So I started watching "Babylon 5" for the first time.

[Guy Gardener]

Very important thing about Crusade... The episodes were aired on tv out of order, which means the DVD episodes are out of order. The easiest way to notice that this is happening is when unexpectedly the crews uniforms change, a couple episodes later a designer comes aboard saying that they need new more media friendly uniforms, and then the next episode they're back to their old uniforms.

Wiikipedia will give you the correct viewing order, or you can just steam through becuase you're smart enough to remember everything in the right order even if you watch it in the wrong order.

 

[Tulin]

A big bummer about Ivanona, I can understand her charicters motivations for wanting to leave, "I should've boffed him at least once!" but still it's sad she will no longer be a part of the cast.

Keep watching.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Was he waiting for someone special and marriage, or just someone special?

Virgins can usually out wait the shit out of someone with normal expectations of sexual regularity.

Although it had been three and half seasons since she boffed Talia.

Ivonova was almost a born-again virgin if you don't count the human-style-sex.

 

[Technobuilder]

I'm not sure what to think of the "Flowy Blonde Hair" Telepath Guy, Everytime I see him, A Whitesnake song starts playing in my head....

Yeah, Byron. I can see what they were trying to do, but the character just came off as pretentious and annoying.

So, what order should I watch the movies? I am going to watch all of them after season 5, regardless if some suck or not.

Well, at this point, you could watch "In the Beginning" (it aired before Season 5) and "Thirdspace" (which takes place during season 4).


"The River of Souls" takes place in 2263, two years after season 5. "The Legend of the Rangers" takes place three years after the end of season 5.

"A Call to Arms," if you're interested, is probably best watched right before delving into Crusade, with "A Call to Arms" taking place in 2267.

"Voices in the Wilderness" was the last produced and takes place in 2271.

What are you talking about? I've never heard of this.

Update: OH! you meant Babylon 5: The Lost Tales - Voices In the Dark (Over Here/Over There)

 

[shivkala]

I'm not sure what to think of the "Flowy Blonde Hair" Telepath Guy, Everytime I see him, A Whitesnake song starts playing in my head....

Yeah, Byron. I can see what they were trying to do, but the character just came off as pretentious and annoying.

So, what order should I watch the movies? I am going to watch all of them after season 5, regardless if some suck or not.

Well, at this point, you could watch "In the Beginning" (it aired before Season 5) and "Thirdspace" (which takes place during season 4).


"The River of Souls" takes place in 2263, two years after season 5. "The Legend of the Rangers" takes place three years after the end of season 5.

"A Call to Arms," if you're interested, is probably best watched right before delving into Crusade, with "A Call to Arms" taking place in 2267.

"Voices in the Wilderness" was the last produced and takes place in 2271.

What are you talking about? I've never heard of this.

Update: OH! you meant Babylon 5: The Lost Tales - Voices In the Dark (Over Here/Over There)

Sorry about that! I mixed up "Voices in the Dark" with the season 1 two-parter, "A Voice in the Wilderness."

 

[Forbin]

If Ivanova commanded the station, sorry "captained" (last commander my ass.) Byron would have walked up to her, made his request, immediately noticed that she was a telepath, she would have punched him for probing and he would have pursued her as part of his half dressed harem.

Was Byron "married" to everyone (boys included) or were they just fuck###?

Spoiler: is everybody finished yet?

Because Lyta took her shirt off and joined an orgy of nobody strangers fine, but would she let her puppies breathe if she was expected to do some girl on girl with Susan before she could get to the main event with that hippy tosser poser fuck Byron?

Which means that Byron may never have found out that the Vorlons created telepahs if he thought Ivonova's political capital would get him where he needed to go rather than Lyta's raw power.

After crossing Susan, I don't think that he would have had the chance to commit suicide because Captain Ivanona would have keel hauled him off the back of 250 million tons of spinning metal all alone in the night.

Re: Lyta taking her shirt off. In Pat Tallman's book she says her reaction to jms when she read the script was "I'm 40 years old and just had a baby. NOW you want to see my boobs!?!?"

 

[Tulin]

This article goes in to the reasons for why Claudia left the show.

http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/misc/cc-leave.html

And I was at that convention in Blackpool, it had virtually ever single main cast member from the first seasons (only the actor who played Keffer wasn't there from memory) and several behind the scenes people. A long hectic 4 days

Was that the Wolf 459(or something)con?

A friend of mine once had the video of that - I should have copied it - it was FUCKING AMAZING!!!!!!

There was a bit where the crowd were cheering for Bruce and Mira to kiss - God that tape was AWESOME!!!!

 

[Technobuilder]

Yeah, Byron. I can see what they were trying to do, but the character just came off as pretentious and annoying.

Well, at this point, you could watch "In the Beginning" (it aired before Season 5) and "Thirdspace" (which takes place during season 4).


"The River of Souls" takes place in 2263, two years after season 5. "The Legend of the Rangers" takes place three years after the end of season 5.

"A Call to Arms," if you're interested, is probably best watched right before delving into Crusade, with "A Call to Arms" taking place in 2267.

"Voices in the Wilderness" was the last produced and takes place in 2271.

What are you talking about? I've never heard of this.

Update: OH! you meant Babylon 5: The Lost Tales - Voices In the Dark (Over Here/Over There)

Sorry about that! I mixed up "Voices in the Dark" with the season 1 two-parter, "A Voice in the Wilderness."

No Worries, Just got me confused for about 15 min before I figured it out on my own.

If Ivanova commanded the station, sorry "captained" (last commander my ass.) Byron would have walked up to her, made his request, immediately noticed that she was a telepath, she would have punched him for probing and he would have pursued her as part of his half dressed harem.

Was Byron "married" to everyone (boys included) or were they just fuck###?

Spoiler: is everybody finished yet?

Because Lyta took her shirt off and joined an orgy of nobody strangers fine, but would she let her puppies breathe if she was expected to do some girl on girl with Susan before she could get to the main event with that hippy tosser poser fuck Byron?

Which means that Byron may never have found out that the Vorlons created telepahs if he thought Ivonova's political capital would get him where he needed to go rather than Lyta's raw power.

After crossing Susan, I don't think that he would have had the chance to commit suicide because Captain Ivanona would have keel hauled him off the back of 250 million tons of spinning metal all alone in the night.

Re: Lyta taking her shirt off. In Pat Tallman's book she says her reaction to jms when she read the script was "I'm 40 years old and just had a baby. NOW you want to see my boobs!?!?"

Heh, and eventually he got to do just that!

This article goes in to the reasons for why Claudia left the show.

http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/misc/cc-leave.html

And I was at that convention in Blackpool, it had virtually ever single main cast member from the first seasons (only the actor who played Keffer wasn't there from memory) and several behind the scenes people. A long hectic 4 days

Was that the Wolf 459(or something)con?

A friend of mine once had the video of that - I should have copied it - it was FUCKING AMAZING!!!!!!

There was a bit where the crowd were cheering for Bruce and Mira to kiss - God that tape was AWESOME!!!!

Man, I'd love to see that. If only more people would post old con footage on YouTube.

 

[Forbin]

Inidentally, VERY often the cast still gets together for dinner or a picnic or something. Pat and Claudia are always posting pics on Facebook of them carrying on.

 

[GalaxyX]

I just finished a month long rewatch of Babylon 5, and again, was reminded of why I think it's the second best sci-fi universe out there (behind Star Trek, of course).

That said, I really don't understand why people compare Babylon 5 to Battlestar Galactica (RDM version), considering that B5 outclasses that mess in every way imaginable. Hell, it's even better than the 1978 version, a show I love quite a bit.

I agree with the others here. Stick with it. You'll love it.

Yup, I agree. B5 had it's downs (I cannot stand D'elenn for one, and the whole thing about Garibaldi and Daffy Duck was clearly some shameless WB self promotion, like "Hey look this series is produced by Warner Brothers, a Time Warner company!!" Dear God, fuck, it always took me out of the story!)

But there was a lot to like. I love the Vorlons, and I liked how these major races were not just some actor with a bumpy forehead, as Trek would have done it.

TOS BSG was a hokey show but it had heart and a tongue-in-cheek quality to it, where the show knew not to take itself seriously. It's enjoyable if you know what to expect from it.

nuBSG was the story about a bunch of humans whose first thought was "wow, we were almost wiped out, let's all have non stop aggressive sex! lots and lots of sex!" and when it wasn't about that, it was horribly depressing, and just became nonsensical the last season.

I might watch B5 again, if only to see the look on D'elenn's face when Sheridan's old wife shows up and says "I'm looking for my husband, John Sheridan". The look on her face makes the series for me.

 

[Jan]

... and the whole thing about Garibaldi and Daffy Duck was clearly some shameless WB self promotion, like "Hey look this series is produced by Warner Brothers, a Time Warner company!!" Dear God, fuck, it always took me out of the story!)

Nope, not at all. JMS had some difficulty getting permission to use as much of the cartoons as they did. And while the first instance with Delenn might have just been all in fun, there's another where Daffy is getting erased which ties in nicely with what was actually happening with Garibaldi at the time.

Jan

 

[Forbin]

That said, I really don't understand why people compare Babylon 5 to Battlestar Galactica (RDM version), considering that B5 outclasses that mess in every way imaginable. Hell, it's even better than the 1978 version, a show I love quite a bit.

I think I read somewhere that B5 was one of the inspirations for NuBSG, so maybe that sparks the comparison.

 

[JoeD80]

... and the whole thing about Garibaldi and Daffy Duck was clearly some shameless WB self promotion, like "Hey look this series is produced by Warner Brothers, a Time Warner company!!" Dear God, fuck, it always took me out of the story!)

Nope, not at all. JMS had some difficulty getting permission to use as much of the cartoons as they did. And while the first instance with Delenn might have just been all in fun, there's another where Daffy is getting erased which ties in nicely with what was actually happening with Garibaldi at the time.

Jan

Yeah it was Joe's idea not WB's. He's the Daffy Duck fan.

 

[Marsden]

The Egyptian god of frustration.

 

[Stoo]

That scene with G'Kar trying to figure out the Daffy poster is one of my favourites. A great little example of somone from a very different culture trying to understand a part of our own, and his guess maybe isn't 100% wrong.

 

[Hound of UIster]

That said, I really don't understand why people compare Babylon 5 to Battlestar Galactica (RDM version), considering that B5 outclasses that mess in every way imaginable. Hell, it's even better than the 1978 version, a show I love quite a bit.

I think I read somewhere that B5 was one of the inspirations for NuBSG, so maybe that sparks the comparison.

I think NuBSG is more like Ron Moore's attempt at doing Voyager the way he wanted.

 

[Reverend]

That said, I really don't understand why people compare Babylon 5 to Battlestar Galactica (RDM version), considering that B5 outclasses that mess in every way imaginable. Hell, it's even better than the 1978 version, a show I love quite a bit.

I think I read somewhere that B5 was one of the inspirations for NuBSG, so maybe that sparks the comparison.

I think NuBSG is more like Ron Moore's attempt at doing Voyager the way he wanted.

The only thing Moore's BSG has in common with B5 (aside from the obvious genre tropes) is the serialised storytelling.
As far as I can recall, at no point did RDM claim to have a clear overall plan for the series...though he did say the Cylons had one. What that actually was in the end still rather eludes me.

Indeed I think he was consistently open about having only a vague notion of the end-point and no clear plan as to what should happen in the middle. I think I even recall him uploading mp3's of writer's room discussions where you can hear them pitch ideas for massive plot shifts in the coming season.

The unfortunate result of this is that they would often start off thread with no clue where they were going and repeatedly painted themselves into a corner. Had they done as JMS had done and plotted out the broad strokes and milestones alone the way (with appropriate trapdoors and leeway for better ideas) then the show would have been a *lot* more coherent.

That's not to say that JMS's approach is inherently superior. Indeed I'm pretty sure the only reason it succeeded where BSG would later fail is because JMS is a crazy person.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Did you not see the movie BSG The Plan?

It showed clearly that the Cylon had a plan.

But that early on, and continuously, it was screwed over well.

Their plan was bad.

Inorganic and flawed and inflexible and ruined and unusable after the briefest point past initial execution.

At one point in BSG The Plan, Dean Stockwell rolls his eyes says "Fuck this" and has sex with a whole bunch of Sixes and Eights for a couple days until he had emotionally recovered from the humans yet a-fucking-gain completely routing a plan with sheer luck that the Cylon had spent the last 50 years composing.

 

[Brolan]

I remember RDM saying one day they were having trouble with the story. One of the characters had to do something to follow their plan, but the character had developed in such a way that it seemed out-of-character. So they decided just to wing it and write to the characters. Then the writing came easier.

Of course it with no plan it was doomed to make no sense at the end; but what the hell.

 

[Reverend]

I did see "The Plan" but for the life of me I can't remember a single thing about it beyond a lot of cutsey "and Dean Stockwell was just off camera the whole time!" nonsense. Also tits.

Getting back to B5 though, this is where JMS's trapdoors came into play. He was smart enough to plan for the plan going wrong. So certain characters and roles could be switched around as needed, but the plot would still move forwards as intended. Just look at the telepath arc. Thanks to casting changes that thing got switched around twice!

To my mind, BSG's main flaw was a focus on style over substance and character over plot. Penny wise, pound foolish as they say.