Something I just realized about Lieutenant Nilsson

[Nerys Myk]

Yeah the whole thing doesn’t make sense. If she was Lt. Commander, she’s an officer, and if she’s ranking officer she would take over the bridge when she’s senior officer on the bridge, whether she’s “command” certified or not. But it was a good episode, so that’s fine.

I don't think it works that way in real life.

 

[fireproof78]

I don't think it works that way in real life.

I am by no means an expert nor did I serve in the armed forces. I did a brief review of US Naval Regulations to get a sense and there is a distinction between a line officer and a staff officer. Unrestricted Line officers are eligible to move up the chain as the event requires it, while restricted line and staff officers are limited in their ability to command within their specialty or specific corps. They are not eligible to move up the chain of command of a combat vessel unless designated by the captain or the executive officer. Once done so then they are eligible in the chain of command.

That's my layman's understanding of it.

 

[Blue Squadron]

There have been many attempts to directly equate Starfleet to the US Navy on lots of levels. The potential flaw in this is the rather broad assumption that Starfleet works in the same way as the US Navy. That was always a problematic assumption even when Starfleet was only a couple of hundred years away from us, given the assimilation of different cultures and from many planets and species -- and now they're over a millennium away from us. It's already been established that service branch / department is not necessarily a bar to command duties, providing an officer holds the relevant qualifications.

 

[The Wormhole]

Yeah the whole thing doesn’t make sense. If she was Lt. Commander, she’s an officer, and if she’s ranking officer she would take over the bridge when she’s senior officer on the bridge, whether she’s “command” certified or not. But it was a good episode, so that’s fine.

I don't think it works that way in real life.

It doesn't even work like that in Star Trek, otherwise Geordi would have been required to turn command over to Lt. Commander Logan in Arsenal of Freedom.

 

[fireproof78]

There have been many attempts to directly equate Starfleet to the US Navy on lots of levels. The potential flaw in this is the rather broad assumption that Starfleet works in the same way as the US Navy. That was always a problematic assumption even when Starfleet was only a couple of hundred years away from us, given the assimilation of different cultures and from many planets and species -- and now they're over a millennium away from us. It's already been established that service branch / department is not necessarily a bar to command duties, providing an officer holds the relevant qualifications.

True enough and obviously a one to one comparison is not completely accurate. I was more countering the assumption that because of this rank it automatically means someone can take command. But, Star Trek has always assumed a more simplistic version so it may just be that simple.

 

[Blue Squadron]

I was more countering the assumption that because of this rank it automatically means someone can take command.

Indeed! And we have seen that happen too. The biggest problem, of course, is that the "regs" (such as they are...) are entirely at the mercy of whatever device the writers and producers want to use in order to tell a particular story.

Trek is riven with such holes. Sometimes they're really pretty good with internal continuity, sometimes they appear not to care at all. There are occasions when no amount of mental gymnastics or convoluted fan-wank explanations and retcons will explain the inconsistencies. Sometimes you just have to ignore it and move on...!

 

[Nerys Myk]

Trek is riven with such holes.

 

[Blue Squadron]

Yep, that pretty much sums it up...!!

 

[mattman8907]

I do hope she does become First officer. She seems like she would do a good job.

 

[cultcross]

Detmer is likely command division

Detmer wears bronze, so she's engineering division. Helm is also seen wearing engineering colours in the TWOK era, so it seems to be an area which swaps in and out of different divisions over time.

There have been many attempts to directly equate Starfleet to the US Navy on lots of levels. The potential flaw in this is the rather broad assumption that Starfleet works in the same way as the US Navy. That was always a problematic assumption even when Starfleet was only a couple of hundred years away from us, given the assimilation of different cultures and from many planets and species -- and now they're over a millennium away from us. It's already been established that service branch / department is not necessarily a bar to command duties, providing an officer holds the relevant qualifications.

Agreed. While the US Navy clearly provides a template, we have tried too hard at times to line things up perfectly. There are numerous places where they don't overlap exactly and it seems odd when some insist the US Navy reality must take precedence over what we've actually seen happen in the show (like that debate the other day about length of time spent in one post). In this case though, I think that the comparison to real life is valid, and Trek has mirrored the idea of officers who are high ranked but not in the chain of command. Crusher is a good example, she is equal rank to Riker throughout, but we only see her in Command much later on when she's done the Bridge Officer test. We've also seen the opposite where "bridge officers" (like Lt j.g. LaForge or Ensign Kim) are given the Bridge over higher ranked alternatives.

 

[Jinn]

Detmer wears bronze, so she's engineering division.

I'm slightly embarrassed to say, that after three years I only just noticed that there's a bronze uniform. I just thought it was gold

 

[cultcross]

I'm slightly embarrassed to say, that after three years I only just noticed that there's a bronze uniform. I just thought it was gold

The bronze and gold are not well distinguished, especially on screen, so you are not entirely to blame for that. Compared to the red/blue/yellow or the white/green/grey/yellow/red of other uniform incarnations, the Discovery color scheme is not very obvious.

 

[Timo]

On the other hand, it's pretty close to the scheme used in the TOS pilot episodes, just with blue replaced by silver when the base color is already a shade of blue... Which is cute enough.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[ananta]

Linus for first officer! Only way to redeem my 2020.

 

[Markonian]

Linus for first officer! Only way to redeem my 2020.

As somebody said in another thread, I'd be great to have two alien-looking officers covering the ship's top positions.

Plus, if the relationship between Linus and Philippa reaches Jadzia/Worf levels of fleshing out, there's plenty of story potential for drama (steadfast XO dealing with rogue agent).

 

[Campe]

Linus for first officer! Only way to redeem my 2020.

Potentially the best thing to happen in Star Trek ever!

#Linus4XO2020

 

[Blue Squadron]

Detmer wears bronze, so she's engineering division. Helm is also seen wearing engineering colours in the TWOK era, so it seems to be an area which swaps in and out of different divisions over time.


Agreed. While the US Navy clearly provides a template, we have tried too hard at times to line things up perfectly. There are numerous places where they don't overlap exactly and it seems odd when some insist the US Navy reality must take precedence over what we've actually seen happen in the show (like that debate the other day about length of time spent in one post). In this case though, I think that the comparison to real life is valid, and Trek has mirrored the idea of officers who are high ranked but not in the chain of command. Crusher is a good example, she is equal rank to Riker throughout, but we only see her in Command much later on when she's done the Bridge Officer test. We've also seen the opposite where "bridge officers" (like Lt j.g. LaForge or Ensign Kim) are given the Bridge over higher ranked alternatives.

That was Tori. They made the point that Crusher was already command-rated and pulling shifts on the bridge.

 

[cultcross]

That was Tori. They made the point that Crusher was already command-rated and pulling shifts on the bridge.

I'm that episode yes, but that was into season 7 - my point is that we never saw Crusher as part of the command chain prior to Descent (by which point she'd clearly taken the test), but she'd been the same rank as Riker all along.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

I'm slightly embarrassed to say, that after three years I only just noticed that there's a bronze uniform. I just thought it was gold

You might need to adjust the contrast on your TV or monitor

 

[Styleset]

CHAINS OF COMMAND

TOS:
Captain Kirk
Commander Spock (Science Officer)
Lt. Commander Scott (Chief Engineer)
Lieutenant Sulu (Helmsman)

TNG:
Captain Picard
Commander Riker
Lt. Commander Data (Operations & Science Officer)
Lt. Commander LaForge (Chief Engineer)
Lt. Worf (Security and Tactical Officer)

DS9:
Captain Sisko
Colonel Kira (Bajoran Liaison Officer)
Lt. Commander Worf (Strategic Operations Officer & First Officer of Defiant)
Lt. Commander Dax (Science Officer)

VOY:
Captain Janeway
(Lt.?) Commander Chakotay
Lt. Commander Tuvok (Security and Tactical Officer)
Lieutenant Torres (Chief Engineer)
Lieutenant Paris (Helmsman)

ENT:
Captain Archer
Commander T'Pol (Science Officer)
Commander Tucker (Chief Engineer)
Lieutenant Reed (Security and Tactical Officer)

LOW:
Captain Freeman
Commander Ransom
Lieutenant Shaxs (Security and Tactical Officer)

DIS logical next first officers:
Commander Reno (Engineer)
Commander Nhan (Security) (Go back and get her: "We need you girl.")
A 32nd Century Officer
Lieutenant Nilsson (Spore Drive Ops) (promoted to at least Lt. CMDR)
Lieutenant Rhys (Tactical) (promoted to at least Lt. CMDR)

DIS less logical
ENSIGN Tilly (Spore Drive Assistant) (puling a Kelvin Timeline Kirk move. Please no. But, very likely)
Lt. Commander Stamets (Spore Drive navigator and creator) (just not the personality for it)
?Commander? Georgiou (deposed Emporer, Section 31 Agent, Engineer apparently) (never going to happen). She clearly doesn't see herself as apart of Starfleet.