So what's up with the black badges?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Dr. San Guinary, Oct 3, 2017.

  1. rhllot

    rhllot Captain Captain

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    section 31 obviously
     
  2. rhllot

    rhllot Captain Captain

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    section 31 wears black uniforms
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    wear black uniforms is more striking than black badges
     
  3. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Only if wearing black leather while stolling past the sunset is uncommon. Around where I live, not so much.

    ...Whether Section 31 exists in the Federation is still unclear. Sloane could still be but a madman, only we now know the specific sort of madman he is: one thinking he has revived the centuries-old cabal that once operated on Earth.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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  4. rhllot

    rhllot Captain Captain

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    we may think that what we saw in into the darkness is how section 31 really works. create experimental weapons have spaceships and secret bases
     
  5. rhllot

    rhllot Captain Captain

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    this!

    lorca is great
     
  6. rhllot

    rhllot Captain Captain

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    Starfleet Charter Article 14, Section 31 made allowances for bending Starfleet regulations in times of extraordinary threat.
     
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  7. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Admiral Admiral

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    That is their excuse to get away with what they're doing.

    They are not legal. It is said as much in DS9. They act alone, outside of everything.

    rhllot please learn to consolidate your posts into one post so you're not multi-posting.
     
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  8. rhllot

    rhllot Captain Captain

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    Admiral Ross works with them.
    the high command divert any investigation so that it can continue with their black ops.
    surely many of the things that the CIA does are illegal but none of us know it and the government protects them
     
  9. Boomer359

    Boomer359 Commodore Commodore

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    Seems like the key thing here is not so much the black badge, but the use of the black badge on the landing party vest. When we see regular officers use the vest on away missions, they wear it with the generic Starfleet command logo over a round background.

    Since the dude with the black badge was just wearing a black version of the standard departmental duty badge, it kind of makes me think that the vest is part of his regular uniform, which, in turn, seems to indicate that he plays primarily a combat role.

    Given that war is being treated as something new or novel on this show, it might simply be that these guys are just some provisional or newly formed branch or Federation marines.
     
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  10. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    (So, how real are these cons? One feigns ignorance at the person of Burnham, but all make statements about how Starfleet ought to be and what Starfleet ought to look like, astute ones at that. They apparently only start talking to Burnham minutes before the abduction, on a supposedly long ride. They are shepherded by a pilot who is dressed in spacewalk gear as if in anticipation of the scrubbing job, and who apparently disconnects her umbilical at the root as far as the computer can tell.

    Are they all plants to make Burnham's transition to the ship smoother - that is, rougher so that it feels more real?)

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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  11. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Section 31 is a criminal organization which uses an interpretation of the thirty-first section of the Starfleet Charter to rationalize and justify their actions and existence.

    Just read the novel Control. It does an excellent job of explaining everything.
     
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  12. Arpy

    Arpy Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I doubt Lorca would have murdered the prisoners. They didn't need to be on the ship at all. Once on the ship, none of them nor Burnham needed to see the guards advertising a possible secret organization. If they saw 31, they would have to die, as would near the entire crew. If they saw Starfleet Security units there to secure black alert protocols, then everybody lives. Saru seemed to sense death coming despite Burnham and the prisoners leaving, not knowing that she's on board, and put the thought away. He didn't suspect the prisoners were to be killed.

    This is not the Terran Empire, nor Section 31. They can keep their black hats. These guys are more complex. We don't know what the hell is going on, and I like it, gosh-darn it!
     
  13. cgervasi

    cgervasi Commander Red Shirt

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    Didn't they say in DS9 Section 31 was part of the original Federation Charter and it had been abandoned over the centuries and gone underground? I was under the impression at some point it was a major institution like the Federation Council. I imagined its lack of accountability led to corruption and scandals with people using the agency for their own gain. So the gov't abolished it. More conservative elements in the UFP gov't thought the Federation still needed a secret spy agency, so they helped take Section 31 underground.

    Maybe it was not yet underground by the time of DIS. Maybe the show will cover the events that led to it going underground.
     
  14. cgervasi

    cgervasi Commander Red Shirt

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    They could be working within Lorca's conspiracy. It seemed like they were testing her. Recall how security didn't respond immediately when they attacked her in the mess hall, as if they were watching a test of how she handled it.

    If they were just ordinary prisoners, there was no need to put them on the shuttle for this bogus transfer. They could have just said they were transferring Burnham.
     
  15. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    No, Sloan claimed the Section derived its authority from the original Starfleet Charter. At that time, we were justified in thinking he meant the UFP Starfleet Charter, but ENT then set that record straight and established that Section 31 was around before there was any UFP, and derived its authority from the United Earth Starfleet Charter instead.

    This doesn't make them a "major institution" or anything. All sorts of two-bit outfits pompously derive their authority from the Second Amendment, without this meaning that they actually have any authority.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  16. mattyhugh

    mattyhugh Commander Red Shirt

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    I read that scene as Saru sensed a threat as Burnam wasn't on the shuttle, considering their chat outside the ready room, but you're probably right.
     
  17. XCV330

    XCV330 Premium Member

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    I really doubt they are some Section 31 identifier. The few times anyone from that organization has been shown they were in plainclothes or in just dressed in a dark uniform without identifiers. Uniforms change all the time in Starfleet, but 31 seems to keep its aesthetic for a couple of hundred years, at least.

    The black badge just might be a specific identifier for elements of this particular mission, since it is clearly special.
     
  18. Boomer359

    Boomer359 Commodore Commodore

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    I think the bald guy was probably just an ordinary prisoner. He didn't know who Burnham was until the other dude told him, was the one who remarked on the black badges, and was the only one who didn't participate in the fight in the mess hall.
     
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  19. DigificWriter

    DigificWriter Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Nope.

    This notion of Section 31 being involved in DSC is conjecture that somebody pulled out of their butt and that other people decided to run with.
     
  20. The HorrOrville

    The HorrOrville Admiral Admiral

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    Of course it is conjecture but that doesn't mean it isn't true? If your creating a mystery then it means you want people thinking of the various possibilities and then one of them will usually end up being true or close to the truth. Until we get the answer anything is possible and Section 31 seems like a sound possibility so i'm not sure why that would be the same as pulling it out of their butt.

    Jason