genocide. I just don't see any way to rationalize putting the guy back in command of a starship after something like that.

Wrong. Garth didn't commit Genocide, he attempted it but was stopped by his crew. (Watch Whom Gods Destroy starting at minute 18.)

Is that supposed to make it less terrible a crime? The fact that others stopped him?

So not being at fault for his mental illness, and not being legally liable for his actions, and being fully cured, and (in our take) having no memory of anything that happened after the accident, Starfleet returning one of their most important captains to service is not unlikely in an enlightened universe that Roddenberry created.

...it still stretched credibility. I'm not saying I don't think you may have found a way to make it work (I'll comment on that point after I see Axanar in its entirety) I'm just saying that right now, what we know of Garth, it really seems implausible.

 

[PattyW]

my problem is that if Garth isn't bothered by all this than he's pretty much a flat cartoon rather than a three dimensional Human. Which is a problem that a lot of fanfilm scripts have. I hope the Axanar script proves me wrong.

 

[Barbreader]

I want to clarify the law of insanity and of murder.

If I am insane, and I pick up a knife and I know it's a knife, and I use it to kill somebody and I know I am killing somebody, that's not the basis of an insanity defense.

If I am insane, and I pick up what I think is a pen (but it's a knife) and I use it to write on some paper, pressing really hard because the ink isn't working (but the paper is somebody major artery to their brain in reality)... that's an insanity which would be a defense.

Hollywood often portrays the former as being the basis of an insanity defense, but Hollywood is wrong.

In Florida, on the other hand, if the first person believed themselves in fear of their life, even if the person they killed was unarmed and never touched them, THAT'S a defense. Unlike traditional common law states, they do not have to try to retreat. They can stand their ground and kill the person. And apparently, that's OK.

The law of what exactly murder is and what justified homicide is differs greatly from place to place.

An extreme but real example: In 1200 years of Roman history, no husband was ever tried for the murder of his wife or child because ... a husband had a RIGHT to kill his wife or his children under Roman law. Therefore, if he did so, it was not murder.

 

[Loken]

BRIDGE CONCEPTS

 

[Loken]

For crying out loud, the guy committed genocide. I just don't see any way to rationalize putting the guy back in command of a starship after something like that.

Wrong. Garth didn't commit Genocide, he attempted it but was stopped by his crew. (Watch Whom Gods Destroy starting at minute 18.)

Is that supposed to make it less terrible a crime? The fact that others stopped him?

No that is supposed to point out that you are wrong. Your failure to own up to your error and deflect it is not surprising.

 

[Loken]

 

[Loken]

Been cutting our first Kickstarter Video.