Shouldn't have done that
- Thread starter Laura Cynthia Chambers
- Start date
Bringing back the dead hasn't been a problem for me to be honest. Killing Vaughn, however, was devastating. In fact, I wouldn't mind if they brought him back in true comic book fashion lol. I also don't think I would mind if an alternate or time displaced version of Tasha was brought into the fold. Yeah I know, it's sounds awful to a lot of you guys.
It was better then anything marvel producedThe Control thing does sound a bit like a rejected pitch for a Marvel event.
And I love the comics
I think I like Vaughns death, or at least the way it was done, but it was waaaaaaaaaay to soon and we need a lot of 2377-2381 DS9 stuff to fill in the gaps...
I wish more could have been done with T'lana.
Regarding the OP's question - I'm pretty much fine with all the TrekLit developments of show/film (filmed canon) characters.
For the most part, I love the developments \ changes \ revelations in TrekLit (irregardless of the characters' canon appearances), including those in Control, Destiny, etc. (What can I say, I'm a Mack fan
)
As far as general story/plot developments in the novels which I didn't particularly like or care for? There are some, though I freely admit that they are based mostly on personal preferences, rather than criticism on the writers' actual work..
For the most part, I love the developments \ changes \ revelations in TrekLit (irregardless of the characters' canon appearances), including those in Control, Destiny, etc. (What can I say, I'm a Mack fan
)As far as general story/plot developments in the novels which I didn't particularly like or care for? There are some, though I freely admit that they are based mostly on personal preferences, rather than criticism on the writers' actual work..
- Vaughn's death - I like him and feel he "deserved better"
- Janeway's resurrection (didn't mind her death in Before Dishonor, hence not mentioning her in the first sentence ) - even though Kirsten's overall VOY arc has been mostly good-to-great IMO
- The New DS9 and principal characters - considering the time gap since the "end" of the DS9 Relaunch (2377), it's understandable that things change and evolve. Personally though, I'm still having problems connecting to the new dynamic and characters (Blackmer, for one..)
You blame the books for something the show did almost 30 years ago?
I agree with you. This was a very uncharacteristic move for Kira and it did not ring true at all.
Mine would be what they did with Sisko. Letting him grow his hair back? No way. And putting him on a starship instead of on DS9, where he belongs? What an anticlimactic fate for such a man.
Okay a few here, to start.
- Spock and Saavik marrying just no! She is his adopted daughter whatever motivated this decision was just wrong.
- That Admiral Keneth Montgomery became recurring in the Voyager novels when he was a criminal who illegally detained and tortured innocent people! He should have been court-martialed, dishonourably discharged and imprisoned for the rest of his life.
- Killing Janeway in Before Dishonour
- Writing out Miranda Kadahota
- Vedek Kira, makes no sense, completely against character.
- Ro as Captain of DS9 by 2381, it’s far too early, she should have been XO to a newly promoted Rear Admiral Kira Nerys of Bajor sector.
- Sisko no longer the Emissary, just it’s part of him and something that makes him interesting in ways Picard, Janeway, Archer and Kirk aren’t.
- Worf/K’Ehylr thing in Coda was just out of character, he should have been focused more on Dax’s death as the last piece of Jadzia and Ezri being part of his House and therefore someone he considered family
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Hi @ThetaSigma ,
I know you've only been here a few months, so you might not be aware, but one of our long-standing tenets around TrekLit reviews is that is is perfectly OK to criticize the story or creative choices, but it is not OK to criticize the individual authors as people. IIRC, the "Spock and Saavik married" storyline was all mostly in the novels by Susan Shwartz and Joespha Sherman, and characterizing them as "sick creeps" is inappropriate.
Just a reminder that Saavik being Spock's "adopted daughter" was itself only from non-canon sources, and Ms. Shwartz and Ms. Sherman were under no obligation to follow that continuity in their own works.
Being opposed to the marriage as a story choice is certainly fine (there are, in fact, a number of people here who share your opinion, many for similar reasons to what you cite), but disparaging the authors and editors personally is not. Just wanted to bring this to your attention for the future. If you were to make a similar comment against an author who happened to be a member here, it would be eligible for a flaming infraction.
Apologies, I have removed the offending section.
What non-canon sources is that actually from, anyway? Because I don't think I've ever seen that. It confuses me to see people talking about it as if it's a given.
Some that come to mind for me:
-Vaughn's end. I didn't mind them killing off the character so much as how he went out. He went out with a whimper, and his end lingered. Granted, unfortunately, that happens in real life, but seemed like such a waste of a character, and then it got dragged out.
-Sisko after "Unity". I didn't like what happened with him in Rough Beasts. I read several more books with him commanding starships (New York and Robinson) and wasn't impressed with that either, in part because I felt the Robinson crew was bland.
-New DS9 crew. Outside of Ro being in command (which I liked), most of the other new DS9 characters were also bland. I would rather they stuck with ch'Thane and Tenmei.
-The time jump in DS9 books, which meant we didn't get a proper Ascendants War. Also wish we had gotten a proper Tzenkethi War novel.
-Sending Geordi back to the ENT-E after Indistinguishable from Magic instead of giving him another starship to command.
When I think about it, I lost a lot of interest in Trek lit. after the Destiny trilogy. I kept going until reading some of the Fall. I've finished a couple PIC novels and one DISCO, but I haven't mustered up enough interest to plow through the Coda trilogy.
-Vaughn's end. I didn't mind them killing off the character so much as how he went out. He went out with a whimper, and his end lingered. Granted, unfortunately, that happens in real life, but seemed like such a waste of a character, and then it got dragged out.
-Sisko after "Unity". I didn't like what happened with him in Rough Beasts. I read several more books with him commanding starships (New York and Robinson) and wasn't impressed with that either, in part because I felt the Robinson crew was bland.
-New DS9 crew. Outside of Ro being in command (which I liked), most of the other new DS9 characters were also bland. I would rather they stuck with ch'Thane and Tenmei.
-The time jump in DS9 books, which meant we didn't get a proper Ascendants War. Also wish we had gotten a proper Tzenkethi War novel.
-Sending Geordi back to the ENT-E after Indistinguishable from Magic instead of giving him another starship to command.
When I think about it, I lost a lot of interest in Trek lit. after the Destiny trilogy. I kept going until reading some of the Fall. I've finished a couple PIC novels and one DISCO, but I haven't mustered up enough interest to plow through the Coda trilogy.
I seem to recall that from somewhere myself but having a hard time placing it.
Though now that I think of it I'm starting to think maybe it was Sarek and Amanda that had taken in Saavik, not Spock. I believe it may have been one of the numbered original series novels back in the day.
I think that occured in the Marvel Untold Voyages comic (and maybe other places, but that's my association).
#49 The Pandora Principle is the novel I was thinking of. One good thing about having the hardcopies, LOL. I just kept looking through them all until I saw the one with Saavik on the cover and I remembered the novel I was thinking of. I'll take a quick scan through it to see if that's where the reference is or not.
EDIT: I reviewed some information. In this novel Spock took Saavik under his wing and taught and tutored her. Sarek and Amanda also helped. It's not specified that she became his adopted daughter per se from what I can tell. Just that Spock and his family took an interest in her and helped her learn Vulcan Ways, and Spock also was her mentor during her time at the Academy. It also goes with the backstory that Saavik was half-Romulan.
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No, Spock does not adopt Saavik in The Pandora Principle. He does take a year off to live with her and teach her to be civilized and all, but then he leaves her with an unidentified foster family. She is presented in the book as Spock's protegee, not his daughter.
There are several versions of the tale where Sarek and Amanda become her foster parents, but of course that's decades after he moved out. It doesn't make them siblings, any more than the Arrowverse's Barry Allen and Iris West, or the '70s bionic shows' Steve Austin and Jaime Sommers.
Yes, obviously, but that doesn't constitute a literal parent-child relationship in either a legal or a moral sense. And it doesn't mean there's anything wrong or creepy about them getting married 70-some years later when they're both very mature adults and the beginnings of their relationship are far, far in the past. It's essentially a different lifetime. Heck, for Spock it's literally a different lifetime, since he died and was reborn in the interim. The person Saavik marries in Vulcan's Glory (and implicitly has sex with in The Search for Spock) is technically not the same individual as the Spock who rescued and mentored her as a child, but a clone with most of his memories. Or at least some of them. It was never clear how much of his memory he actually recovered vs. how much he relearned from scratch.
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