Star City | Apple TV (Spoilers)

[Lord Garth]

I didn't know that I wanted to be the one to start the Star City thread, but it looks like I'm the first one to post about it after having just seen it, so start it I will. I won't give any spoilers at this stage, but I just watched both episodes back-to-back. An extremely different tone than For All Mankind. I'd say a more severe tone, more calculating, and more psychological. A heavy focus on espionage, loyalty to the state, rigid societal expectations, and exactitude. Star City feels different enough from For All Mankind that I don't feel like I just watched three episodes of the same thing (between the S5 finale of FAMK and the first two episodes of this series) but it still feels as if it fits comfortably within the For All Mankind universe.

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[FredH]

Interesting how the Chief Designer is never named. He seems to be a standin for Sergei Korolev (who was indeed only referred to as Chief Designer until after his death, for security reasons), but in 1969 Korolev had already been dead for about three years.

EDIT: Never mind. Wikipedia has a Ronald D. Moore quote to the effect that Korolev living longer is the point of divergence. OK, it’s Korolev.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

I won't be able to watch the two episodes until next week but I can't wait!

 

[Starkers]

Probably a silly question, but I should probably watch For All Mankind before this, right?

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Probably a silly question, but I should probably watch For All Mankind before this, right?

Not necessarily. There will be certain things you won't catch because this is an early history of some characters on For All Mankind, but overall it's its own show. All you really need to know is that the Soviets beat us to the Moon.

...that said, you definitely need to watch For All Mankind. One of the best television shows right now.

 

[Lord Garth]

Probably a silly question, but I should probably watch For All Mankind before this, right?

You don't have to at all (in order to understand anything). It stands on its own extremely well.

 

[tomalak301]

I hope they pick up the pace as the season goes on. They were kind of slow and a little on the boring side. There were some good moments, and I do like the juxtaposition between how the US handles the space race vs how Russia is doing it, and kind of using Anastasia as nothing more than a pawn. Still, I have watched these shows for the wonder of space exploration and i feel like the space exploration is taking a back seat for this series. I did stop watching Pluribus and Foundation a few episodes in but because this is part of the FAM universe I will try to keep going with the season. I just hope things get more interesting the deeper we get into it.

 

[tenmei]

Interesting how the Chief Designer is never named. He seems to be a standin for Sergei Korolev (who was indeed only referred to as Chief Designer until after his death, for security reasons), but in 1969 Korolev had already been dead for about three years.

EDIT: Never mind. Wikipedia has a Ronald D. Moore quote to the effect that Korolev living longer is the point of divergence. OK, it’s Korolev.

Yeah, IRL, Korolev was never named as the Chief Designer until he had died, so presumably they're continuing that idea.

 

[tenmei]

So 1x01 begins in June 1969 and runs to September 1969 (covering FaMK 1x01 and 1x02) and 1x02 picks up in September 1969.

The first Venera Mission to carry a lander was launched in August 1970, will it be secretly manned in this timeline, perhaps Polivanov?

 

[Hellbird]

Aptly quite bleak, with a few rays of sunshine here and there.

Certainly great drama, but its a far cry from those space cowboys driving their Chevrolet Corvettes, thats for sure.

I think this is the first time I've seen a successful N1 launch in fiction!

 

[FPAlpha]

25 minutes in and i'm already sick of the bleakness. The characters, the clothes, the colors in general - everything is so muted, almost black & white and depressing.

If that is going to be the general tone of the show i don't know if i'm going to make it. I've had my fill of bad Soviets and bleakness with the Chernobyl show, i don't know if i want several seasons of that style. At least FAMK was hopeful in that regard, an explorer show about daring engineers and astronauts in a race against their counterparts but if their counterparts shown here in this show are so joyless i don't know if the show will be for me.

Continuing to watch, i hope the first two full episodes still change my mind and i can find something to look forward to each week.

 

[trash80]

Only watched Ep 1 so far, thought it was brilliant, especially the space walk scene.

 

[26138]

Glorious N1 in ep 1!

 

[FPAlpha]

All right, seen the first two episodes.

Even though my initial reaction hasn't changed about the bleakness of the show, a massive contrast to FAMK, some interesting characters still have emerged.

Loved the Chief Designer, the quintessential scientist and engineer, who i fear is may be stepping into the same trap as Margo, i.e. being too naive or too focused on their work and not seeing the political impact of their work and the consequences it brings.

Loved to see a younger Nikulov, though i must admit i had to google his name in context to Mankind as i have a hard time remembering names and faces from it and only then realized he was the opposite of Margo and a bit more than just a work colleague, so maybe if this show makes it a few seasons including the time jumps from Mankind we might see this relationship from a different perspective.

Irina and communist bitch ( as i call her) Col. Raskova are an interesting pairing. Raskova constantly looking for betrayal and constantly testing people while herself having a chip on her shoulders being "lowborn" was a fascinating villain and i wonder where Irina is going when she tortured that man for information. Though thinking about it second or third degrees burns heal, a bullet to the head won't so she might have ultimately saved that man's life ( though with Raskova you can't know).

Too early to tell where the story of Anastasia goes but could they be the parents of Leonid Polivanov, the cosmonaut and governor of Happy Valley in Mankind?


Generally speaking i wonder what the focus of the show will be, what its central theme is going to be. Will they just try to copy Mankind with characters working under increased difficulty being in the Soviet Union, will it be a spy thriller, social commentary or all of this? Right now i just don't what the series wants to do or be to differentiate it from its parent show. It doesn't have much time to find its legs, Mankind concludes with the next seasn so it may just be another season maximum for Star City to find its audience to survive on its own once Mankind goes off the air and right now i have my doubts but i'm willing to be proven wrong.

 

[Airmandan]

Shows how much harder it would be for the Soviet space program since they're so focused on eating each other and advancing the party's ideals vs the mission itself. I'm sure that here the number of Cosmonauts that go missing during "training" is far higher than it was in the real world. Willing to bet Col. Raskova started out a lot more idealistic like Irina but over time that wore away.

 

[FPAlpha]

Shows how much harder it would be for the Soviet space program since they're so focused on eating each other and advancing the party's ideals vs the mission itself. I'm sure that here the number of Cosmonauts that go missing during "training" is far higher than it was in the real world. Willing to bet Col. Raskova started out a lot more idealistic like Irina but over time that wore away.

I don't know, i think she was always a product of the stalinist-marxist way having been completely indoctrinated from the start. As we now know she was a tanker in WW2, was cold as ice ( well, i give her a pass on that one since she was fighting Nazis) and didn't warm up. In every state you have people who are so deep down entrenched in the system no matter if it's good or bad that they'd do anything to protect it and further its goals. The Soviet Union was an evil system and evil, ruthless people thrived in there and this is what the character represents.

 

[trash80]

I won't mention it here because spoilers but i think a big event upcoming in Star City was mentioned in FAM so we may know how it turned out.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Great opening two episodes and the show gave me exactly what I hoped for: A harsh glimpse behind the Iron Curtain of the Soviet space program, dripping with paranoia, hubris, and, for a very few, the love of science and exploration. I don't know much about this side of the space race history behind the Chief Scientist and what For All Mankind already showed us. Hell, I didn't even remember Anastasia Belikova's name so I didn't see the untimely accusations against Yana Akhmatova coming. Either way, I'm looking forward to seeing that history play out from the Soviet perspective.

I love seeing the early lives of both Irina and Sergei. Irina is a far cry from the cold, calculating woman as seen in For All Mankind but we're already seeing how Raskova is molding her into that person. Whereas, Sergei is already the hungry, brilliant scientist that Margo will eventually fall in love with and I'm glad the Chief Scientist quickly pulled him under his wing for his secret mission. Great casting for both roles but Josef Davies especially looks and acts like a young Piotr Adamczyk.

Which leads to an interesting point. We know broadly how history will play out and how the Soviets will establish a secret Moon base as well as how they don't ever go to Venus (unless somehow that's kept quiet, too). There's still plenty of drama to play out (I loved Stasia's nerve-wracking space walk to the lunar module) but largely swings are pretty much kaput. That said, I'm curious to see how the Chief Scientist manages the development of the Moon base while planning his secret project and how he'll manage to stay in good graces (and alive) once that project ultimately fails.

Too early to tell where the story of Anastasia goes but could they be the parents of Leonid Polivanov, the cosmonaut and governor of Happy Valley in Mankind?

That certainly is the implication but several people had a different theory based on certain scenes in season five: That Irina is Lenya's mother.

I won't mention it here because spoilers but i think a big event upcoming in Star City was mentioned in FAM so we may know how it turned out.

Yeah, Irina referenced Star City a couple of times in season five...but my cursed memory has already forgotten the details. Although I think one of those references was how Lenya knew Irina in Star City during his cosmonaut days, which is obviously much later on.

 

[XCV330]

It’s a good show, but I really don’t like dark pessimistic stuff as much as I once did, which was the reason I like FAM. There isn’t a single character in this show so far I give a damn about besides Nikulov and unfortunately we know he’s got decades of misery and death ahead of him. It’s a joyless premise to start off with. If I want to see oppressed brainwashed people living in an oppressed regime I can just walk around town, now.

 

[trash80]

Yeah, Irina referenced Star City a couple of times in season five...but my cursed memory has already forgotten the details. Although I think one of those references was how Lenya knew Irina in Star City during his cosmonaut days, which is obviously much later on.

No this is something mentioned in S1 of FAM, anyway we'll see what happens.

I wonder if the Venus mission does actually take place.